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Old 07-01-2017, 11:43 AM
rmsstrider rmsstrider is offline
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Default Question about Art tube preamp

I just ordered an Art tube preamp to warm up vocals for my existing mic,a sure 57a beta. I ordered this to try before buying a new mic. I intend to use this straight to my Bose L1 compact. My question is, where would I place in my normal chain if I want to include this in my other set up? I usually plug guitar and mic into my Tc Helcion Harmony singer, and then to my Rcf L Pad 6 channel mixer and then to my Bose. I am new to this and need advice for correct set up. Thanks.
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2016 Martin OOO-18
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Bose L1 Compact
Rcf Lpad 6
Tc. Helcion Harmony Singer
Bodyrez
Roland Ac-33
Shure Beta 57A
Sennheise E835
Blue Condenser Mic
K&K Meridian condenser mic
Zoom H4N
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  #2  
Old 07-01-2017, 11:54 AM
sdelsolray sdelsolray is online now
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You will have three, perhaps four, gain stages for your vocal mic. Using correct gain staging will be necessary.
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Old 07-01-2017, 12:20 PM
rmsstrider rmsstrider is offline
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OK, see but what order of the chain?
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1991 Martin D16H
2016 Martin OOO-18
Composite Acoustics Legacy
Bose L1 Compact
Rcf Lpad 6
Tc. Helcion Harmony Singer
Bodyrez
Roland Ac-33
Shure Beta 57A
Sennheise E835
Blue Condenser Mic
K&K Meridian condenser mic
Zoom H4N
Fishman Aura 16
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  #4  
Old 07-01-2017, 11:55 PM
midwinter midwinter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmsstrider View Post
I just ordered an Art tube preamp to warm up vocals for my existing mic,a sure 57a beta. I ordered this to try before buying a new mic. I intend to use this straight to my Bose L1 compact. My question is, where would I place in my normal chain if I want to include this in my other set up? I usually plug guitar and mic into my Tc Helcion Harmony singer, and then to my Rcf L Pad 6 channel mixer and then to my Bose. I am new to this and need advice for correct set up. Thanks.
Mic > ART > Harmony > mixer
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  #5  
Old 07-02-2017, 06:01 AM
rmsstrider rmsstrider is offline
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Thank you for clarification
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1991 Martin D16H
2016 Martin OOO-18
Composite Acoustics Legacy
Bose L1 Compact
Rcf Lpad 6
Tc. Helcion Harmony Singer
Bodyrez
Roland Ac-33
Shure Beta 57A
Sennheise E835
Blue Condenser Mic
K&K Meridian condenser mic
Zoom H4N
Fishman Aura 16
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  #6  
Old 07-02-2017, 10:19 AM
Cochese Cochese is offline
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Probably not the answer you want to hear but the mic pre will not make that much difference. It starts with the vocalist. If you have good technique and a good voice you're most of the way there. The mic will make a much bigger difference then the preamp assuming you are a decent singer.

Are you monitoring with the Bose as well? That system doesn't have the most power or clarity. Not to dis it but I used the bigger system for years and found that lacking as well after 5 years with it. The compact is really a coffee house speaker. In a small room you'll get by. The ART (which I have had for years) will just be an extra step You will get better results as suggested by gain staging properly and monitoring.
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Old 07-02-2017, 01:47 PM
rmsstrider rmsstrider is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cochese View Post
Probably not the answer you want to hear but the mic pre will not make that much difference. It starts with the vocalist. If you have good technique and a good voice you're most of the way there. The mic will make a much bigger difference then the preamp assuming you are a decent singer.

Are you monitoring with the Bose as well? That system doesn't have the most power or clarity. Not to dis it but I used the bigger system for years and found that lacking as well after 5 years with it. The compact is really a coffee house speaker. In a small room you'll get by. The ART (which I have had for years) will just be an extra step You will get better results as suggested by gain staging properly and monitoring.
I really bought the Art to use from just the mic to the Bose for simplicity if I don't want to bring my pedals and mixer. Thought I'd give it a try. Yes small rooms only. Mic techniques not bad, but can always improve.
My full set up was, guitar and mic (Sure 57a beta) harmony singer, mixer with effects , to 2 - 10" Carvin powered speakers on stands and my little Roland ac33 as monitor. Too much stuff for me.
Settling for the Bose, and mic and the art preamp for quick simple set up in small rooms. If the Art doesn't help, then I will look at different mics.
__________________
1991 Martin D16H
2016 Martin OOO-18
Composite Acoustics Legacy
Bose L1 Compact
Rcf Lpad 6
Tc. Helcion Harmony Singer
Bodyrez
Roland Ac-33
Shure Beta 57A
Sennheise E835
Blue Condenser Mic
K&K Meridian condenser mic
Zoom H4N
Fishman Aura 16
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  #8  
Old 07-02-2017, 09:02 PM
Cochese Cochese is offline
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Doesn't the compact already have a mic input and instrument input? The ART is an ok preamp, but nothing special. It's only going to give you some gain. Don't think that the placebo tube will do much. You still need a wall wart with the ART. You might just be better off eating one of those small micro mixers.

I have a couple of higher end preamp's that I use in my studio and all things being equal the mic is always the most drastic improvement. My Royer mic through my cheap Mackie preamps will sound way better than my 57 through my Great River ME-1NV preamp.

Hey, try the ART, maybe it will be just the thing.
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Old 07-03-2017, 05:28 AM
rmsstrider rmsstrider is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cochese View Post
Doesn't the compact already have a mic input and instrument input? The ART is an ok preamp, but nothing special. It's only going to give you some gain. Don't think that the placebo tube will do much. You still need a wall wart with the ART. You might just be better off eating one of those small micro mixers.

I have a couple of higher end preamp's that I use in my studio and all things being equal the mic is always the most drastic improvement. My Royer mic through my cheap Mackie preamps will sound way better than my 57 through my Great River ME-1NV preamp.

Hey, try the ART, maybe it will be just the thing.
You are probably right. I should just get a different mic. The Sure 57a beta I have, just has no warmth? I was hoping the tube would add that.
I am trying to avoid using my mixer. The compact just has XLR for mic with bass and treble only, and a 1/4 guitar input. Each channel has separate volume. no master volume.
__________________
1991 Martin D16H
2016 Martin OOO-18
Composite Acoustics Legacy
Bose L1 Compact
Rcf Lpad 6
Tc. Helcion Harmony Singer
Bodyrez
Roland Ac-33
Shure Beta 57A
Sennheise E835
Blue Condenser Mic
K&K Meridian condenser mic
Zoom H4N
Fishman Aura 16
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  #10  
Old 07-03-2017, 10:48 AM
Cochese Cochese is offline
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That's a bit limiting. Mic selection can be very important. When I used the original Bose PAS I usually found just adding a touch of treble helped.My voice is on the dark side though. You kind of need to play with it at home standing in front of it if possible. That system can be a little challenging as placement in some rooms is often less than ideal. If you're too close the sub woofer it will cancel some of the high end and your sound will "seem" dark but not in the audience.

The ART is decent but it really won't warm things up all that much in my experience. I have 2 other mic preamp's a Summit Audio and Groove Tubes Brick and they will add a bit more girth. A mixer with decent EQ will be a better bet than the subtlety of a mic pre.

You can probably make it work with what you have if you play with it. Always keep in mind the physics of the room. That has such a huge impact on your overall sound. Some rooms just naturally sound wonderful and some rooms you can teak forever and never get a good sound.
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Old 07-03-2017, 03:57 PM
rmsstrider rmsstrider is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cochese View Post
That's a bit limiting. Mic selection can be very important. When I used the original Bose PAS I usually found just adding a touch of treble helped.My voice is on the dark side though. You kind of need to play with it at home standing in front of it if possible. That system can be a little challenging as placement in some rooms is often less than ideal. If you're too close the sub woofer it will cancel some of the high end and your sound will "seem" dark but not in the audience.

The ART is decent but it really won't warm things up all that much in my experience. I have 2 other mic preamp's a Summit Audio and Groove Tubes Brick and they will add a bit more girth. A mixer with decent EQ will be a better bet than the subtlety of a mic pre.

You can probably make it work with what you have if you play with it. Always keep in mind the physics of the room. That has such a huge impact on your overall sound. Some rooms just naturally sound wonderful and some rooms you can teak forever and never get a good sound.
Received the Art today, and I did not notice that it added any warmth or girth? It is a nice small preamp and does alow me to adjust the gain, but, I already have a nice small mixer. I am thinking of returning and either get a different mic or resign myself to using my mixer all the time.
__________________
1991 Martin D16H
2016 Martin OOO-18
Composite Acoustics Legacy
Bose L1 Compact
Rcf Lpad 6
Tc. Helcion Harmony Singer
Bodyrez
Roland Ac-33
Shure Beta 57A
Sennheise E835
Blue Condenser Mic
K&K Meridian condenser mic
Zoom H4N
Fishman Aura 16
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  #12  
Old 07-03-2017, 04:14 PM
Martin Maniac Martin Maniac is offline
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I have an Art Pro MPA II and I love it. I run two Neumann TLM 102 mics into it then it goes directly into the Pro VLA II Tube Compressor, then into the Focusrite 18i8 interface. Works great for me. I'm getting really nice sounding recordings. I know the ART isn't top of the line stuff, but it's good enough for me and for the price I can't complain. I'm on a tight budget and this works for me.

Note: I upgraded the tubes in the ART pre-amp to Telefunken tubes...and in the compressor I upgraded to Mullard tubes.... maybe that's why I'm getting really nice recordings...??
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Old 07-03-2017, 10:05 PM
Cochese Cochese is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmsstrider View Post
Received the Art today, and I did not notice that it added any warmth or girth? It is a nice small preamp and does alow me to adjust the gain, but, I already have a nice small mixer. I am thinking of returning and either get a different mic or resign myself to using my mixer all the time.
Why not just use the mixer? At least you'll have some tonal control, efx and a quick way to adjust things. I always used my mixer when I had my Bose system. I guess I'm just old school. You should see how much stuff my band has to carry for gigs. We're a tribute band and we have one cargo van full of gear and our sound company usually sends a Sprinter truck with a big PA system and lights.

My solo gigs are usually 1 or 2 QSC K10's, sometimes a small Mackie monitor, Soundcraft mixer, etc. Bringing gear is just part of the job.
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Old 07-04-2017, 03:04 AM
rmsstrider rmsstrider is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cochese View Post
Why not just use the mixer? At least you'll have some tonal control, efx and a quick way to adjust things. I always used my mixer when I had my Bose system. I guess I'm just old school. You should see how much stuff my band has to carry for gigs. We're a tribute band and we have one cargo van full of gear and our sound company usually sends a Sprinter truck with a big PA system and lights.

My solo gigs are usually 1 or 2 QSC K10's, sometimes a small Mackie monitor, Soundcraft mixer, etc. Bringing gear is just part of the job.
Yes, you are probably right. You can only reduce your gear so much. I still think I need to audition other mics.
__________________
1991 Martin D16H
2016 Martin OOO-18
Composite Acoustics Legacy
Bose L1 Compact
Rcf Lpad 6
Tc. Helcion Harmony Singer
Bodyrez
Roland Ac-33
Shure Beta 57A
Sennheise E835
Blue Condenser Mic
K&K Meridian condenser mic
Zoom H4N
Fishman Aura 16
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 07-07-2017, 09:46 PM
Multicellular Multicellular is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmsstrider View Post
I really bought the Art to use from just the mic to the Bose for simplicity if I don't want to bring my pedals and mixer. Thought I'd give it a try. Yes small rooms only. Mic techniques not bad, but can always improve.
My full set up was, guitar and mic (Sure 57a beta) harmony singer, mixer with effects , to 2 - 10" Carvin powered speakers on stands and my little Roland ac33 as monitor. Too much stuff for me.
Settling for the Bose, and mic and the art preamp for quick simple set up in small rooms. If the Art doesn't help, then I will look at different mics.
To me, it really sounds like what you need is a pedalboard to organize this stuff. It wouldnt seem like a lot if it was all on a small board and all you had to do was plug in the mic, guitar, and run a line to the Bose?
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