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  #1  
Old 10-13-2022, 02:45 AM
Mds53 Mds53 is offline
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Default Compensated Biscuit Saddle

My new used National 0 Style is causing me a little frustration with tuning, so I wondered about the availability of a compensated saddle for the biscuit.

I searched AGF and found an enormous amount of info on intonation, but not this exact question, so I wrote to two experts on the topic. Both of these fine gentlemen got back to me within a day, with a solution, and I want to thank them publicly.

Bob Colosi of guitarsaddles.com and Catfish Keith of catfishkeith.com both informed me that National Resophonic Guitars now offers a compensated maple biscuit saddle as an aftermarket replacement. I've ordered one (photo attached) and I will post the results when it arrives.

Thanks Bob and Keith!!!

By the way, National's website has a detailed instruction sheet on how to adjust the saddle and install it. Can't wait to use it.
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  #2  
Old 10-13-2022, 03:54 AM
Howard Emerson Howard Emerson is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mds53 View Post
My new used National 0 Style is causing me a little frustration with tuning, so I wondered about the availability of a compensated saddle for the biscuit.

I searched AGF and found an enormous amount of info on intonation, but not this exact question, so I wrote to two experts on the topic. Both of these fine gentlemen got back to me within a day, with a solution, and I want to thank them publicly.

Bob Colosi of guitarsaddles.com and Catfish Keith of catfishkeith.com both informed me that National Resophonic Guitars now offers a compensated maple biscuit saddle as an aftermarket replacement. I've ordered one (photo attached) and I will post the results when it arrives.

Thanks Bob and Keith!!!

By the way, National's website has a detailed instruction sheet on how to adjust the saddle and install it. Can't wait to use it.
Back in 2013 or so I purchased a "used" National Resolectric Junior that was virtually unplayed, but I had grand ideas for it. First, though, it needed to play more in tune so made my own bone overlay for the biscuit 'stub'.



Then I slotted the bone blank:



Then it was basically shaped:



And finally intonated:



It would have been far easier to have used a piece of maple, of course, but to paraphrase Tina Turner 'We never do anything nice and easy'......

Best of luck with your new National Biscuit!

Regards,
Howard Emerson
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Last edited by Howard Emerson; 10-13-2022 at 04:07 AM.
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Old 10-13-2022, 06:13 AM
Mds53 Mds53 is offline
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Well done Howard. I was afraid I would have to make one until the National biscuit came to my attention. Catfish Keith said this new biscuit only came out about a year ago, so you are way ahead of the curve.
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Old 10-13-2022, 06:44 AM
Silly Moustache Silly Moustache is offline
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Fascinating stuff. I may be tempted but sadly many US based companies now refuse to ship to the UK.
I believe it may be due to some irritating change of the UK import requirements rather than antagonism.
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Old 10-13-2022, 02:07 PM
Howard Emerson Howard Emerson is offline
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Originally Posted by Silly Moustache View Post
Fascinating stuff. I may be tempted but sadly many US based companies now refuse to ship to the UK.
I believe it may be due to some irritating change of the UK import requirements rather than antagonism.
Andy,
If you can’t otherwise obtain one commercially I’d be happy to buy one for you and ship it marked as a gift. You’d just PayPal me whatever the receipts come to.

Just a thought.

Best,
Howard Emerson
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  #6  
Old 10-26-2022, 07:53 PM
Mds53 Mds53 is offline
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Default Compensated biscuit saddle installed!

I can report on the installed biscuit saddle I bought from National to improve intonation on my National 0 style. I am happy with it!

The saddle came in a box complete with all parts I needed plus instructions, and a mahogany spacer to help with setup. The saddle was maple and was CNC cut and fit perfectly into the shaped biscuit slot.

The toughest step was to get the original biscuit off the cone as it was glued. The cone is very delicate and easily bent or dinged, so I used a hair dryer on the inside to soften the glue. Still I needed to carefully pry around the edges until it finally popped off. Some. Very minor distortions, and I needed to remove glue residue from the cone.

The instructions were clear on how to mark the saddle for proper string height. I ended up removing about 3/16" from the bottom of the saddle, and it is nearly perfect clearance. They included sandpaper to shorten the saddle, but I'm too impatient and used a small dovetail saw.

The kit was $49 plus shipping from National, but I'm happy with the improved intonation, and I feel like it was an improvement that doesn't compromise the "original" condition of this 2013 0 style.

I would definitely recommend this upgrade if you are struggling with some of your strings sounding sour in some positions. It's not perfect, but it is better.
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Old 10-27-2022, 05:10 AM
Howard Emerson Howard Emerson is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mds53 View Post
I can report on the installed biscuit saddle I bought from National to improve intonation on my National 0 style. I am happy with it!

The saddle came in a box complete with all parts I needed plus instructions, and a mahogany spacer to help with setup. The saddle was maple and was CNC cut and fit perfectly into the shaped biscuit slot.

The toughest step was to get the original biscuit off the cone as it was glued. The cone is very delicate and easily bent or dinged, so I used a hair dryer on the inside to soften the glue. Still I needed to carefully pry around the edges until it finally popped off. Some. Very minor distortions, and I needed to remove glue residue from the cone.

The instructions were clear on how to mark the saddle for proper string height. I ended up removing about 3/16" from the bottom of the saddle, and it is nearly perfect clearance. They included sandpaper to shorten the saddle, but I'm too impatient and used a small dovetail saw.

The kit was $49 plus shipping from National, but I'm happy with the improved intonation, and I feel like it was an improvement that doesn't compromise the "original" condition of this 2013 0 style.

I would definitely recommend this upgrade if you are struggling with some of your strings sounding sour in some positions. It's not perfect, but it is better.
Aren't you glad you have a removable cover-plate strap?? At least I'm assuming yours had the removable strap.....

It's a complete pain in the neck to do work like this on the older Nationals where the bridge strap was part of the cover-plate stamping!

Regards,
Howard Emerson
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  #8  
Old 10-27-2022, 07:27 AM
Mds53 Mds53 is offline
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Yes Howard, the bridge cover is removable from the cover plate, so access to the saddle is easy. For some reason they used Allen head screws on the bridge cover, but Phillip's head on the coverplate. Took me a bit of time to find the small allen.

After I glued the biscuit to the cone, I reassembled the coverplate and tailpiece and could easily work on the saddle. Once the saddle was trimmed to the proper height, i could fine tune before reattaching the bridge cover.

I listened to your compositions on your website and really enjoy your writing and playing. Thanks for your comments.
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  #9  
Old 10-27-2022, 07:50 AM
darkwave darkwave is offline
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I did something very similar myself on my cheapo resonator. I have a custom 3D printed cover plate that does away with the strap (so I can palm mute) and I made a completely new biscuit using cross-grained cedar to keep things very light. It originally had a glued-in ebony saddle but I've recently replaced it with a slightly wider rosewood slide-in saddle that looks a lot like yours. Plays and sounds great up the neck...



Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Emerson View Post
Back in 2013 or so I purchased a "used" National Resolectric Junior that was virtually unplayed, but I had grand ideas for it. First, though, it needed to play more in tune so made my own bone overlay for the biscuit 'stub'.



Then I slotted the bone blank:



Then it was basically shaped:



And finally intonated:



It would have been far easier to have used a piece of maple, of course, but to paraphrase Tina Turner 'We never do anything nice and easy'......

Best of luck with your new National Biscuit!

Regards,
Howard Emerson
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- Douglas C.

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1977 Gibson MK-35
2020 Breedlove Wildwood Concertina
2003 Guild JF30-12
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2005 Rogue Biscuit Resonator
1960's Harmony Patrician Archtop
2008 Eastman AR810-7 Archtop
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