Compression on vocals, before or after recording? Or not at all?

[rockabilly69]

My vocal chain typically is very simple, most of the time I use whatever mic I choose into a Manley Voxbox. Tha Manley has a very good compressor with a somewhat program dependent ratio but is generally speaking a 3:1, which is, to me, optimized for vocal recording. I set it at it's fastest attack, with a medium release for most recordings. But I use a high threshold so it only comes on when needed for the most dynamic of singers. Like Bob Womack, when I'm working for clients with a wide dynamic range, I ride the fader if need be. Not only do I track with compression, the Manley has a Pultec style EQ in it and I've been know to use a bit of that while recording.

In some instances, I use other preamps that don't have compression for character, like the Presonus ADL600, with that I use a DBX160SL, which is the CLEANEST compressor I've ever heard, and helps retain the cool preamp sound of the ADL600.

With my very grittty Sebatron VMP4000e, I run all 4 channels into a Drawmer DL441 which is always set to a high threshold, but set to hard knee and I use it as a peak limiter! The compressors rarely kick on, but when they do I am glad they are on for tracking. They've saved my bacon more than once.

And like Kevwind, I have a Langevin DVC which has a solid state version of the Manley ELOP compressor. The DVC also has EQ which I use all the time while recording.

If I'm using a brighter vocal mic (Rode Classic II, or any of the other Rodes NTK, K2, etc), I sometimes use a Drawmer 1960 preamp, which tames those mics of their sibilant character, but still retains the clarity. The Drawmer has a compressor that is part of it's signature sound.

And in my home studio I have two Focusrite ISA Ones running directly into the two channels of an old ART Dual Levelor, which is set only to come on when high peaks. The old Levelors are kind of a sleeper, very inexpensive, but VERY GOOD sounding compressor. They are set to fast, and compress, as opposed to auto and limit. Check out this review I read years ago.... https://web.archive.org/web/20150608...rtlevelar.html They really work well with the ISA Ones! These are two pieces of gear that typically get panned by a lot of people, but I have made some great recordings, especially vocals, with just this setup! The Dual Levalors really do something when combined with the ISA Ones! So as you can see most every preamp that I have is setup with what I feel are the best compressors to get the job done. And what I mean by get the job done is, save the track from going into the red, while at the same time imparting as little compression artifacts (pumping, breathing, etc) as possible.

Once the signal is into the DAW, I have plenty of good sounding plug-ins to work with (Waves API-2500, Puigtech Fairchild, SSL-Comps, H-Comp, CLA-2A, R-Comp, etc).

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by rockabilly69

My vocal chain typically is very simple, most of the time I use whatever mic I choose into a Manley Voxbox. Tha Manley has a very good compressor with a somewhat program dependent ratio but is generally speaking a 3:1, which is, to me, optimized for vocal recording. I set it at it's fastest attack, with a medium release for most recordings. But I use a high threshold so it only comes on when needed for the most dynamic of singers. Like Bob Womack, when I'm working for clients with a wide dynamic range, I ride the fader if need be. Not only do I track with compression, the Manley has a Pultec style EQ in it and I've been know to use a bit of that while recording.

In some instances, I use other preamps that don't have compression for character, like the Presonus ADL600, with that I use a DBX160SL, which is the CLEANEST compressor I've ever heard, and helps retain the cool preamp sound of the ADL600.

With my very grittty Sebatron VMP4000e, I run all 4 channels into a Drawmer DL441 which is always set to a high threshold, but set to hard knee and I use it as a peak limiter! The compressors rarely kick on, but when they do I am glad they are on for tracking. They've saved my bacon more than once.

And like Kevwind, I have a Langevin DVC which has a solid state version of the Manley ELOP compressor. The DVC also has EQ which I use all the time while recording.

If I'm using a brighter vocal mic (Rode Classic II, or any of the other Rodes NTK, K2, etc), I sometimes use a Drawmer 1960 preamp, which tames those mics of their sibilant character, but still retains the clarity. The Drawmer has a compressor that is part of it's signature sound.

And in my home studio I have two Focusrite ISA Ones running directly into the two channels of an old ART Dual Levelor, which is set only to come on when high peaks. The old Levelors are kind of a sleeper, very inexpensive, but VERY GOOD sounding compressor. They are set to fast, and compress, as opposed to auto and limit. Check out this review I read years ago.... https://web.archive.org/web/20150608...rtlevelar.html They really work well with the ISA Ones! These are two pieces of gear that typically get panned by a lot of people, but I have made some great recordings, especially vocals, with just this setup! The Dual Levalors really do something when combined with the ISA Ones! So as you can see most every preamp that I have is setup with what I feel are the best compressors to get the job done. And what I mean by get the job done is, save the track from going into the red, while at the same time imparting as little compression artifacts (pumping, breathing, etc) as possible.

Once the signal is into the DAW, I have plenty of good sounding plug-ins to work with (Waves API-2500, Puigtech Fairchild, SSL-Comps, H-Comp, CLA-2A, R-Comp, etc).

Hey good to hear you like the Langvin DVC and I am amazed you remembered I have one also , but to clarify I don't actually record with mine (or haven't yet) , it is strictly used for when I play out at gigs, but I may give it whirl .

What I use for recording is an A Designs MP2A tube 2 channel mic pre, and now I have a IGS Audio 3U tube 2 channel Mastering Edition compressor that I am going to try some tracking with but I will do the two channel with one dry, that Bob was mentioning

[rockabilly69]

Originally Posted by KevWind

Hey good to hear you like the Langvin DVC and I am amazed you remembered I have one also , but to clarify I don't actually record with mine (or haven't yet) , it is strictly used for when I play out at gigs, but I may give it whirl .

What I use for recording is an A Designs MP2A tube 2 channel mic pre, and now I have a IGS Audio 3U tube 2 channel Mastering Edition compressor that I am going to try some tracking with but I will do the two channel with one dry, that Bob was mentioning

I remembered that you liked the DVC for live performing, because I thought it was a bit of overkill, but I can see where it would be a good tool for getting a great vocal sound expecially in a good room that didn't require heavy EQ. The built in comp really lends itself to vocals. I like the transparent pre in the DVC, listen how it lends itself to the acoustic tracks on this song (the voxbox was on my voice)...

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by rockabilly69

I remembered that you liked the DVC for live performing, because I thought it was a bit of overkill, but I can see where it would be a good tool for getting a great vocal sound expecially in a good room that didn't require heavy EQ. The built in comp really lends itself to vocals. I like the transparent pre in the DVC, listen how it lends itself to the acoustic tracks on this song (the voxbox was on my voice)...

Hey thats a great track, is that an original or cover ? in either case.

Ya I like the DVC for both my vocal and guitar live (don't know about "overkill" ) I have all ways subscribed to the "move up to the best sound you can reasonably afford" school of live music theory, regardless of what the room or audience may throw at you. As opposed the "move down to the lowest common denominator " school of thought.

[rockabilly69]

Originally Posted by KevWind

Hey thats a great track, is that an original or cover ? in either case.

Ya I like the DVC for both my vocal and guitar live (don't know about "overkill" ) I have all ways subscribed to the "move up to the best sound you can reasonably afford" school of live music theory, regardless of what the room or audience may throw at you. As opposed the "move down to the lowest common denominator " school of thought.

It's one of my original songs. It's about one of my close friend's crappy love life

I should explain my overkill statement. Soundwise, I could easily see using the DVC as long as I had enough EQ for the situation, and as you know the DVC is limited in it's EQ capability. So just using for the pre and comp without addressing my bigger concern, EQ, for live use would be overkill for ME. It was designed for more ideal conditions than live performance, so for me to make it work in the multitude of live situations I get into, I would have to add an EQ like the companion Pultec designed by Manley/Langevin, or at least something with sweepable mids and/or notch filtering. Typically cost is not a factor with me as I work so much I can typically budget for what I feel does the best job for me, with considerations being sound/form-factor/consistency. But there are quite a few preamps (Grace Felix comes to mind) with a much better form factor than the DVC which are more suitable for what I do as in 250 to 300 gigs a year in high end resorts, restaurants, etc. In bigger festivals, which I do throughout the year, I have rack gear which I send to the house guy. But, in live situations, in noisy environments, I find compression is less than ideal, sometimes causing more problems than it helps as it raises the noise floor, and sometimes actually worsening the runaway feedbacks (without the proper EQ). So in those conditions the only benefit I would get from the DVC is the clean preamp. Oh yeah, one more thing to mention, the thing is pretty heavy

As I said for recording, I love the DVC, it would get even more use than it does if I didn't have a VOXBOX, or a few other pres/comps that slightly edge it out. But when the DVC is RIGHT for a source, it sounds GREAT! On the song I posted, I love how it let me build up the guitars and mandolins without mud because of it's clean, but surely not boring SS sound.