Dabbling in the electric on a budget: let's talk gear

[TerryC]

Hello all,

This forum has shown itself to be great reservoir of knowledge in the past, so I thought I'd tap into it yet again as I contemplate getting myself an affordable electric to expand my guitar-playing horizons. Music styles will be predominantly blues and classic rock sorts of stuff.

Guitar:
Aesthetically, I'm drawn the classics: Les Pauls, teles, and strats. Are there any noteworthy advantages/disadvantages of either design that should factor into my decision-making? Because I'm looking to do this on a budget, I'm most interested in the more affordable models. That said, I don't want to buy a guitar that I'll be wanting to replace right away. For Fender, I've heard good things about the Squire classic vibe series -- how would you folks say they compare to something like an entry level MiM Fender? Likewise for the Les Paul, what am I gaining over an Epiphone LP standard pro (or comparable model) by moving up to a Gibson studio?

Amp:
I'll be playing exclusively in my little apartment, so considering I don't need volume, will I be content with just a smaller practice amp? What about built-in effects; the idea of not having to buy a horde of pedals to experiment with different sounds certainly carries a lot of appeal. Again, not looking to spend a lot, but also I'm wanting something that will sound good and not be begging for replacement right away. I know next to nothing about amps, so I'd love to hear some recommendations from you all.


All that said, is there anything else I should be aware of as I embark down this unfamiliar road? Any gear or pedals that could be considered essential?
Thanks in advance for your responses.

[wrathfuldeity]

There is alot of stuff on the used market these days. I'd recommend playing alot of gits and figuring what fits well in your hand, as far as scale length, nut width and etc. For amps...lots of small amps with digital built in effects, aux inputs and headphone out. Or go with an older modeller and with headphones and/or some small powered computer spkrs.

For example: Been using for a few years (50% of the time) a mia peavey predator (strat) and reactor (tele) with upgrades (p/u's, locking tuners, steel block) to my liking $150-200, an old vox tonelab $25 and some $30 akg 240 cans and $1 bose powered computer spkrs...the little rig works great for quiet and bedroom playing. The other times have tube amps, analog pedals and spkr cabs to rattle the house and disturb the hood.

[Alex W]

I'd recommend a telecaster as a good one to look at. Not sure how much you want to spend, but a used Fender Baja Telecaster will run about $550 and will be pretty similar to a 52 Reissue Telecaster. (Blonde finish, black pickguard, relatively thick neck, maple fingerboard.) For less $$ I would look at one of the Squier Classic Vibe models. They will have thinner necks so if you prefer thinner necks that's a plus. I have a Squier Classic Vibe bass and I think it's quite nice. I also own a Squier Jaguar and I like it a lot.

I have never been impressed with Gibson studio models. They seem pretty raggy to me with respect to fret work and overall fit and finish. They just don't seem to put a lot of love into those. I'm sure there are some great ones out there, but I haven't encountered very many. A higher end Epiphone will feel better and look better, but it may not have very high quality pots, pickups and switches. I have a nice Epiphone 56 Les Paul that I really like but I have tinkered with it, replaced its pickups etc.

[rwmct]

Another vote for a telecaster. Simple. Classic. Has been played by just about everybody at one time or another for just about every kind of music.

If I was watching my pennies I would buy a Squier Tele and put the rest of my money dough on a tube amp. There are quite a few low watt tube amps out there. Some are switchable to really low wattage (1 watt, say) (though tube amps can seem pretty loud even at low wattage). I just read good things about most models.

[Bob Womack]

I've written a couple of pages with descriptions of the various guitar types for those who are in the market. You can find them HERE and HERE.

Since Gibson began pleking their guitars their fret work has become rather good. You will have to decide which scale length and tonal palate you like. Those are very personal choices. Don't be swayed by the Telecaster mafia or Gibson lovers or any other faction. Educate yourself!

Bob

[FrankHudson]

If you can, playing a few may help you decide based on your personal criteria (which may evolve, no way to help that). And doing that can be fun too.

All he most popular models work for many players, that's how the got popular. They have differences, true, but we can't tell which ones are important to you. Even the less popular models have successful players.

Speaking generically, there's a lot to be said for a Telecaster, including many of the cheaper Squier models. A hugely practical design. They're dead simple. They seem to work well with a wide range of pickups. Are generally easy to setup and work on if something needs fixing, and can cover a whole lot of different sounds. But that's me. Plenty of folks feel different. I've been happier much more often with more inexpensive Telecaster pickups than I have been with inexpensive humbucker pickups.

In general, my strongly considered opinion is that there less bang for the additional dollar in electric guitars than there is acoustics. Which means inexpensive electrics can sound inspiring.

If you're unsure about your criteria, or can't try various electrics out for some reason, you could revert to less logical emotional criteria. Buy a guitar like the affordable model similar to the one someone that inspires you plays.

[Bob Womack]

And amps. For home play, the latest Fender Mustang series modeling amps would be a good start, teaching you a thing or two about tone. You can hook them up to your laptop and, using software, operate the various features and save presets they way you like 'em.

Bob

[TerryC]

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

I've written a couple of pages with descriptions of the various guitar types for those who are in the market. You can find them HERE and HERE.
Bob

While they didn't sway me to one style of guitar over another, those articles were exactly what I needed to read to establish some foundational knowledge to begin the audition process. Concise, yet highly informative -- kudos. I'll hopefully have a change to try some guitars tomorrow, so I'll likely have a better idea of my personal preferences.

Thanks to everyone who's replied so far!

[JeffreyAK]

Another vote for, go check out some gear and see what you like. You mention Les Pauls, Strats and Teles, but they're pretty different beasts suiting different people, and there are LOTS of other guitars out there that may suit you much better than any of the Big Three. Amps are even harder, lots of options depending on what kind of sound you want.

[imwjl]

Check out the very loved Yamaha THR amps for you apartment life. They're not bargains but sure are wonderful as far as a quality experience desktop and table top amp. Most popular forums have a lot of talk about them.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by TerryC

...getting myself an affordable electric to expand my guitar-playing horizons. Music styles will be predominantly blues and classic rock sorts of stuff.

Guitar:
Aesthetically, I'm drawn the classics: Les Pauls, Teles, and Strats. Are there any noteworthy advantages/disadvantages of either design that should factor into my decision-making? Because I'm looking to do this on a budget, I'm most interested in the more affordable models. That said, I don't want to buy a guitar that I'll be wanting to replace right away. For Fender, I've heard good things about the Squire Classic Vibe series - how would you folks say they compare to something like an entry level MIM Fender? Likewise for the Les Paul, what am I gaining over an Epiphone LP Standard Pro (or comparable model) by moving up to a Gibson Studio?

Amp:
I'll be playing exclusively in my little apartment, so considering I don't need volume, will I be content with just a smaller practice amp? What about built-in effects; the idea of not having to buy a horde of pedals to experiment with different sounds certainly carries a lot of appeal. Again, not looking to spend a lot, but also I'm wanting something that will sound good and not be begging for replacement right away. I know next to nothing about amps, so I'd love to hear some recommendations from you all...

My tuppence worth:

Guitar:
Spend a few extra bucks - while there are good individual examples of the Squier CV and Epiphone instruments you cite, IME you're going to find greater consistency in the higher-priced models, along with better fit/finish/components. If it's gotta be a Strat/Tele/LP/SG I'd look at the better MIM Fenders and Gibson Studio models - similarly priced (the Gibsons are slightly more expensive), arguably the best values in their respective lineups, and readily available new for under $1K if you take advantage of any one of a number of coupon sales at your friendly local big-box store/online dealer; FYI the PRS SE models are also highly respected in this price range, and one of the better deals in a Working Joe/Jane's solidbody. If you've ruled out semi-hollow/hollowbody instruments as too expensive, I'd strongly recommend taking a good look at the Korean-made Gretsch 5400/5600 Series; while "That Great Gretsch Sound" isn't for everyone - if you're really intent on creating your own signature tone I wouldn't consider it a deterrent - I can say as a Gretsch owner since 1964 that the QC/tone/playability is fully comparable to the far higher-priced MIJ Professional Series, in many cases exceeds the vintage Brooklyn originals, and at under $1K you're not likely to find more guitar for your money in a semi-/full-hollow instrument...

Amp:
Since by your own admission you have no experience with amps but want good tone in something you won't outgrow (or will become obsolete), I'll point you in the same direction that my fellow graduates of the Discovery Academy of Electric Guitar Tone (summa cum loudly Class of 1966 here) have taken since day one: score a lower-powered tube amp (<25W) with a minimum of controls, plug in, fire up, twist the dials until you find something you like, write it down so you remember how to get it next time - and count on playing out sooner than later. Simply put, as a newbie you don't need the complexities introduced by current modeling rigs - just about all of which seek to emulate the tones produced by a tube amp of one kind or another anyway; while the "bedroom" tube amps (<10W) can be very impressive, and are useful tools for many experienced electric players (I own a Bugera V5 myself), as a "one-&-only" I'd go for the additional clean power and headroom that'll allow you to play in both practice and performance settings. As far as effects are concerned I wouldn't bother with them right now, focusing instead on achieving your fundamental tone with just guitar-cable-amp; there's an apocryphal story that when Dhani Harrison showed an interest in learning guitar, George restricted him to a Strat, tweed Bassman, and cable - and I'd be inclined to think Dad knew a little bit about rock guitar tone. Although my personal fave (as well as several other satisfied owners on the Electric subforum) is the Bugera V22 - a full-featured 1x12" combo that can be had for well under $400 with some judicious shopping - if you're looking to go rock-bottom pricewise the TDPRI guys/gals have a lot of love for these $200 tone boxes, both straight-up and as mod platforms:

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_...n=q2_2016_test

[1neeto]

When it comes to electric guitars, it truly depends on what tone you’re trying achieve. Strat or Les Paul are equally iconic, you’ll find many greats that play either or. Continue reading at your own risk, I might go on a tangent here. [emoji23]

Les Paul’s are mostly known for their chunky tone thanks for their humbucker pickups. They also have individual tone and volume pots for each pickup which can be quite versatile in live situations. Some also come with split coil feature which splits the ‘buckers so they sound like single coils (kinda, you’ll never get a true single coil tone out of a split humbucker). Also the Les Paul has a shorter scale, makes it easier to play on the lower frets, but things can feel a bit crowded after the 15th or so. Also shorter scale is friendlier to higher gauge strings. And the set neck along with the angled headstock helps with sustain (rumor goes that Nigel’s Les Paul is still sustaining today).

But of course there’s drawbacks. Les Pauls are heavy. Big solid mahogany body with a carved maple cap can make a Les Paul weigh as much as over 12 pounds. The angled headstock supposedly helps with sustain and tuning stability, but they’re fragile, just google broken Les Paul headstock for some cringe-worthy pics. The big body might feel uncomfortable to some, and even though the neck is set, upper fret access is not that easy. And last but not least, a “proper” Les Paul will set you back over $2000. A Studio model will give you the Gibson logo on the headstock for about $1200, but that’s still a good chunk of cash. Anything under $1000 and you’ll have to settle for an Epiphone.

Strats on the other hand are known for their bright and sparkly single coil pickups, yeah some have humbuckers, but I’ll concentrate in the classic triple single coil model. The 3 single coil pickups with its 5-way switch makes it very versatile tone wise. Although they only have a master volume pot, they do have separate tone pots for the middle and neck pickup. The bridge pickup is usually only potted to the master volume, it is also slanted so it picks up the higher strings closer to the bridge, and the lower strings a bit more away from the bridge. Regardless of this, that bridge pickup is very bright and thin sounding, which is why most modern music rarely use it, or use it combined with the middle pickup for that out of phase tone only a 3-single coil Strat can provide. But IMO, the best tones out of a Strat come from the neck pickup. Also just like how a Les Paul with a split humbucker will never sound like a single coil Strat, a Strat with humbuckers will never sound like a Les Paul. The scale on a Strat is considerably longer than a Les Paul at 25.5”. The longer scale makes it great for lighter gauge strings, you can try and mimic SRV and put 13’s on a Strat, but anything over 10’s will have some tension that will get in the way of those Gilmour bends you might try. The longer scale makes the lower frets a bit more spaced apart than you might be used to, but the higher frets are a bit more spaced apart than a Les Paul, which makes it a bit easier to play up there. Also the neck of a Strat is bolted on, in theory that kills sustain, but really the neck joint is just a small element on the whole sustain thing. The bolted on neck makes upper fret access a bit awkward, but it’s still easier to get to those high frets than a Les Paul. And the Strat is very comfortable to play. The bolted on neck also adds to its versatility. Neck snapped? No big deal, replacement necks are inexpensive. And they’re light and very comfortable to play with all the contours on the body. That guitar easily becomes part of you. And best is the price. For $600 you can get a MIM Strat with the Fender logo. $1100 buys you a made in USA model. $350 buys you a Chinese-made Squier that may rival MIM and MIA in craftsmanship, but will suffer in hardware and electronics.

The bad? Again the long scale can be a deterrent to some. Also the radius is typically 9 degrees, with vintage style necks as curvy as 7 degrees. 12 degree are easily available too, and might feel a bit more at home for acoustic players. The floating tremolo is tricky to set up so it stays in tune, and the in line tuning keys might be almost confusing for those who are used to the 3 and 3 configuration.

Ok that was a lot but I’m not done lol! Practice amp? I think it’s hard to look past the Fender Mustang line. $110 or so buys you a mustang 1 and they’re loud and versatile enough for bedroom use.

Hope this helps!

[paulp1960]

I bought my Squier Classic Vibe 50s Telecaster from Ebay for £250. Here in the UK they sell new for around £430.

My example is in perfect condition and is a really nice playing and sounding guitar. I also have a Squier Vintage Modified Tele Special which is a Telecaster body and bridge mated with a Jazzmaster neck and neck pickup. Also a nice guitar and I probably prefer the neck on that one.

I would never advise anybody starting out to spend too much money at first because you don't really know what you want until you have lived with a few guitars.

Telecasters can be heavy as well as Les Pauls.

I reckon a Stratocaster with a humbucker bridge pickup is very versatile.

[Wasper]

Hi,

I would say don't forget to look into some Ibanez electric guitars. I find that when in the same price range as , say a Squier, they generally have better hardware on them (bridges, tuners, knobs...).

Take for example the Talman series. They have several models that have Tele or Strat type pickup arrangements. They hardware is better than the Squier equivalents (I know, I compared side by side) and I thought they were more comfortable in the hand. I also thought the offset body was pleasing to the eye. I went out looking to by a strat or tele in the price range you are looking at and came home with a Talman instead. So, try to keep an eye out, they might tickle your fancy as well.

Keep in mind that there are two series, the standard and the prestige. The prestige is goin g to be japan made and cost about $1200, but the standard only costs $350 to $400 (Squier classic vibe money).

http://www.ibanez.com/products/u_eg_...es_id=37&pre=0

(I bought the Semi-hollow tele type from above.I do beleive it was a limited run for that one though, as it is no longer available).


As for the Amp.

I think that for the money, you can't do better than the Fender Mustang I V.2 20W for $119. It has a bunch of presets already programed in and it is easy to adjust and save new sounds. Switch between the saved setups without have to adjust any knobs. It sounds really good and sounds even better when using a good set of headphones for quiet practice.

https://shop.fender.com/en-US/guitar...300100000.html

[Bob Womack]

Originally Posted by TerryC

While they didn't sway me to one style of guitar over another, those articles were exactly what I needed to read to establish some foundational knowledge to begin the audition process. Concise, yet highly informative -- kudos. I'll hopefully have a change to try some guitars tomorrow, so I'll likely have a better idea of my personal preferences.

Thanks to everyone who's replied so far!

That's exactly what they were designed for and I'm glad they were useful! I have electrics in three scales and with all sorts of pickups because I use them in recording sessions. It's all about what kind of sound and feel you want or need.


A typical session seven years ago with both ends of the scale. All they have in common is the color!

Bob