"Variable" Impedance DI box KK pickups?

[Kittoon]

I use the KK passive pickup system on my guitars and am always plugged in. I have a RedEye (1MEG Z) DI box and also a Baggs Venue 10MEG Z)
I have read here on the AGF that the RedEye is a better "fit" (electronically) for KK pickups. I prefer the added features of the Baggs Venue (The Large easy to use knobs, the EQing and Mute switch. (The on-board tuner is a bit of a disappointment) At lower volumes, (at home) BOTH boxes sound pretty similar to me. (But it's time to move outside demanding more volume! The RedEye has better note separation for the bass notes if anything. This might sound kind of nutty but I wonder if any sort of Impedance (matching) box exists whereby one could select whatever sounds best. Or is the Impedance difference simply nothing to "fret{ about! ??

[akafloyd]

There are some DIs and she reap some that have impedance selectors. The Radial PZ-DI is one. Given the opportunities I've had I haven't noticed much difference for the K&K until the impedance was low like 220 ohms. Everyone has their own experiences and opinions.

[martingitdave]

K&K recommends between between 400 K Ohm and 1 M Ohm based on their testing. 1 M Ohm seems to be a common setting. I have some Mackie equipment with 400 K Ohm inputs and K&Ks sound great through them.

[sdelsolray]

Originally Posted by Kittoon

I use the KK passive pickup system on my guitars and am always plugged in. I have a RedEye (1MEG Z) DI box and also a Baggs Venue 10MEG Z)
I have read here on the AGF that the RedEye is a better "fit" (electronically) for KK pickups. I prefer the added features of the Baggs Venue (The Large easy to use knobs, the EQing and Mute switch. (The on-board tuner is a bit of a disappointment) At lower volumes, (at home) BOTH boxes sound pretty similar to me. (But it's time to move outside demanding more volume! The RedEye has better note separation for the bass notes if anything. This might sound kind of nutty but I wonder if any sort of Impedance (matching) box exists whereby one could select whatever sounds best. Or is the Impedance difference simply nothing to "fret{ about! ??

You will also read here that the input impedance for a K&K mini pickup is not noticeable between 1 MegOhm and 10 MegOhm under quasi-scientific tests, which puts the claim that the impedance input for the preamp for a K&K mini pickup needs to be 1 MegOhm in the category of an urban myth.

[pieterh]

I would be interested to do a side by side comparison of different input impedances where everything else is more or less the same. We have three guitars with the pure mini and in my case I usually use my two with the Pz-pre. The Piezo buffer option puts the input impedance to 10mega ohms. When combining that input with say my Taylor on the other un-buffered it produces a tone that is arguably too bassy. Without the buffer it is slightly lacking in bass. More recently I have been connecting the Pure Mini guitar without the buffer as the Taylor's bass (for example) can be eq'd down slightly to compensate.

[martingitdave]

My understanding is that the K&K PM's output impedance will vary across its frequency range. So, we have to resist the temptation to assign a "perfect" theoretical value to the input impedance of the preamp. Couple that with the fact that every guitar amplifies differently, installations will vary, there are three piezos in parallel, people have different preferences for different emphasized frequencies, and you can see how people could report satisfaction with many different preamps with different impedances. That said, K&K does recommend a minimum of 400 K Ohm to 1 M Ohm. But, there is no reason that a higher input impedance wouldn't work for some people. There are too many variables to predict what your installation will sound best with. But, you're highly likely to find a good result in the 1 M Ohm neighborhood. Like all things related to acoustic amplification, you have to experiment a little. So, try and find a friend with gear you can try, or a retailer that will allow you to test a few preamps.

[Kittoon]

Yes, this does make good sense. I was thinking a "Variable"
or "Switchable" means of altering input Z would come in so handy for testing purposes.

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by Kittoon

Yes, this does make good sense. I was thinking a "Variable"
or "Switchable" means of altering input Z would come in so handy for testing purposes.

*Grace Design Alix has tunable input impedance
HI: 10MΩ / MED: 1MΩ / LOW: 330kΩ

* Headway EDB-2 impedance can be set to
20MΩ/ 5MΩ / 1MΩ
but does not have a pedal form factor (for the mute).

Cuki

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by Kittoon

…is the Impedance difference simply nothing to "fret{ about! ??

Hi K

For me, that is the case…Impedance on most mid-range and high end preamps is no issue with a K&K.

I own 6 brands of acoustic preamplifiers, and K&K pickups sound just as good through each of them, and all can be easily adjusted for solid and natural tone/output through either PA or amp.

The brands I own/use are:
Raven PMB-I and II (dual source)
DTAR Solstice (dual source)
Fishman Platinum Stage
Baggs ParaDI
K&K belt pack (dual source)…this is the back-up to my back-up and the least used of my preamps.
Behringer acoustic driver DI ADI21


I owned a preamp with switchable impedance for a year (Headway EDB-I), and you could plug a K&K equipped guitar into it and flip that switch from setting to setting while someone was playing and it made zero difference to the sound.

[MrErikJ]

Whenever I've heard the K&K Mini it's always seemed pretty boxy and muffled to me, which I assumed was poor impedance matching (people running it directly to a board/mixer or amp). However, I am inclined to agree that there's probably not a hugely significant difference between amplifying it with 1 or 10 megaohms and the overall circuitry of the preamp & the power of its EQ would be more influential than impedance alone.

I'd be curious to try it with my Radial PZ Deluxe but I'm kinda adverse to the glue requirements of the K&K.

[MrErikJ]

Another option to consider is running the K&K into a pedal of some sort, like the TC Body Rez or a Boss Tuner, prior to your preamp.. Many of those have 1 megaohm inputs and then buffer the signal for whatever it's delivered to next. It's not a bad option and I've run my LB6 (which recommends a 10megaohm input) into my Body Rez into the non-buffered setting of my PZ Deluxe and it's sounded nice. Again, I didn't use the "recommended" impedance but the sound was fine.

[Kittoon]

Well, all this makes me feel more confident. I do use a Strymon Reverb box 100% of the time. -Just for a test, I will swap positions of the Baggs Venue (10Meg) and the effects box (I do not know input Z) and critique results. The Baggs Venue does have a set of "IN/OUT" ports but I have never brought reverb into the chain that way.

[Cm3ohana]

Probably particular to my setup but I use a Boss GE-7 to increase the signal of my K&K equipped OM to get enough gain to register in my LR Baggs Session DI. When I use my other guitar that has an LR Baggs Anthem installed, I bypass the GE-7 since the preamp in the Anthem provides more than enough gain to register a healthy signal in the Session DI. Probably a different issue than the impedance discussion but thought I would share in case it has relevance/usefulness to the OP.

[Doug Young]

Here's something I posted quite a while back when I first got my Felix, which offers 5 different impedances. You can hear the impact of the same exact signal chain with only the impedance changed. Impedances, in order, are: 1M, 10M, 10K, 1M, 20M, 330K. This is recorded directly out of Felix. I also recorded samples thru an amp, which you can find on my soundcloud page, I think. There, the differences were somewhat minimized by the added color of the amp.



The problem with many reports about impedance effects is that there are too many variables (like 2 different preamps with totally different circuits in addition to impedance changes). Here the only change is the impedance, and the fact that I had to play the same lick 6 separate times, with inevitable performance variations.

[Kittoon]

Well, now that I'm into the 3rd hour of your tests Doug! (Perfect!!!..)