The Acoustic Guitar Forum

Go Back   The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > RECORD

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 04-14-2011, 03:48 PM
StyLeD StyLeD is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5
Default How do you play in this (Sungha) "style" (percussive melody).

Specifically, this song (we all know who Sungha is ^^):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaslUplAi-E
at 0:37 and on.

I'm hearing the percussive sound the same time he plays a note...is this a skill I have to acquire, or my mind messing with me? I've already asked some people IRL, some say he's alternating tapping the strings and playing the notes (I can emulate that), but others say he's both tapping and striking a specific string...which I can't do no matter how I try.

Can someone help me out? I've searched the forums, but the 4 pages I got on Sungha is mainly on how amazing he is, not how to play in a similar style. It's been bothering me. Thanks!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 04-14-2011, 03:54 PM
stanron stanron is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,972
Default

The percussive sound comes from tapping strings with the flat part of fingernails. If you tap on muted strings you get a snare drum sound and if you tap on a fretted or open string you can get the notes.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-14-2011, 08:52 PM
SimplyLuo's Avatar
SimplyLuo SimplyLuo is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: State College, PA
Posts: 926
Default

He's tapping the thumb pick between the 6th and 5th strings while playing the notes with the backs of his nails, all in one movement. So you do the percussion with the thumb, and push out through the strings with your other fingers at the same time. Pretty common technique, certainly not limited to Sungha Jung
__________________
Jon Luo
www.youtube.com/simplyluo
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-14-2011, 09:30 PM
StyLeD StyLeD is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SimplyLuo View Post
He's tapping the thumb pick between the 6th and 5th strings while playing the notes with the backs of his nails, all in one movement. So you do the percussion with the thumb, and push out through the strings with your other fingers at the same time. Pretty common technique, certainly not limited to Sungha Jung
Do you know a video or some online tutorial that teaches this technique? I cant seem to get the hang of it, the thumbpick won't make the percussive sound unless I put alot more energy into it than I think I should have.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-14-2011, 10:05 PM
joehempel joehempel is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 427
Default

You have to put a ton of energy in to it, it comes not only from the pick but from the strings hitting against the frets.

You also have to have good finger control so you don't over-power with the strings. But he is ALSO hitting the bridge with the heel of his hand so it gives it something deeper.

VERY TOUGH to do, but then again he's no human...so.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-15-2011, 07:52 PM
SimplyLuo's Avatar
SimplyLuo SimplyLuo is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: State College, PA
Posts: 926
Default

There shouldn't be a ton of energy at all. Very little is required. Too much, and your hand movement is limited and not fluid. It's about speed and placement

I don't know of any videos that teach it. If you use Skype, maybe we could video chat sometime and I could try to help
__________________
Jon Luo
www.youtube.com/simplyluo
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-16-2011, 03:32 AM
JonPR JonPR is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 3,862
Default

It seems to be a combination of thumbpick and fingernails. However I've seen other players use this technique (or something very similar) without a thumbpick. Esp my personal hero of the style:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Qnje...ec_grec_index-
- he's getting a similar sound mostly by tapping the strings with fingertips or the side of this thumb. You get a good view from 0:55.

Here's another, where you see the more direct downward hit with the fingertips, combined with slightly fancier fingerpicking:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o1kWi...eature=related
What's happening in the main is that he's bringing the fingertips down together to strike the strings, and then picking them to produce the chord. Ie, he hits the strings he's about to pick. Occasionally he adds more emphasis with a strumming stroke, so the strike has more impact.
You can get that "clicky" sound more by striking the string with the side of thumb, so - as joehempel says - it hits the fretboard before you pick it. You shouldn't need a lot of energy for this (but it does depend on your string guage and action!)

IMO, it's not a very difficult technique, being a combination of fingerpicking with strumming - as if you get bored with that "nice" fingerstyle technique and decide to move your arm more like a strumming move: but retain the fingerstyle hand shape (maybe curling the fingers inwards more). The fingers will naturally hit the strings with some force - you just need to hang on to them (stay in contact with the strings momentarily after you strike them, so they're muted) and then pick them.
As I say, you can either use the backs of the fingernails - in which case they essentially strum downwards a little while you simultaneously mute with the side of your palm (as in the Sungha video) - or you use your fingertips to come straight down on the strings you intend to pick (as John Martyn mostly does).
You can get that "chck" sound either way, and the strings don't actually all need to hit the frets - of course it's more effective if they do, but it works if only the bass string hits the frets.

As usual with right-hand techniques, the flamenco players have total command of this kind of thing:
0:54 (and on) here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmcjAGJOPR0

Last edited by JonPR; 04-16-2011 at 03:55 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-16-2011, 03:48 AM
Ozwick Ozwick is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 44
Default

Check this video out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8_ldh4lJk8
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-16-2011, 03:57 AM
JonPR JonPR is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 3,862
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozwick View Post
Excellent! - not seen that one before.
I notice he's not using a fingerpick, and the hit can be from the palm alone, and when he does hit with fingernails the chord can ring - needn't be muted. (That's a choice of course - John Martyn generally muted the strings as he hit)
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-16-2011, 04:57 AM
stanron stanron is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,972
Default

Nice to see the John Martyn clips. Was that Danny Thompson on double bass in the second one?. I know they toured together at one time. I never saw any of those gigs but I've heard there were some wild times.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 04-16-2011, 03:56 PM
Pida Pida is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 34
Default

This technique is very important for the playing styles of guitarists such as Sungha Jung, Tomi Paldanius (who offers a DVD on this technique, which he calls "Beat Tap") and Adam Rafferty (Check out Billie Jean and Superstition). Another well known example is California Dreaming played by Michael Chapdelaine - that's the tune I learned this technique with.

The Justinguitar and John Martyn videos posted earlier in this thread do not show what is so special about it: A note and a percussive sound are produced at the same time. And that's the hard part: You need to coordinate the thumb and fingers of your right hand in a way that might feel weird at first.

How to do it:

Usually, but not necessarily, a thumb pick is used.

The sound is produced by hitting the strings with your right hand thumb (pick) to make them touch the frets. 90% of the sound is generated by the contact between strings and frets, not by the contact between your thumb (pick) and the strings.
It's much easier to achieve this sound on the bass strings and it is sufficient to use a single string. Mostly only the low E string is played in such a way that the tip of the thumb pick (if one is used) will land between the E and A strings.

EDIT: Just came back from a workshop with Adam Rafferty and realized there are at least two approaches:
- He plays these clicks just as if he wanted to play a note on the string: The pick moves into the direction of the A string and the top. He touches the E string with the top of the pick.
- Till this day, I just moved the pick in the direction of the top. I touched the string with the base part of the pick and/ or with the side of my thumb.

Adams action is very low; his way probably won't work with a medium/ high action.


It is not necessary to mute the string with the left hand. The string can be muted by resting the right hand thumb on the string for a short moment, as is usually done. Alternatively, the thumb can bounce away from the string immediately after touching it. This way, both the percussive sound and whatever note you are fretting are produced. I think Adam Rafferty does so when he plays the A (low E string, 5th fret) in the intro to Billie Jean.

I suggest to start with strummed chords. Play downstrokes with the nails of your index finger (you might also use your middle and/ or ring finger) and do the percussive thing at the very same moment.
-0--0--0--0--
-0--0--0--0--
-0--0--0--0--
-------------
-------------
-x--x--x--x-- etc.


Later on, pick some notes instead of strumming chords. This was much harder for me in the beginning - I guess because thumb and fingers have to move in the opposite direction. It might help to allow your right hand fingers touch the string quite a while before plaing it. The verse of California Dreaming starts like this:
-------------
-------------
-2--4--2--0--
-------------
-------------
-x-----x-----


Next, play some arpeggios:
-------0-----
----1-----1--
-2-----------
-------------
-------------
-x----------- etc.

-------0-----
----1-----1--
-2-----------
-------------
-------------
-x-----x----- etc.


Most important: Play very slowly at first!

Last edited by Pida; 04-30-2011 at 08:02 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 04-17-2011, 05:14 PM
Johnny Lee Johnny Lee is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: New York City
Posts: 15
Default

Very good tutorial Pida. I'm gonna try this out today. It's definitely a challenge to get the percussive noise and the notes ringing out at the same time.
__________________
My writings on guitar --> No B.S. Guitar
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 04-18-2011, 01:24 AM
Odie1974 Odie1974 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Cracow, Poland
Posts: 196
Default

I have tried it yesterday - thanx Pida for the tutorial.

The "strummed chords" part is fairly easy to get the hang of - you just need to ensure that the trebles do not ring out too loud and don't overpower the percussive bass string(s). I found that using one finger for trebles (middle finger for me) works best.

But the next step - percussive note + single note pluck is not easy to do. Will take some focused practice definitiely.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 04-23-2011, 08:31 AM
news_watch news_watch is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 203
Default

StyleD,
Try this video. It helped me out when just starting out.
The slap and note come at the same time.
Justin's video alternates.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_AXlHOXhCc

There are others on u-tube, but this one show get you started.

Tab it out and you will be able to follow it a little better. You won't have to try and keep up with the dude on the video.

nw
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 04-24-2011, 06:29 AM
geronimotwo geronimotwo is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: currently living in the western catskill mountains
Posts: 91
Default

does anyone know what type of finger picks sungha is using? the ones i've seen would not allow you to strike the strings like that.
__________________
the worst enemy of good is better
taylor big baby
martin d-15s
rainsong om-1000
Reply With Quote
Reply

  The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > RECORD

Thread Tools



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:26 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, The Acoustic Guitar Forum
vB Ad Management by =RedTyger=