Angling a soundhole pickup, and the pros and cons of the M80.

[Wade Hampton]

Sometime within the last couple of days I glanced through a thread about pickups, and in one of the posts there was a picture of a couple of guitars with Baggs M80 pickups placed at a slanting angle in the soundholes. I didn't make note of the thread title, and now I can't find it.

It would be nice to be able to go back and re-read that a little more carefully.

Also, I'd be interested in the pros and cons of the active and passive versions of the Baggs M80 and M1A.

Thanks in advance for any insights you can give me.


Wade Hampton Miller

[philjs]

The thread is #412879, Wade. The thread caught my eye because I had recently seen David Howley of We Banjo Three with one mounted on his Lowden so it was entirely under the bass 6th string to feed an octave pedal. It can be seen at about 0:48 in this video...



Phil

[MODELL]

Originally Posted by Wade Hampton

Also, I'd be interested in the pros and cons of the active and passive versions of the Baggs M80 and M1A.

Thanks in advance for any insights you can give me.


Wade Hampton Miller

I use an M1 passive in my little mahogany Ibanez. I plug it into an active DI and straight into the mixer. The pros are simplicity and lack of feedback. The con(s) are it sounds a little "less acoustic" if you will. For me though it is a bit midrange heavy which actually the acoustic sound of the mahogany top produces so I like the "plugged in" sound.
I would also like to view the other thread and see how this slanting of the pickup is working. For my M1, in order to have each magnet directly centered over each string, there is only one position that it works and that's straight across either at the front of the soundhole (neck) or back of the soundhole (bridge)

[Goat Mick]

I have both the M1A and the M1 and personally I like the passive M1 better, it just sounds cleaner to me. I might feel differently if I used long guitar chords but for what I do, it's a 6ft chord into a preamp and I never roam far from my vocal mic. I've used K&K, JJB and I like my M1 passive the best. I'm assuming the folks that angle the pickup in the sound hole are trying to accentuate the treble strings more, but these pickups have adjustable pole pieces so I'm not seeing the point. Hope this helps.

[stephenT]

One of the features I like about soundhole pickups (in models that have them) are adjustable pole pieces so the output of individual strings can be adjusted.

I angle my Sunrise pickup so the pole pieces are directly under the corresponding string.

[Hotspur]

Originally Posted by Wade Hampton

Also, I'd be interested in the pros and cons of the active and passive versions of the Baggs M80 and M1A.

The M80 is both active and passive - it's got a switch. (Although the switch is located in a position where it is not something you can easily change mid-gig).

You can find a bunch of different threads about the M1 vs M1A on this board. The big takeaway I remember from those threads was that the difference was less one of tone than one of signal strength. The M1A is louder and more robust if you're dealing with a longer cable.

[fongie]

Hi Phil can you explain to me why the pickup is placed like that on Dave Howleys guitar?

How does it pick up the other strings? Or does it? You learn something new everyday

[Wade Hampton]

Originally Posted by MODELL

I would also like to view the other thread and see how this slanting of the pickup is working. For my M1, in order to have each magnet directly centered over each string, there is only one position that it works and that's straight across either at the front of the soundhole (neck) or back of the soundhole (bridge)

The thread was started by Fusion01, who considers himself primarily an electric guitarist and thus is keenly aware of how much angling the pickup can alter the sound.

Here's a photo of his acoustic with its soundhole pickup:

˚˚˚

and here's a photo that noledog contributed to that thread:

˚˚˚

That's the image that was in my mind when I tried to find the original thread again. Thanks for posting that link, Phil. Noledog's post got me thinking about putting a soundhole pickup in a maple Guild jumbo I have and which I string with nickel strings.

It's a really nice-sounding guitar, and up to this point (I've owned it for about two or three years now) it's been strictly a stay at home guitar. But it plays really well, has a good sound and might as well get gigged out.

I like Baggs gear a LOT, and have their pickups in several instruments (not just guitars.) If I do decide to get a soundhole pickup, it'll be one of the Baggs units. So what are your opinions of the M80 versus the M1?


whm

[philjs]

Originally Posted by fongie

Hi Phil can you explain to me why the pickup is placed like that on Dave Howleys guitar? How does it pick up the other strings? Or does it? You learn something new everyday

The answer is, as you suspect, that it doesn't...he has some other pickup in the guitar, likely an iBeam according to their website. The output of the mag soundhole pickup only picks up that single bass string and is sent separately to a signal chain that includes an octave pedal of some sort. The live sound is very powerful...a mix of the straight 6th string sound via the iBeam (and probably also from the "through" of the octave pedal) and then an octave lower via the mag pickup and the pedal. It reminded me of that deep bass John Doyle sound, though Doyle apparently uses an extra heavy gauge (.072, tuned to D) bass string.

Phil

[fongie]

Originally Posted by philjs

The answer is, as you suspect, that it doesn't...he has some other pickup in the guitar, likely an iBeam according to their website. The output of the mag soundhole pickup only picks up that single bass string and is sent separately to a signal chain that includes an octave pedal of some sort. The live sound is very powerful...a mix of the straight 6th string sound via the iBeam (and probably also from the "through" of the octave pedal) and then an octave lower via the mag pickup and the pedal. It reminded me of that deep bass John Doyle sound, though Doyle apparently uses an extra heavy gauge (.072, tuned to D) bass string.

Phil

Ahh that explains everthing. Cheers Phil

Wade for me both the active and passive (through a DI) sounds great.

The pros and cons is.........no need to change batteries with the passive (only on the DI box which is placed outside).

I had the M1 active (I think) many years ago, and being so bulky compare to the Fishman, it was a pain changing the batteries.

[fazool]

Originally Posted by Wade Hampton

Sometime within the last couple of days I glanced through a thread about pickups, and in one of the posts there was a picture of a couple of guitars with Baggs M80 pickups placed at a slanting angle in the soundholes. I didn't make note of the thread title, and now I can't find it.

It would be nice to be able to go back and re-read that a little more carefully.

Also, I'd be interested in the pros and cons of the active and passive versions of the Baggs M80 and M1A.

Thanks in advance for any insights you can give me.


Wade Hampton Miller

I used to have a magnetic soundhole pickup so long ago I don't even know the brand.

I wanted to play around with looping and needed a small amp so this week I bought an Acoustasonic amp, a Ditto looper and a Dean Markley woody.

I wanted something inexpensive just to toy around a little. The Dean Markley website mentioned rotating the pickup to create/enhance harmonics. I don't think its harmonics like we think of them but basically other vibrations spilling over onto the "wrong" poles.

I got the pickup and am expecting the other bits in a couple days. I'll report back what I find after some experimenting on rotation.

[paulin]

I've used the M1, M1A and the M80. I really like the M80 best, have them in two of my Taylor guitars. I mostly play in a band and the M80 doesn't feed back, cuts through the mix well and to me sounds better.

[Wade Hampton]

Originally Posted by paulin

I've used the M1, M1A and the M80. I really like the M80 best, have them in two of my Taylor guitars. I mostly play in a band and the M80 doesn't feed back, cuts through the mix well and to me sounds better.

I called and talked briefly to one of the guys at L.R. Baggs this afternoon, shortly after starting this thread. The M80 sounds more versatile and more of what I'm looking for, so I'm definitely leaning that way.

Besides, the M80 is what Eric (noledog) uses, and I want to try to be as cool as he is. While that's clearly impossible, at least I can buy the pickup and angle it the way he has. He's thought this through and figured it out, and combined with what Caleb at L.R. Baggs told me this afternoon, that's good enough for me.

Thanks, all of you!


Wade Hampton Miller

[dcopper]

FWIW, I have had all 3 - M1, M1A and M80. The M80 is by far the better sounding and more versatile pickup in my experience. In the active mode, it really gives excellent string articulation and body warmth, really acts like a dual system. I have one in a cocobolo Taylor 814 LTD along with a K&K and often don't use the K&K since the M80 can cover the body tone. Together the two pickups are phenomenal.
The M1 is a really good simple soundhole pickup. I preferred it over its brother, the M1A. The M1A had a much more electric sounding overtone and I sold it after not using it for several years.
I have a Sunrise which to me is the best sounding Soundhole pickup I have ever used. I have also had Fishman Rare Earth pickups and keep one as a back up.
Hope this helps.
davidc

[Wade Hampton]

Thanks, David. Yes, it does help. The M80 it is.


whm