New Taylor V-Class Bracing!

[Hotspur]

Andy Powers has certainly earned some benefit of the doubt, and I like the idea that Taylor isn't afraid to keep experimenting.

But I'm totally baffled as to how bracing could impact intonation. Like, I can't even come up with a plausible hypothesis as to how it''d help. Does anybody have the slightest idea?

[Filum]

The volume component is especially pronounced with increasingly popular smaller-bodied acoustic guitars that will now be able to rival the output of traditional dreadnought and jumbo shapes.

Always good to see some new things!

[dannyg1]

Originally Posted by Hotspur

Andy Powers has certainly earned some benefit of the doubt, and I like the idea that Taylor isn't afraid to keep experimenting.

But I'm totally baffled as to how bracing could impact intonation. Like, I can't even come up with a plausible hypothesis as to how it''d help. Does anybody have the slightest idea?

Possibly via extra stiffness in front of and behind the bridge, resulting in less of a twisted torque motion and leaving a razor flat top behind the soundhole to the end pin?

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by dannyg1

Possibly via extra stiffness in front of and behind the bridge, resulting in less of a twisted torque motion and leaving a razor flat top behind the soundhole to the end pin?

Exactly correct from what I can see. Good guess.

[Jeff Scott]

V-Class? Is this a Mercedes, or something?

[dannyg1]

Originally Posted by Jeff Scott

V-Class? Is this a Mercedes, or something?

It’s a Bose silly.

[dannyg1]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Exactly correct from what I can see. Good guess.

Just read a few things on the Taylor site that suggests the claimed intonation improvement is the product of a phasic relationship between the directional movement of the top versus the same via the strings. Here’s the direct quote:


Better Intonation
V-Class bracing makes the top more in tune with the vibrating strings. This eliminates much of the interference that causes some notes to waver and sound slightly out of tune. As a result, notes and chords played anywhere on the neck are more consistent and in tune with each other.

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by dannyg1

Just read a few things on the Taylor site that suggests the claimed intonation improvement is the product of a phasic relationship between the directional movement of the top versus the same via the strings. Here’s the direct quote:


Better Intonation
V-Class bracing makes the top more in tune with the vibrating strings. This eliminates much of the interference that causes some notes to waver and sound slightly out of tune. As a result, notes and chords played anywhere on the neck are more consistent and in tune with each other.

Wow. Just wow. They are marketing geniuses. Prove them wrong? How could you?

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Wow. Just wow. They are marketing geniuses. Prove them wrong? How could you?

Just brilliant. What a fabulous bunch of pseudo-scientific mumblespeak.

[dannyg1]

Originally Posted by eatswodo

Just brilliant. What a fabulous bunch of pseudo-scientific mumblespeak.

I’d be interested to hear what Charles Tauber has to say about this claim. Would be fun to see an FEM pattern set of it.

Here’s a primer on the applicable science:

https://www.hindawi.com/journals/aav/2016/6084230/

[FOG01]

Originally Posted by eatswodo

Just brilliant. What a fabulous bunch of pseudo-scientific mumblespeak.

And all this time I thought was my limited fretting skills at work...

[vindibona1]

I saw an article this afternoon, courtesy of Reverb. It will be interesting to see how the new V class guitars sound compared to their predecessors. Note that the 914 et al will still be called by the exactly the same model numbers, though the internal construction won't resemble past iterations. Doesn't surprise me as that's been Taylor's SOP all along. I wonder if the V Class is cheaper to build? That wouldn't surprise me either.

[Rmz76]

Originally Posted by jazzguy

Just saw this....
http://www.musicradar.com/news/namm-...coustic-design

From Taylor's FAQ


How is V-Class bracing different from other non-X-bracing patterns?

Each bracing pattern will have a different set of characteristics and is designed to achieve a different result. V-Class bracing was designed to remove the obstacles that interfere with a guitarist’s expression. Other patterns may achieve other goals, but V-Class bracing is the only design that resolves the tension between sustain and volume while also improving a guitar’s intonation.

How will I recognize a guitar with V-Class bracing when I hear it?
Different players will pick up on different aspects of the V-Class sound. Some will notice the sonic balance first; others will notice the volume, sustain or projection. Many will notice the sound of improved intonation and harmony between the notes, which is a characteristic that is significantly different than other designs.


How will a V-Class guitar sound amplified with the Expression System 2?
Because of the uniformity of the notes, the tone will amplify well. It’s a more usable sound. The amplified sound is consistent up the neck. There are no hot spots to contend with.

____________________

I realize tone is subjective and somewhat difficult to describe, but answers Taylor provides seem a bit confusing. To summarize their description "Our new V-bracing delivers a new balance between volume and sustain and more projection and fewer overtones".

Ok... So is that actually solving a problem with acoustic guitars that isn't solved today by some choose of body style, wood combination an existing bracing pattern? Or is this just something different to use as a marketing tool to proclaim innovation?

After listening to recorded audio samples of the few guitars that will feature this like the 914ce, my first impression is that I don't like the way these sound recorded. Now, perhaps in person they do deliver a much better experience. Video clips are limited in what they can convey, but when well produced they do give us an idea of how well an instrument sounds recorded and for some of us that is very important.

https://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/914ce

Listening to this "reimagined" 914ce there's an odd thin quality to the tone. It does seem to sustain longer, but the pleasant decay my ears are expecting isn't there and what I'm hearing that's replaced that sound I'm just not a fan of. There are fewer overtones, but of course those sparkling overtones on top of the clang are what many acoustic players love.

Not sure about this "innovation" from Taylor. Will be curious what those who get to play them at NAMM have to say. I hope dealers don't play it politically correct and are just brutally honest with their impressions. I realize this probably won't happen for a number of reasons, but one can hope.

[Kupuna50]

Looks like Taylor is trying to catch up with the competition.

[dannyg1]

I’ve just listened to that 914ce demo set of three short vids and what I noticed is that the guitar is very dynamic and also a bit on the treble clanging side but really unrefined sounding. So loud, bright but not in such a good way. Maybe it’ll sound better in a fingerpicking demo. It doesn’t ring out well as the harmonic character sounds kind of wrong.