Guitar to live in the car?

[seekingcarbon]

Hi All,

First up, I've been lurking for a while and want to thank you all for the wealth of info available on here. I live in France and there are no carbon fiber dealers anywhere near me to be able to test guitars, so reading/seeing/hearing your experiences helps greatly.

Essentially, after years of tinkering occasionally with a classical guitar, I've decided to give myself a kick up the bum and really get to grips with guitar playing, putting in the required time and effort. One of my biggest obstacles is lack of free time to practise regularly, particularly due to my work schedule of long hours with early mornings and late nights. So, I thought about using my enforced lunchbreak at work as a time to do my “30 min a day” of practice down in the car. I started reading about smallish, take-anywhere guitars and in so doing I landed up in this subforum!

It seems that a carbon fiber guitar is the way forward, since it would have to live in the car through all sorts of conditions (I live near the Alps in France, so plenty of heat in summer, plenty of snow and cold in winter). Since I really am no more than a beginner on guitar either, I'm also reluctant to part with 1000s of $$ right at the beginning.

After extensive reading, it seems like the Klos is at the best pricepoint, but it's not fully carbon so am not sure how it would react to a permanent life in the car boot? That being the case, the Journey OF660 then seems to be the guitar that fits the most boxes practically. From Youtube videos etc, the looks and sound of the OF660 don't match up to a Rainsong/Emerald/ Blackbird, but then again it is among the cheapest and certainly the most portable.

So before pulling the trigger and ordering one, I thought I would finally register and ask your collective wisdom on whether you agree that the OF660 would be a good fit considering my circumstances, or if there is another option that makes more sense? For eg, perhaps since I am just starting out, a $150 cheapie acoustic that will die after one winter in the car makes better sense, just to see if I can stick with this new resolution and don't end up wasting over $1000 on a CF...decisions decisions!

Thanks in advance for your thoughts!
Graeme

[guitararmy]

No experience with any CF guitars other than my Rainsong Jumbo and Composite Acoustics Legacy dread.
I would keep an eye on the AGF Classifieds for the occasional CF guitar that pops up for sale. I grabbed two CA dreads off of other AGF'ers.
Certainly sounds like you could use a sturdy guitar made of CF!

[Acousticado]

Hi Graeme. Welcome to the AGF and CF subforum! It’s obvious that you’ve been doing a lot of research about this, so you’re far-along the curve. First, despite the durability of composite guitars under adverse conditions, I’m not personally sure I’d want to spend time trying to play in a car in the heat or cold...and I live in Canada and know well about such conditions. However, if it’s what you know you want to do, a composite guitar has the best chance of handling it.

I don’t own and have never played an OF660, but my impression is that they are quite good. However, unless you really need the breakdown concept, my understanding from having ready lots of impressions about them, there are likely better choices, albeit perhaps at a bit higher cost. It may be best to consider acquiring a used CA Cargo, Emerald X7 or a Rainsong parlor. There is a member here who just posted that he has an X7 about to be advertised for sale because he upgraded to a woody version.

Anyhow, fwiw, that’s what I’d do. Good luck with your quest.

Edit: I found the thread where a member indicated he’ll likely be selling his X7 Opus to upgrade to an X7 Artisan Koa woody. He’s not the only one who has upgraded their X7 to a woody, which is a testament how happy players are with it. That X7 Opus guitar would be a fine choice. The “Opus” series Emeralds are all exposed black CF weave with gloss top and “crystal ice” finish on the back and sides and are Emerald’s most affordable without compromising any tone or playability. Maybe you could pm mkatz and snag it before it even gets advertised...but act fast if you can because inquiries are already being made.

Originally Posted by mkatz

The X7 Koa just arrived and is really stunning. It sounds the same as my X7 Opus but aesthetically it's in another world.

I'll be posting the X7 Opus in the Classifieds shortly if anybody is interested.

Mitch

Graeme;

Greetings, and welcome to a great forum of devoted CF advocates. At the risk of sounding like a heretic, I would recommend that you find an economical ax and chop more wood before you start looking for a carbon fiber instrument.

The CF guitars are wonderful, but they are expensive. Some of the inexpensive plywood guitars are fairly durable and would be just fine for practice. For example, the Ibanez AEG10N is good looking, has great electronics (including a built in tuner) and runs about $300. Washburn makes a small guitar that is highly portable and plays and sounds good--for about $300 you could get both the steel and nylon string versions.

One advantage of starting inexpensive is that you can run through several instruments as you look for the features that might serve you best. And then, once you have an idea of what serves you best, you can shoot for a quality carbon fiber guitar.

On the other hand, just to keep you on your toes, you might stretch for a Cargo, an X7, or a Blackbird Rider and plan on keeping it for a while.

Good luck in your decision making.

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by seekingcarbon

Hi All,

First up, I've been lurking for a while and want to thank you all for the wealth of info available on here. I live in France and there are no carbon fiber dealers anywhere near me to be able to test guitars, so reading/seeing/hearing your experiences helps greatly.

Essentially, after years of tinkering occasionally with a classical guitar, I've decided to give myself a kick up the bum and really get to grips with guitar playing, putting in the required time and effort. One of my biggest obstacles is lack of free time to practise regularly, particularly due to my work schedule of long hours with early mornings and late nights. So, I thought about using my enforced lunchbreak at work as a time to do my “30 min a day” of practice down in the car. I started reading about smallish, take-anywhere guitars and in so doing I landed up in this subforum!

It seems that a carbon fiber guitar is the way forward, since it would have to live in the car through all sorts of conditions (I live near the Alps in France, so plenty of heat in summer, plenty of snow and cold in winter). Since I really am no more than a beginner on guitar either, I'm also reluctant to part with 1000s of $$ right at the beginning.

After extensive reading, it seems like the Klos is at the best pricepoint, but it's not fully carbon so am not sure how it would react to a permanent life in the car boot? That being the case, the Journey OF660 then seems to be the guitar that fits the most boxes practically. From Youtube videos etc, the looks and sound of the OF660 don't match up to a Rainsong/Emerald/ Blackbird, but then again it is among the cheapest and certainly the most portable.

So before pulling the trigger and ordering one, I thought I would finally register and ask your collective wisdom on whether you agree that the OF660 would be a good fit considering my circumstances, or if there is another option that makes more sense? For eg, perhaps since I am just starting out, a $150 cheapie acoustic that will die after one winter in the car makes better sense, just to see if I can stick with this new resolution and don't end up wasting over $1000 on a CF...decisions decisions!

Thanks in advance for your thoughts!
Graeme

Hello, Graeme, and welcome.

I love keeping a guitar in the car, been doing it for over ten years. Currently my favorite car guitar is my Rainsong BI-DR1100NS, which is a full size dreadnought with a short scale 12-fret neck. I drive a full size SUV so keeping it in the back is not much bother. However, if I were in a smaller vehicle, or I had less space to dedicate to the guitar, the Journey OF660 is absolutely unbeatable. Over the summer my OF660 traveled with me for a few weeks, and it fit behind the driver seat totally out of the way leaving the back area wide open for other items. There were times when I actually forgot it was there.

Here's Pierre playing four of the most popular small body carbon fiber guitars from a few years ago. As you can hear, the Journey more than holds it's own with the others, and once in it's case, it will take up half the space of any of the 3/4 size guitars out there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_i3DaD0IdRU

[Acousticado]

Originally Posted by EvanB

Graeme;

Greetings, and welcome to a great forum of devoted CF advocates. At the risk of sounding like a heretic, I would recommend that you find an economical ax and chop more wood before you start looking for a carbon fiber instrument.

The CF guitars are wonderful, but they are expensive. Some of the inexpensive plywood guitars are fairly durable and would be just fine for practice. For example, the Ibanez AEG10N is good looking, has great electronics (including a built in tuner) and runs about $300. Washburn makes a small guitar that is highly portable and plays and sounds good--for about $300 you could get both the steel and nylon string versions.

One advantage of starting inexpensive is that you can run through several instruments as you look for the features that might serve you best. And then, once you have an idea of what serves you best, you can shoot for a quality carbon fiber guitar.

On the other hand, just to keep you on your toes, you might stretch for a Cargo, an X7, or a Blackbird Rider and plan on keeping it for a while.

Good luck in your decision making.

Evan, I’m assuming you think an inexpensive wood guitar could adequately tolerate being left all the time in a car subject to extreme hot and cold conditions. Cheap wood laminates are certainly tougher than quality ones, but I’m not sure one would hold up to what the OP is wanting to do. Never having tried it and wouldn’t, maybe I’m wrong.

[jdinco]

Welcome to the forum Graeme ! These guys are the experts and will guide you in the right direction. Best of luck !

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by Acousticado

Evan, I’m assuming you think an inexpensive wood guitar could adequately tolerate being left all the time in a car subject to extreme hot and cold conditions. Cheap wood laminates are certainly tougher than quality ones, but I’m not sure one would hold up to what the OP is wanting to do. Never having tried it and wouldn’t, maybe I’m wrong.

Laminate wood guitars would definitely not hold up, one would be lucky to get one season out of it, and I doubt the setup would last even that long. The Martin LX would be a contender, but still not in the same league as an all CF guitar.

[reeve21]

Similar to Ted's comment, I was going to recommend a Little Martin, the one made of all HPL which I believe stands for high pressure laminate. Nice and small for the car. It doesn't have a great sound, but I think it is acceptable for 30 minutes at a time in cramped conditions. There are videos on line of a guy backpacking all over the world with one and he says it holds up under those conditions. Best of all it's cheap.

[HodgdonExtreme]

Buying a guitar with the intent of learning to play it is kinda like buying yourself a gym membership... You think that because you spent money on it, you'll stick with it. It doesn't work, but instead makes you feel lousy about yourself.

My recommendation would be to buy an inexpensive but totally decent laminate guitar... A yamaha FG800 or something. Invest in getting a nice setup done, so that it plays nicely.

Reassess your commitment after 9 months or a year... If you're still into it, buy yourself that fancy CF model you've been drooling over.

Lastly, I think that with reasonable care, you can keep a wood guitar in your car most of the time. Mainly, avoid the really hot days where your car turns to an oven. Even the cold days aren't that big of a problem so long as you don't try to warm the guitar up quickly after it has gotten cold.

[Strumalot]

An old "fossilized wood" guitar might work if you don't want to go carbon or flax (a Sunburst Savoy would look great on a glacier!)...

I bought a used old beater Gibson in the early 1970s for $25. Dragged it all over North American camping (including a 600 mile canoe trip to the Arctic). It still lives, still worth about $25, but it plays and sounds good after all the years of abuse!

[121]

I think a small carbon fiber guitar would work great for you.
I've played my Emerald X7 while sitting in my Honda Fit (compact car) and the X7 is a perfect size.
However, if you're concerned about the cost of a CF acoustic, maybe something a little different like a Yamaha SLG200N ($629.99 street price) might work for you ?

https://usa.yamaha.com/products/musi...l#product-tabs

[Earl49]

Originally Posted by seekingcarbon

......One of my biggest obstacles is lack of free time to practise regularly, particularly due to my work schedule of long hours with early mornings and late nights. So, I thought about using my enforced lunchbreak at work as a time to do my “30 min a day” of practice down in the car......

My questions would be: Can the guitar come indoors with you during the work day, then be carried out to your car for your lunch break? Why does it have to be left out in the heat and cold? Or can you find some place like a stairwell or storage room to practice indoors?

The Emerald X7 sounds like a great choice for you, followed by a Rainsong Parlor P12 (recently discontinued but still available at some dealers).

I agree that any wood guitar -- even all laminated -- will be destroyed by living in the car. Heat will soften the glues and it will pull itself apart under string tension. Cold will dry it out and likely cause cracks and other joint separations. Not good either way.

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by Earl49

... a Rainsong Parlor P12 (recently discontinued but still available at some dealers).

No need to look for the discontinued model, the new CH-PA1100NS is the same guitar with a slightly different look, and a much lower $1299 price point.

..I agree that any wood guitar -- even all laminated -- will be destroyed by living in the car. Heat will soften the glues and it will pull itself apart under string tension. Cold will dry it out and likely cause cracks and other joint separations. Not good either way.

Exactly, which is probably why the OP came to the carbon section for advise. Bottom line, you can buy a cheap laminate guitar every few years, or you can buy a CF guitar once and have it for the rest of your life.

[Acousticado]

Graeme, I just re-read your original post and note this part...”using my enforced lunchbreak at work as a time to do my “30 min a day” of practice down in the car”...noting the key word “down”...I’ve (and perhaps others) assumed your car would be outside while at work for long hours, at times in harsh conditions. However, perhaps you may mean that the car could be in underground parking “down” under your work building. If the latter is the case, provided you could bring the guitar into your residence when there, a cheap laminate guitar could meet your needs until you further develop your skills and wish to invest more in a CF guitar.