Need quick assist with Rainsong PGA1000

[DavidE]

I'm taking a look at one this afternoon and know almost nothing about them. It's in excellent condition with the Fishman Prefix electronics and original case. Trying to get an idea of a reasonable price to start with.


From what I was able to find about this old model, the back and sides are laminated wood and the top is graphite. So, not really comparable to the current Rainsong models. I could not tell for sure if the neck is wood or graphite. Please let me know if you know.

Any reason to avoid these? Or to grab one while I can?

Thanks!

[mchalebk]

If you've never visited the carbon guitar forum at MacNichol.com, I would highly recommend it. it is the best place to go online for all things related to CF guitars.

One of the forum members there is a huge Rainsong fan and just picked up a P-GA1100. Here's a link to a thread he created to talk about it:

http://macnichol.com/forum-post/4417

[sonicland]

The neck is wood. Everything is traditional wood built except the top, which is made in their Woodinville WA factory. The top was then shipped to Korea, and the guitar was finished there. Street price was about $1000.

I had a 2005 model and liked it quite a bit, considering what I paid. I found it used (not a mark on it) and got if for $600 with the hardshell case. Unfortunately it sustained some serious damage and I had to dump it. It was definitely a well made quitar and would compare favorably to anything else in the $500 range. I wouldn't pay more than $500 unless it was mint, then I'd consider $600. As you may know, the $500-600 used acoustic market is awful crowded.

I now have a RainSong Hybrid (all carbon fiber) and the PGA1000 is not in the same league at all. I used to be angry that my PGA got damaged but I don't think I'd have gotten a Hybrid if it didn't so in a way I'm pleased it did (yes, I'm nuts).

[DavidE]

I decided to pass, even at $600. With a wood neck, the stability of a carbon fiber guitar is all but gone in my eyes. Like you said, decent guitar, but essentially a carbon top on a Korean acoustic with an older Fishman Prefix pickup. Decided to pass.

[guitararmy]

I used to own one. I was unimpressed with the sound--traded it for a Larrivee....

[Shogun]

I think you guys are missing the point and undervaluing this guitar. I have played hundreds of shows across a third of the country and i took my PGA-1000 in a tour van across the U.S. and Canada and it was an awesome performance guitar. My PGA-1000 is so well set up it plays more like an electric than an acoustic and in the couple years i have had it, i have NEVER needed to adjust anything-- and that includes 4 months of leaving it in a van all day long during the summer months with freezing temperatures in Canada at night and humidity ranging from the ocean to the desert. The graphite top has a great deal to do with its stability in relation to the neck and the back and sides don't matter if they are wood when the top is so stable and in fact probably add to the resonance.

I compared it to a number of ovation guitars for playing live and the PGA-1000 beat them all hands down for both acoustic sound, plugged in sound and playability. This guitar should be compared to guitars in the $1000 range. The newer Rainsongs are also great BUT they are more expensive. This is a way to get benefits of a carbon fiber guitar without paying over a grand. They are hard to find used now because people aren't selling them. You got a steal if you got it for much less than that.

[sonicland]

Originally Posted by Shogun

This is a way to get benefits of a carbon fiber guitar without paying over a grand.

My 2005 PGA-1000 was a very high quality guitar and was well worth the $600 I payed for it but I disagree that you "get the benefits of carbon fiber without paying over a grand". To me the biggest advantage of a carbon fiber guitar is that ALL the components are carbon fiber and none of them, particularly the neck as it's attached to the body, will react badly to heat, cold, or humidity. IMHO you get hardly any of the advantages of carbon fiber with the PGA-1000.

My PGA was my main gigging guitar for about 4 years and I really liked it, playability was extremely good and it was such a comfortable guitar, but I always knew the sound could be better because it still had a UST. My H-WS1100N2 with a K&K Mini is just in another league altogether.

[Shogun]

"will react badly to heat, cold, or humidity"

The main point of carbon fiber guitars is to be stable and consistent. The PGA-1000 DOES NOT REACT BADLY TO HEAT, COLD, OR HUMIDITY and is cheaper than the newer rainsongs. The whole reason Taylor guitars are touted as great new technology for acoustics is because they made the tops much more stable which means better playing, more consistent guitars. Well so did rainsong with the PGA-1000 but they used carbon fiber. The main issues with playability come down to the way the neck and the TOP of the guitar work together. If anyone finds a PGA-1000 for less than $800 please let me know because i will probably take it off your hands and resell it lol

[sonicland]

The carbon fiber top won't react badly but the rest of the guitar will. My point is that the top is not the only part at risk.

I lent mine to a trusted friend who ended up having to ask his mother to return it to me. She put in her trunk (in its hard shell case covered with a blanket) before work on a 95 degree day. After work she brought it to me and it most definitely reacted badly to the heat. Brought it to a repair tech who said it needed a neck reset but he wouldn't do it (for many reasons).

I definitely agree with you that they are excellent guitars and a very good value, mine was probably the finest $600 used guitar I've ever played. While they don't need to be humidified, they do require care that an all carbon fiber guitar doesn't and I think the carbon fiber benefits of this guitar are very minimal. Other than the top, it's just a laminated wood guitar that will react to the elements like any other laminate wood guitar.