CF input for a CF newbie

[Earl49]

Originally Posted by guitararmy

....A used CF guitar is basically new...

It would at least have a head start on the 50,000 year tonal "opening up" process.

[email4eric]

Originally Posted by lizzard

Always have been a wood guy. But life changes. I'm keeping my last wood guitar and I want to protect it from the elements. I'm considering a CF FOR THE BEACH, campfires, the cold, the humid, etc...

What sounds most "natural" and whose fit,finish,playability would you recommend ? It's not like they are all in a shop nearby to A/B

Thanks!

Let me preface this by saying I do not own nor have I ever played a CF guitar. I hope I don't garner disfavor in that regard. I have, however, listened to a LOT of CF guitars on YouTube, this forum, and on manufacturer websites.

I am REALLY interested in the concept of owning/playing a CF guitar. I'd buy one in a heartbeat. I tend toward "woody" guitars like Gibsons, Martin 15 series and the like -- guitars less bright than any Taylor (not dissing Taylor -- just using it as a well-known "brightness" reference).

I've found that all CF guitars I've listened to are well to the bright side of those wood guitars I like and play and in fact are either comparable to, or exceed, Taylor in terms of brightness.

I long to hear a CF guitar that trends toward a lusty, Mahogany-like vibe.

Perhaps if I put the time in pursuing a large sample of CF guitars and cataloged that effort in detail, I could weed them out better. But at this point and having not done that, I'm still pretty sure that nearly all CF guitars trend and cluster distinctly toward a brighter tone.

I post this simply to state that if you mean darker/woodier when you state "natural," then in my listening experience, there currently are no CF guitars yet that definitively trend that way.

Some suggest that comparisons to wood is futile -- that CF is unique. I get that but the standard to which CF is compared is indeed wood and it makes sense to use wood guitars as a tonal reference when figuring-out CF tone.

As such, I monitor this forum and keep hoping for a CF breakthrough as the material and its stability over wood is indeed compelling!

[Acousticado]

Originally Posted by email4eric

Let me preface this by saying I do not own nor have I ever played a CF guitar. I hope I don't garner disfavor in that regard. I have, however, listened to a LOT of CF guitars on YouTube, this forum, and on manufacturer websites.

I am REALLY interested in the concept of owning/playing a CF guitar. I'd buy one in a heartbeat. I tend toward "woody" guitars like Gibsons, Martin 15 series and the like -- guitars less bright than any Taylor (not dissing Taylor -- just using it as a well-known "brightness" reference).

I've found that all CF guitars I've listened to are well to the bright side of those wood guitars I like and play and in fact are either comparable to, or exceed, Taylor in terms of brightness.

I long to hear a CF guitar that trends toward a lusty, Mahogany-like vibe.

Perhaps if I put the time in pursuing a large sample of CF guitars and cataloged that effort in detail, I could weed them out better. But at this point and having not done that, I'm still pretty sure that nearly all CF guitars trend and cluster distinctly toward a brighter tone.

I post this simply to state that if you mean darker/woodier when you state "natural," then in my listening experience, there currently are no CF guitars yet that definitively trend that way.

Some suggest that comparisons to wood is futile -- that CF is unique. I get that but the standard to which CF is compared is indeed wood and it makes sense to use wood guitars as a tonal reference when figuring-out CF tone.

As such, I monitor this forum and keep hoping for a CF breakthrough as the material and its stability over wood is indeed compelling!

Eric, you may want to follow the ekoa guitars by Blackbird...the El Capitan full size and the newly released smaller model, the Savoy. The build material is not CF, but a unique linen material that looks like wood, and most report sounds like it too. There are some recent threads about the Savoy in particular.

[steelvibe]

Originally Posted by email4eric

Let me preface this by saying I do not own nor have I ever played a CF guitar. I hope I don't garner disfavor in that regard. I have, however, listened to a LOT of CF guitars on YouTube, this forum, and on manufacturer websites.

I am REALLY interested in the concept of owning/playing a CF guitar. I'd buy one in a heartbeat. I tend toward "woody" guitars like Gibsons, Martin 15 series and the like -- guitars less bright than any Taylor (not dissing Taylor -- just using it as a well-known "brightness" reference).

I've found that all CF guitars I've listened to are well to the bright side of those wood guitars I like and play and in fact are either comparable to, or exceed, Taylor in terms of brightness.

I long to hear a CF guitar that trends toward a lusty, Mahogany-like vibe.

Perhaps if I put the time in pursuing a large sample of CF guitars and cataloged that effort in detail, I could weed them out better. But at this point and having not done that, I'm still pretty sure that nearly all CF guitars trend and cluster distinctly toward a brighter tone.

I post this simply to state that if you mean darker/woodier when you state "natural," then in my listening experience, there currently are no CF guitars yet that definitively trend that way.

Some suggest that comparisons to wood is futile -- that CF is unique. I get that but the standard to which CF is compared is indeed wood and it makes sense to use wood guitars as a tonal reference when figuring-out CF tone.

As such, I monitor this forum and keep hoping for a CF breakthrough as the material and its stability over wood is indeed compelling!

I've seen this wood vs. CF narrative since I've taken interest in CF myself. For the record, I never played a single CF guitar until 2013- that was a RainSong Shorty. Not too much later I played an older N1-neck RainSong Jumbo. So all in all I just don't have dos centavos to even offer on the differences from one CF make and model to another.

What I do know is this, and this is something you confirm in your statement as well; CF is unique. However, it is not only true in form and function, it is also true in tone (obviously). But alas, that is not a bad thing! However, I suspect that nothing is going to change your mind about that until you have one in your hands. I'm not terrible at using descriptive terms to explain what I'm saying- but as it turns out I'm not great at it either. You just have to have a RainSong in your hands (or put your brand of CF or composite manufacturer there). In fairness to "figuring-out CF tone" (or composite), no youtube video will cut it, nor will hearing some CF enthusiast on AGF talk about his stinkin' guitar.

What you learn about why CF makes sense in form and function goes by the wayside- I'm serious. You fall in love with the tone, the clarity, the sustain, the weight, the feel, the brightness, the upper register! While they might not have the soul of a good wood guitar, they have....well....there I go again trying to find the descriptives, but they do have the soul of a composite guitar. I don't know what the snake oil is, but I know that it makes guys spend up to $2K or more and many of them sell off their woodies once they take the bait. We are onto something here and are not even 25 years into R&D for making great composite guitars. I'll bet you my next guitar that you will find yours...and soon

[email4eric]

Yes! Thanks Tom!

I have listened to sound recordings of those new material guitars. I still think that they trend greatly toward the bright side but acknowledge that they have a difference.

I wonder what sort of material (in the composite world) would diverge from the current trend tonally.

It's exciting stuff. Hope folks continue to innovate and perhaps introduce new tonal materials.

It can only get better!

[Captain Jim]

Come for the humidity invincibility, stay for the tone.

For the record, I like "the Taylor tone" - still have 4 of them, and none sounds like the other. All of them sound like guitars... just like my 3 carbon fibers: all sound different from each other, all sound like guitars.

I agree - the carbon fiber manufacturers are on to something, and able to design for forward thinking, not replicating what has "always been done." (Really? Hide glue is "new and improved"??)

I am all about the comfort of a guitar, but it has to sound good, too. The carbon fiber guitars are my favorites... they bring it all!

[Strumalot]

And just a reminder of something that's been talked about a lot here, strings make a big difference on CFs when "dialing in" the tone you want.