Vintage vrs New - Amps!

Live4Guitars · #1 09-13-2012, 02:22 PM

Hey All! I have been silently reading posts for years and I finally have a question worth asking! Ha ha...anyway. I have a 1972 Twin, 1972 Delux, and a 1973 vibrolux but recently I have heard non stop how the new hand to hand wired amps by the smaller companies are just as good. Anyone agree? Any suggestions? Anyone disagree? Thanks!!

jseth · #2 09-13-2012, 03:03 PM

Well, with that line up of amplifiers, you've pretty much got the bases covered, I would think... the whole reason that all the boutique amp builders have flourished is due to the questionable manufacturing techniques of "commercially" available guitar amps... MANY of those high end units use the amps you already have as templates for their products...

I know that the Deluxe Reverb was pretty much "left alone" by the marauding CBS engineers until the late 70's; what you have (I have a '73 SF DR) is the way they'd been making them for a long time... I don't know what modifications "they" gave the Vibrolux, but I do know that amp is still highly prized and sought after... the changes to the Twin Reverb are numerous and fairly well documented, but still, a '72 Twin is a sweet unit; '72 is prior to the Master Volume that showed up later, yes?

One area that the boutique builders have covered well: the small wattage tube amps that put out 5-10 watts, many with variable wattage settings, that allow the user to "dime" the volume for that intensely overdriven sound, without the accompanying volume threshold... and, other than being smaller and more portable (for the little amps, now) that's about the only part of the "new" amps that you don't have covered... oh, they have sweet channel switching and a bunch of different controls for gain, saturation, blah blah blah... but they have absolutely NOTHING on your current stable of old Fenders!!!

Just my opinion, but there it is!

Welcome to the AGF, by the way... although mostly about acoustic insturments, it's by far the most well-mannered discussion forum I've had experience with... see you around "the halls"!!!

play on....................................>

John Seth Sherman

muscmp · #3 09-14-2012, 11:01 PM

i have to give kudos to john as i could not have responded any better at all!

i'd even agree that you may wish to search out a smaller wattage amp to add to your arsenal as they do give you another avenue.

play music!

Teleplucker · #4 09-14-2012, 11:07 PM

I have a lot of fender amps, tweed, blackface and silverface. I also own a DrZ Maz 18jr, it is a great amp and I think it would be hard to go wrong with any of the amps in the Dr Z lineup.

I have heard good things about the other boutique companies as well.

Jeff Scott · #5 09-16-2012, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jseth

I know that the Deluxe Reverb was pretty much "left alone" by the marauding CBS engineers until the late 70's;

John Seth Sherman

My understanding is that only the Princeton Reverb Amp was untouched until the late '70s.

J Patrick · #6 09-17-2012, 08:24 AM

...the current state of amplifier production is much like the guitar building world....its a golden age of sorts and many amp builders from large companies to basement hobbyists are designing and constructing amazing amps...i have a 65 Deluxe Reverb so I have a good amp to compare new ones to...there are not a whole lot of amps that sound better but there are a lot of amps that sound just as good....some are simpler some are more advanced....some are cleaner some are dirtier....you can get really specific with your personal needs and tastes....and you can spend a little money or a small fortune doing it....add to that the explosion of pedal builders and there are an infinite variety of tones to be had...at the end of the day it still takes a good guitarist to make em sound good...

blue · #7 09-17-2012, 11:01 AM

Hand wired is hand wired. Components now are more consistent, and frankly, Fender was never known for being to too careful when it came to checking component specs

Are they as good? Yes. But the downside to consistency means that there aren't any more cases of say Kirk Hammett's twin "which sounds like no twin I've ever heard" or Kerry Kings original Beast Marshall. When they went to make the Kerry King signature model, and they tore his apart and checked components, the specs were interesting. Everything within tolerances, but a lot of things right on the cutoff line in either direction.

So yeah. You aren't getting mojo (tongue firmly in cheek) but quality components, put together well? Definitely as good as the old days. Before he closed down shop because it just wasn't worth it, Dario Gomez made some of the best Showman and Bassman clones on the market. If you can find a used one, jump on them.

HudsDad · #8 09-17-2012, 11:42 AM

My main musical hobby is building amps. I love to buy vintage amps from the late 50's - late 60's, inspect the circuits, test the components and replicate my own heads. Then I usually sell the original (unless it's a Vox or Hiwatt) for the same price I paid. If you're handy with a soldering iron and have a good knowledge of electrical circuits, it's a great way to get 99% of that "vintage" mojo without paying 99% of the "vintage" price.

Of course, not every vintage amp sounds great. There were a lot of stinkers back then, too. But I'd say the best Fender/Marshall/Vox/etc amps of that era are better than the best amps those companies are putting out today. And many of today's "boutique" amps, especially the sub-25W units, are as good or better than anything those companies have ever made, in my opinion.

lovetheclassics · #9 09-20-2012, 11:21 AM

What kind of music are you playing with your Fender Amps? Do use use effects like distortion, chorus, delay, etc?

What settings are you using on the amp Channel, drive, Volume?

I have a Hot Rod Deluxe III and this thing is way to loud for a garage when the drive/volume is set to give good sustain.

terrapin · #10 09-20-2012, 08:34 PM

ALOT of really good comments here, but on point that has been missed is reliability. I have a Morgan Custom '65 Deluxe Reverb clone and a Fargen '59 AC15 clone. Both are fabulous amps, but certainly no better than good examples of the originals. But, I have friends with vintage amps that sound incredible WHEN they are working properly.....But, that is a big WHEN! My buddy's '66 Deluxe Reverb is seemingly always in he shop. My Morgan and Fargen are built like brick walls, and are SO reliable and dependable. That is worth ALOT to me!

815C · #11 09-29-2012, 06:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by terrapin

ALOT of really good comments here, but on point that has been missed is reliability. I have a Morgan Custom '65 Deluxe Reverb clone and a Fargen '59 AC15 clone. Both are fabulous amps, but certainly no better than good examples of the originals. But, I have friends with vintage amps that sound incredible WHEN they are working properly.....But, that is a big WHEN! My buddy's '66 Deluxe Reverb is seemingly always in he shop. My Morgan and Fargen are built like brick walls, and are SO reliable and dependable. That is worth ALOT to me!

For me its been the opposite. I have been gigging with a '68 Bassman head and an early 80s Roland JC-55 for years with no problems at all. My Dr Z Stang Ray - which is new in comparison - has died on me twice in big gigs and been to the shop 4 times for problems. The Z sounds awesome, but I don't gig with it much anymore as I've lost my trust in its reliability.

dchristo · #12 09-29-2012, 06:59 AM

when I bought this "Vintage Sound Amp", I sold all my Fender amps

zabdart · #13 09-29-2012, 08:31 AM

Well, as almost everybody knows, various amp manufacturers redesigned the circuits of various model amps over the years. This was true of Fender even before the CBS takeover. The original Marshall amps were pretty much variants of the Fender Bassman 5F6A circuit... but that's been left way behind.
If smaller manufacturers are "better" at producing "vintage" amps, it's because they've tried to replicate older, "vintage" circuit design.

Tone Gopher · #14 09-29-2012, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Live4Guitars

Hey All! I have been silently reading posts for years and I finally have a question worth asking! Ha ha...anyway. I have a 1972 Twin, 1972 Delux, and a 1973 vibrolux but recently I have heard non stop how the new hand to hand wired amps by the smaller companies are just as good. Anyone agree? Any suggestions? Anyone disagree? Thanks!!

I wouldn't consider '72 as "vintage" but maybe that's because I still have T-shirts older than that.

Check out The Amp Garage for a group of dedicated amp builders.

http://ampgarage.com/forum/

If you are looking for some excellent tweed sounds, check out Mission Amps for a wonderful 5E3 kit.

http://missionamps.com/

sweiss · #15 09-29-2012, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tone Gopher

I wouldn't consider '72 as "vintage" but maybe that's because I still have T-shirts older than that.

I don't have a t-shirt from 72...but I did buy a used silverface 72 Twin in 73. I remember being a little hesitant because I wanted a blackface rather than one of these newfangled things.

I'm a bit skeptical when it comes to "vintage" electric guitars and amps. A lot of that stuff was nothing special when it was new, so what's happened to it over the years to make it so great? Nothing. Wood can certainly age and improve, but not so much with electronics. IMO...the best guitars and amps are being made right now.