What are the milestones of learning process?

[Mystery123]

Different people learn differently, follow different process, lessons etc...

Some consider number of songs as their benchmark/milestones while others consider number of chords or scales or theory they can play.

One of my friends said that you'd know if you can play by yourself.
That's a little vague.

I'm not talking about time it takes to learn.
I'm talking about the skills.
One may take 2 years, other may take 2 months to get there but what's there?

So what is a better approach?
How do you say where you are?
What criteria are there?
thanks

The goals are set by you as are the criteria for measuring whether they have been attained.

[Llewlyn]

Originally Posted by Mystery123

I'm talking about the skills.
One may take 2 years, other may take 2 months to get there but what's there?

Highly subjective I guess?
I'd include: playing your first tune w/o errors, mastering a certain scale, composing your first song.

Ll.

[BFD]

I think you may need a little tighter definition of "learning" to get meaningful answers.
Learning what? How to strum the Thanksgiving song like Adam Sandler? How to flatpick like Josh Williams? How to arrange & play rockin' fingerstyle blues like Toby?
Lots of different milestones depending on what we're talking about learning.

[Mr. Jelly]

When you learn something it's a milestone. So then learn something else. Then when you have learned a bunch of things it's a milestone. So then you learn more things. There's one of them there milestones every mile I think.

[JonPR]

Milestones? It's an endless journey. You can make goals for yourself if you want, but how long you take to get to them is dependent on how many hours you put it, and how focused you make your practice.

The only goals I recommend are really short term ones. What can you achieve today, in this session? Even better, what can you achieve in the next 5 minutes?
The further your goals are in the future, the less you will enjoy the process of learning; the more you'll be aware of how far you have to go, which is depressing. You don't want to be counting the hours or the days.
Every minute (every second) has to have its reward. That's what makes you practice for longer, and so progress faster.
But then you won't care about speed of progress, because it becomes irrelevant -you're enjoying yourself NOW, and that's what music is all about.

[Mystery123]

Originally Posted by BFD

I think you may need a little tighter definition of "learning" to get meaningful answers.
Learning what? How to strum the Thanksgiving song like Adam Sandler? How to flatpick like Josh Williams? How to arrange & play rockin' fingerstyle blues like Toby?
Lots of different milestones depending on what we're talking about learning.

That's exactly what I don't want to do.
I'm looking for a guitar learning milestones in general.
Learning to play guitar in general, not like certain player or a singer or musician.

If we start following one person's style or process, it won't be generic.

A college student is classified into Freshmen, junior, senior etc... regardless of what your major is.
What you are mentioning is more in line of a master's or phd level students who wants to specialize/research in one technique after he already knows basic.

Let's say 10 is a professional guitarist who knows all/most theories, can play all/most chords/scales, can compose songs/music etc... and 1 is a beginner.

How do you say what the middle level is?
Is a hobbyist at 5? Let's say a hobbyist can play lots of chords and some scales needed for the songs he's interested in but may not know most other chords/scales he never encountered.

I guess there's no generic grading or level when it comes to guitar.
It's either you can play or you cannot.

One answer to this type of questions I see in the forum is "Why does it matter? Just play and have fun".
Of course that's fine and we all are doing that.

I'm trying to figure out if there's a certain list of things that I can check off and move on in general instead of following one singer or a type of music.

[reeve21]

Hi Mystery,

I'm no teacher, and an intermediate player at best, but since you don't seem to be getting an answer that works for you I'll take a shot.

It looks like you are interested in acquiring specific skills on the guitar. I have no idea where you are at now, so don't be insulted by my list

1. Open or first position "Cowboy" major chords--A, E, D, C, G.

2. Open first position minor chords--Em, Am, Dm.

3. Major and Minor Bar chords-- F, then E shape up the neck, A shape, Am shape, Em shape.

4. More intricate bar chord shapes (may or may not be needed depending on your style).

5. Consistent strumming, many patterns, in time.

6. Palm muting.

7. String muting with the fretting hand.

8. Scales--Major and Pentatonic to start.

9. Basic chord theory that you can apply in many keys-blues progression to start, then others depending on your preferred style.

10. Basic improvising over backing tracks, single notes, double stops, chords....

11. SONGS, TUNES, PIECES, whatever you want to call them. If you have any aspirations of being a guitar player (as opposed to a guitar owner) you need something cohesive to play. You need a repertoire and you need to have it memorized, including the lyrics if you also sing. At that point you are making music that others might enjoy hearing. Noodling is only fun for the noodle-er.

Seems to me if you can get this stuff down you could hold your own in a jam, or playing alone if you are also a vocalist.

If you don't sing and like to play solo I think you may eventually gravitate towards finger style as many on the forum seem to do. Then you get to learn a whole new set of skills

I hope this helps....

[Llewlyn]

I like Reeve's reply!

Ll.

[SunnyDee]

I'm self-taught and a curriculum designer and teacher trainer, so I did think about my learning objectives/milestones as I was learning.

My goal was to write songs on guitar. My journey also included ear training, rhythm work, fundamental theory, and history of Western music. I play only acoustic and don't use a pick.

Some of the milestones were...

1. Cleanly forming open chords
2. Transitioning between open chords at tempo
3. Using varied strumming patterns in rhythm
4. Understanding capo use and transposing key for vocal use
5. Using F and Bm barre chords in tempo
6. Using varied fingerstyle picking patterns with open chords
7. Using all 5th and 6th string major and minor barres
8. Knowing and finding all root 5th and 6th root notes without deriving them
9. Playing chords in any key
10. Understanding and using major 7th and dominant 7th barres and open chords
11. Understanding and using sus chords in barres and open chords
12. Using varied fingerstyle picking patterns with barre chords
13. Developing clean transitions between chords when fingerpicking
14. Using simple hammer-ons, pull-offs, percussive hits musically
15. Learning the intervals and notes across entire fretboard
16. Deriving chords on the fly using interval and fretboard knowledge
17. Creating original chord progressions for songs
18. Composing/improvising melodies using fretboard knowledge
19. Developing my own combo picking/strumming style
20. Using theory to understand and extend melody improvisations
21. Using learned techniques and fretboard knowledge to instantly play music I imagine

I knew nothing AT ALL when I started and I've just reached the end of this list in the last month or so. I first picked up a guitar in January of 2016 so all this took 18-19 months. I now feel ok saying I play guitar. I still only know a handful of songs by heart because that just wasn't my goal.

[Pitar]

On an artistic note, you are the song. You are the voice, the music and the passion buoying them both. There is nothing to add. You have arrived as an entertainer, if entertaining is the goal.

On a technical note, you needn't a score to play it. You can listen to a song and play it without resources for it other than your own ear and motor skills, and you accomplish this within a few minutes, hone it in a couple days and be playing it with passion inside of a week.

These are developmental achievements, or milestones, that will forever change the way you approach music. You will approach the muse more so than the guitar. You will seek more challenging music to further invest your skills, and then reward yourself with their harvest. No longer will you be thinking about playing guitar. You will be thinking of playing music.

[Mandobart]

Similar to other responses, but starting with basics:

1. Able to tune your guitar and know when you're not in tune
2. Learn the cowboy chords (major and minor) in first position
3. Able to play along on a song using these chords, smoothly changing chords and while maintaining rhythm. This is the most crucial milestone! Nothing else works or matters as a musician if you don't have good, solid rhythm.
4. Able to play and sing (or talk) simultaneously. While maintaining steady rhythm.
5. Hammer-ons, pull-offs
6. Barre chords
7. Learn more "color chords" in various positions up the neck
8. Branch into other rhythm styles, strumming patterns
9. Fingerpicking
10. Able to play along on a new song by watching and listening to another player.
11. Able to play along on a new song by just listening to another player.

These don't necessarily have to be done in this order or even serially. Doubtless there are more milestones I haven't listed. Composition is a whole other skill/milestone that some never seek or reach. Of course, some never seek or reach some of the ones I mention above either. How long will this take? I started guitar at age 13 and went up thru 9 above in about 3 years. I didn't really focus on 10 and 11 until many years later. How long will it take you? Some never seek or reach certain milestones.

[TBman]

Good things mentioned.

A few more.

When you learn how to practice efficiently.

When you realize that learning it until you get it right isn't enough.

[Mystery123]

Originally Posted by reeve21

Hi Mystery,
I'm no teacher, and an intermediate player at best, but since you don't seem to be getting an answer that works for you I'll take a shot.

It looks like you are interested in acquiring specific skills on the guitar. I have no idea where you are at now, so don't be insulted by my list
...
I hope this helps....

Thank you. I'm still at beginner level so any suggestion helps.
Yes, this is in line with what I was looking for.
From your list, I'm good with 1,2 and 3.
4 is in process. 5 rhythm is where I'm struggling now.
Long way to go.

Originally Posted by SunnyDee

I'm self-taught and a curriculum designer and teacher trainer, so I did think about my learning objectives/milestones as I was learning.

My goal was to write songs on guitar. My journey also included ear training, rhythm work, fundamental theory, and history of Western music. I play only acoustic and don't use a pick.

Some of the milestones were...

1. Cleanly forming open chords
2. Transitioning between open chords at tempo
3. Using varied strumming patterns in rhythm
4. Understanding capo use and transposing key for vocal use
5. Using F and Bm barre chords in tempo
6. Using varied fingerstyle picking patterns with open chords
7. Using all 5th and 6th string major and minor barres
8. Knowing and finding all root 5th and 6th root notes without deriving them
9. Playing chords in any key
10. Understanding and using major 7th and dominant 7th barres and open chords
11. Understanding and using sus chords in barres and open chords
12. Using varied fingerstyle picking patterns with barre chords
13. Developing clean transitions between chords when fingerpicking
14. Using simple hammer-ons, pull-offs, percussive hits musically
15. Learning the intervals and notes across entire fretboard
16. Deriving chords on the fly using interval and fretboard knowledge
17. Creating original chord progressions for songs
18. Composing/improvising melodies using fretboard knowledge
19. Developing my own combo picking/strumming style
20. Using theory to understand and extend melody improvisations
21. Using learned techniques and fretboard knowledge to instantly play music I imagine

I knew nothing AT ALL when I started and I've just reached the end of this list in the last month or so. I first picked up a guitar in January of 2016 so all this took 18-19 months. I now feel ok saying I play guitar. I still only know a handful of songs by heart because that just wasn't my goal.

Thank you.
That's amazing that you learned all that in 1.5 years by yourself.
I think I started practicing since end of 2015 and from your list, I'm up to 7 excluding 6 and 4.
That means your practice schedule/content is much better than mine and/or my practice is terrible.
What/How did you practice to progress through all those?
You can PM me if that's better.

[reeve21]

Originally Posted by Mystery123

Thank you. I'm still at beginner level so any suggestion helps.
Yes, this is in line with what I was looking for.
From your list, I'm good with 1,2 and 3.
4 is in process. 5 rhythm is where I'm struggling now.
Long way to go.



Thank you.
That's amazing that you learned all that in 1.5 years by yourself.
I think I started practicing since end of 2015 and from your list, I'm up to 7 excluding 6 and 4.
That means your practice schedule/content is much better than mine and/or my practice is terrible.
What/How did you practice to progress through all those?
You can PM me if that's better.

Mystery--

Sunnydee is way ahead of where I was at 18 months (and still ahead of me after several decades!) so don't be discouraged. I'd say you are right on track. Bravo to Sunnydee, but you are doing fine....