Aches and pains.

[Silly Moustache]

I have suffered from rheumatism or some such since I was a small child. In 1983, I was attacked by a condition identified as Sarcoidosis, which affected my joints so badly that it stopped me playing music for ten years (missing out on the blossoming of the British bluegrass boom.

I have had steroid injections on my carpal tunnel problems for many years but now my right index finger and knuckle has become so painful that i am becoming scared of using my guitars. - I played last Thursday - badly, and last night - badly. It is like trying to play whilst receiving electric shocks - I can disguise my reaction to pain but I find it affects my concentration and I lose the drift of my lyrics.

When we arrived at the pub where last night's club was held, we foud outrszelves dining with an acquintance who has had to stop playing due to a sudden and dramatic attack of arthritis in his right hand and arm.

I sat and listened to two other people discussing cortisone injections.

My right elbow has become misshapen due to inflammation and gives me constant pain and simple things like washing my hands is becoming very unpleasant, and showering ., washing my hair and toweling down is grueling.

This morning I cancelled a rehearsal with the bluegrass band that I love playing with.

My doctor just phoned with the results of last week's blood test - it showed no evidence of inflammatory disease. He has also looked at how many cortisone jabs I've had and is reluctant to give me any more.

I am fast becoming fearful that my days of making music might be ending. This is my life. I am sixty-six.

I'm feeling a tad desperate at present.

Anybody got similar problems, Ideas? solutions?

[Larry Pattis]

I take "biologic" medication (as this family of medications is known) injections (currently Stelara) for Psoriatic Arthritis (and psoriasis, auto-immune disorders)...so I wonder if your diagnosis is of the AI family, and if there are any such biologics available for your condition...?

The formal name for the biologics is monoclonal antibodies. Your Rheumatologist should know about these.

These meds are rather expensive here in the US (about $15,000 every 8 weeks, at full retail), so I don't know what is available in the UK.

[DesolationAngel]

While not your age or at your level of pain, I have noticed an increase in physical discomfort in my left hand over the past couple of months to the point where it's distracting and causing me to enjoy playing. Frankly it's scaring me to death because... well... because. I have had no diagnosis (I haven't been to see anyone yet) but I am acutely aware of it and acutely aware of how easily it could curtail my music playing/making.

I've no first hand experience of this but I have heard tell that diet can play a role in joint issues. In particular, wheat. Might be worth looking into?

Hope you find some solutions and some help, chap.

[flaggerphil]

I'm 64 and have arthritis, literally, from my neck to my feet. Some is traumatic arthritis from injuries from three very bad accidents, some is courtesy of my family genes. Cold, wet weather makes it far worse, which is one of the reasons I live where I do.

Fortunately, though I have VERY bad traumatic arthritis in my left wrist, the arthritis in my hands is fairly mild. I have a hard time playing some barre chords but for the most part I can play ok. When it gets really bad I have some pain medication though I don't like to take it that often. Anti inflammation drugs don't seem to work that well with me. Sometimes I just can't play.

Don't have solutions, but do understand what you're going through.

[ewalling]

I've recently developed pain in my left arm, vaguely located in the bicep area. Lifting the arm has become a delicate operation, and showering and putting on shirts and socks have to be done with care. So far, it hasn't affected my guitar playing. I'm hoping it might 'pass', but who knows - I'm 56 and ripe for such ailments! I'm using Salonpas patches at the moment, and these seem to be quite effective.

[catdaddy]

SM- sorry to hear about your health problems. As a pharmacist I can tell you that there are a number of possible treatments for inflammatory diseases. However, the information that your doctor recently gave you concerning "...no evidence of inflammatory disease" seems to be contrary to what you're currently experiencing, so I'm a bit confused by that.

The first thing I would ask is whether you are currently taking any nonsteroidal anti-inflammatories such as ibuprofen, naproxen, aspirin, etc. Those can be helpful and do not have the same risks as using steroids (cortisone, prednisone and the like) which your doctor seems reluctant to use in your situation.

Secondly as Larry pointed out, if your diagnosis is of the autoimmune variety then other very different kinds of treatments can offer the promise of some success. Larry mentioned monoclonal antibody treatment but there are others that are also available and less expensive and can be quite effective, one such being the drug methotrexate.

It's also worth mentioning that even if you are experiencing debilitating symptoms right now, inflammatory diseases often go through periods of exacerbation and remission so perhaps your condition will not remain at its current level of discomfort but will abate significantly on its own given some time.

Hope you find something in the way of treatment that will help. In the mean time hang in there!

[Glennwillow]

Hi Andy,

I am really sorry to hear about your increasing aches and pains. You and I are very close in age (I am also 66, I turn 67 in 2.5 months), so I do understand about all those problems. But I am very sorry to hear that you might have to give up playing the guitar soon.

As Catdaddy (and others) noted above, sometimes arthritis issues, particular old-age, osteoarthritis, kind of comes in waves. Sometimes for me, my finger joints hurt so much that I simply cannot play. It's been like that lately for me. But it does seem that the intensity of pain after a while tapers off, and then it seems I can play again, though my finger joints keep looking more and more knobby.

For myself lately, I have to take some ibuprofen and then use a gel (Boltaren gel) on the finger joints that are really hurting, and then I can play.

My dad told me some years ago that he heard someone say (maybe Jack Benny?) that as we age, everything is just a patch job. And now that I am getting up there in years, though I don't think of myself as "old" yet, I understand that "patch job" comment even better.

Best wishes to you in managing your difficulties. I hope you can keep playing.

- Glenn

[Chicago Sandy]

SM, so sorry to hear of your health problems interfering with your music-making. Not sure whether National Health covers “biologic” meds, nor what metric your doc used to determine “no evidence of inflammatory disease.” Sedimentation rate is but one marker--there are clinical symptoms that can still occur even absent a diagnosis of rheumatoid arthritis. Steroid injections can cause muscles, tendons & ligaments to weaken or even atrophy, which is why many physicians won’t inject a particular spot more than three times.

There’s a type of NSAID called a “cox-2 inhibitor” that is easier on the GI system than conventional ones such as OTC naproxen or ibuprofen or Rx-only ones such as diclofenac, etc. The one I take to keep my torn-gastrocnemius pain at bay is Celebrex. There are topicals such as Voltaren (diclofenac) gel and spray--which on the Continent is OTC (Rx-only Stateside) and doesn’t get absorbed as readily into your gut as in pill form. I’ve also found menthol-and-capsaicin-based gels and rubs to work well (though I’ve gotten actual burns from salicylate patches like Salonpas). IcyHot, Sombra, and BioFreeze have worked well for me, as has Arnica gel.

Have you consulted a hand surgeon to determine if those knuckle problems might be tenosynovitis, or “trigger finger?” It’s a condition in which a nodule forms on the tendon and causes it to get hung up as it tries to move through the protective sheath as you flex and extend. The first line of treatment is steroid injection directly into the nodule--and the injections you previously received for carpal tunnel are not cumulative for other sites. If that fails, tendon-release surgery is quick and effective: in fact, it has the highest success rate of any surgery (higher than even cataract or impacted-molar extraction)! I had two injections into my “trigger thumb” (the second one to tide me over for only a month until I could schedule surgery) before having the surgery. I was playing dulcimer (actually part of my physical therapy, as it involves stretching without gripping) within two days and guitar again after my sutures were removed three weeks later.

[punkybub]

I'm also near your age group (just turned 60) and had the beginnings of similar problems - my knees and hips were increasingly painful and it was getting impossible to fully close my hand into a fist. Scared me to death if I thought about it, so I didn't!

I've found a couple of things that have helped and I've regained almost all the joint mobility I had lost over the years. Bear with me because it's non-traditional, anecdotal, unstudied and will likely cause general panic in the streets....or at least one of these ideas will. The other one has been around for centuries.

The first thing that helped is a set of Chinese Health Balls - they come in different sizes and weights, a pair of them, and they're supposed to be rolled around in your hand to stimulate the pressure points in your fingers and palms. The more you use them, the better the effect, and after a few hours the benefits were noticeable for me and my fingers worked much better. They're cheap, easy to find and well worth trying before other more dangerous and expensive options like steroids or surgery IMO.

This second suggestion is subject to the laws in your country/state, is virtually unknown to most at this point, and might put some off thanks to the shroud of mystery, misinformation and downright lies surrounding it over the last 80+ years. That thing is something we all have heard about, but my suggestion involves a form rarely if ever used and - to my knowledge - not yet studied.

The thing is cannabis, and the form I'm talking about is FRESH. Using FRESH cannabis causes no psychoactivity (it does not get the user high), and the physical and mental effects are shockingly opposite from what we've read or experienced using it dried and smoked or eaten. Whereas smoked/eaten cannabis typically causes sleep, "couch-lock", relaxation and psychoactivity - FRESH cannabis typically boosts energy, focus, stamina and has many other surprising health benefits, all without the high.

FRESH (like broccoli - never dried or heated, picked then immediately used or frozen) cannabis in a daily smoothie has effectively cured (yes, I said it!) my beginning arthritis - where I could only kneel with great pain and difficulty by leaning on things, after using FRESH cannabis (legally, since I'm in a MMJ state) I can now do a deep-knee bend, hitting my heels with my butt and get back up unaided and pain-free - like I could do when I was 20. I can also get up unaided from sitting cross legged on the floor - something I haven't been able to do for many years before fresh cannabis.

It's not only me who's found benefit from this, but close to two dozen others have found similar benefit from this plant used in this way.

Again - this is only for those living in areas where it's legal as I do not condone the breaking of any laws. Even then finding it fresh is difficult, due to it's typical use dried for it's psychoactive effect. Find a grower and ask them to freeze part of their next harvest for you. A small handful (7gm +/-) daily is what we typically use in a morning smoothie.

I began this after watching a YouTube video entitled, "Leaf" by Dr. Courtney. He suggests juicing cannabis leaf, but the amount of leaf needed for a glass of juice daily is prohibitive, and the active substances this plant contains are concentrated in the flowers as resin - so we decided to just include fresh flowers/buds in our smoothies instead.

Other benefits we've noticed along with increased range of motion is an increase in energy, depression is hugely decreased/cured(?), cuts heal faster and skin tone improves.

Too much to believe, I know.... I'm not selling anything, I don't want anyone to venture outside of their comfort zones or quit medications, break any laws, etc. but after the benefits I and others I know have experienced - this information needs to get out there.

I love acoustic guitars !

[Chicago Sandy]

Just a thought--have you tried glucosamine-chondroitin tablets?

[D. Shelton]

Originally Posted by punkybub

I'm also near your age group (just turned 60) and had the beginnings of similar problems - my knees and hips were increasingly painful and it was getting impossible to fully close my hand into a fist. Scared me to death if I thought about it, so I didn't!

I've found a couple of things that have helped and I've regained almost all the joint mobility I had lost over the years. Bear with me because it's non-traditional, anecdotal, unstudied and will likely cause general panic in the streets....or at least one of these ideas will. The other one has been around for centuries.

The first thing that helped is a set of Chinese Health Balls - they come in different sizes and weights, a pair of them, and they're supposed to be rolled around in your hand to stimulate the pressure points in your fingers and palms. The more you use them, the better the effect, and after a few hours the benefits were noticeable for me and my fingers worked much better. They're cheap, easy to find and well worth trying before other more dangerous and expensive options like steroids or surgery IMO.

This second suggestion is subject to the laws in your country/state, is virtually unknown to most at this point, and might put some off thanks to the shroud of mystery, misinformation and downright lies surrounding it over the last 80+ years. That thing is something we all have heard about, but my suggestion involves a form rarely if ever used and - to my knowledge - not yet studied.

The thing is cannabis, and the form I'm talking about is FRESH. Using FRESH cannabis causes no psychoactivity (it does not get the user high), and the physical and mental effects are shockingly opposite from what we've read or experienced using it dried and smoked or eaten. Whereas smoked/eaten cannabis typically causes sleep, "couch-lock", relaxation and psychoactivity - FRESH cannabis typically boosts energy, focus, stamina and has many other surprising health benefits, all without the high.

FRESH (like broccoli - never dried or heated, picked then immediately used or frozen) cannabis in a daily smoothie has effectively cured (yes, I said it!) my beginning arthritis - where I could only kneel with great pain and difficulty by leaning on things, after using FRESH cannabis (legally, since I'm in a MMJ state) I can now do a deep-knee bend, hitting my heels with my butt and get back up unaided and pain-free - like I could do when I was 20. I can also get up unaided from sitting cross legged on the floor - something I haven't been able to do for many years before fresh cannabis.

It's not only me who's found benefit from this, but close to two dozen others have found similar benefit from this plant used in this way.

Again - this is only for those living in areas where it's legal as I do not condone the breaking of any laws. Even then finding it fresh is difficult, due to it's typical use dried for it's psychoactive effect. Find a grower and ask them to freeze part of their next harvest for you. A small handful (7gm +/-) daily is what we typically use in a morning smoothie.

I began this after watching a YouTube video entitled, "Leaf" by Dr. Courtney. He suggests juicing cannabis leaf, but the amount of leaf needed for a glass of juice daily is prohibitive, and the active substances this plant contains are concentrated in the flowers as resin - so we decided to just include fresh flowers/buds in our smoothies instead.

Other benefits we've noticed along with increased range of motion is an increase in energy, depression is hugely decreased/cured(?), cuts heal faster and skin tone improves.

Too much to believe, I know.... I'm not selling anything, I don't want anyone to venture outside of their comfort zones or quit medications, break any laws, etc. but after the benefits I and others I know have experienced - this information needs to get out there.

I love acoustic guitars !

That's one of the more interesting things I've read in a while
As a clean/sober (since 1989) addict/alcoholic , the non-psychoactivity factor is the most intriguing part . This is something i will probably learn more about, but my knee-jerk reaction is "no, I can't use cannabis in any way, shape or form, because it's... cannabis" .

So, what about Hemp plants ?. Do you know if they have any similar medicinal attributes, or is it only the Reefer Madness kind of Cannabis that helps ?

[Twelvefret]

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

I have suffered from rheumatism or some such since I was a small child. In 1983, I was attacked by a condition identified as Sarcoidosis, which affected my joints so badly that it stopped me playing music for ten years (missing out on the blossoming of the British bluegrass boom.

I have had steroid injections on my carpal tunnel problems for many years but now my right index finger and knuckle has become so painful that i am becoming scared of using my guitars. - I played last Thursday - badly, and last night - badly. It is like trying to play whilst receiving electric shocks - I can disguise my reaction to pain but I find it affects my concentration and I lose the drift of my lyrics.

When we arrived at the pub where last night's club was held, we foud outrszelves dining with an acquintance who has had to stop playing due to a sudden and dramatic attack of arthritis in his right hand and arm.

I sat and listened to two other people discussing cortisone injections.

My right elbow has become misshapen due to inflammation and gives me constant pain and simple things like washing my hands is becoming very unpleasant, and showering ., washing my hair and toweling down is grueling.

This morning I cancelled a rehearsal with the bluegrass band that I love playing with.

My doctor just phoned with the results of last week's blood test - it showed no evidence of inflammatory disease. He has also looked at how many cortisone jabs I've had and is reluctant to give me any more.

I am fast becoming fearful that my days of making music might be ending. This is my life. I am sixty-six.

I'm feeling a tad desperate at present.

Anybody got similar problems, Ideas? solutions?

Consider a compounded pain cream.

[Larry Pattis]

Originally Posted by catdaddy

SM- sorry to hear about your health problems. As a pharmacist I can tell you that there are a number of possible treatments for inflammatory diseases. However, the information that your doctor recently gave you concerning "...no evidence of inflammatory disease" seems to be contrary to what you're currently experiencing, so I'm a bit confused by that.

The first thing I would ask is whether you are currently taking any nonsteroidal anti-inflammatories such as ibuprofen, naproxen, aspirin, etc. Those can be helpful and do not have the same risks as using steroids (cortisone, prednisone and the like) which your doctor seems reluctant to use in your situation.

Secondly as Larry pointed out, if your diagnosis is of the autoimmune variety then other very different kinds of treatments can offer the promise of some success. Larry mentioned monoclonal antibody treatment but there are others that are also available and less expensive and can be quite effective, one such being the drug methotrexate.

It's also worth mentioning that even if you are experiencing debilitating symptoms right now, inflammatory diseases often go through periods of exacerbation and remission so perhaps your condition will not remain at its current level of discomfort but will abate significantly on its own given some time.

Hope you find something in the way of treatment that will help. In the mean time hang in there!

This post needs to be refreshed as a reminder. The whole "diagnoses" things seems strange.

For myself, I don't normally have the C-reactive protein numbers that show an inflammatory condition, but in my case the blood test simply lies.

Hopefully you can get a diagnosis based on symptoms, if other avenues fail.

Methotrexate is indeed used successfully (as a Pharmacist would know!) for different AI maladies, but man, *I* sure can't take it.

I hope that you're seeing a qualified Rheumatologist.

Originally Posted by D. Shelton

That's one of the more interesting things I've read in a while
As a clean/sober (since 1989) addict/alcoholic , the non-psychoactivity factor is the most intriguing part . This is something i will probably learn more about, but my knee-jerk reaction is "no, I can't use cannabis in any way, shape or form, because it's... cannabis" .

So, what about Hemp plants ?. Do you know if they have any similar medicinal attributes, or is it only the Reefer Madness kind of Cannabis that helps ?

Dar, you might want to do some research on CBD (cannabinoids), the non-psychoactive ingredient in cannabis.

Extremely low THC/high CBD cannabis strains have been grown (see Charlotte's Web, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlotte's_Web_(cannabis) & Realm of Caring, https://theroc.us ).

Also, some companies are selling tinctures and even lozenges (think "hard candy") that have virtually no THC but plenty of CBD content.

[D. Shelton]

Muchas gracias, senor Larry !

[markallen]

Sorry to hear what you're going through. Like you, I'm living with some aches and pains due to inflammation and one thing you may want to ask your doctor to check is your vitamin D levels. About 5 years ago my pain was very severe and borderline debilitating. My doctor found I had a very severe case of vitamin D deficiency and once my levels were brought back up to reasonable numbers, the daily pain was reduced 70-80% of what it had been. Just a suggestion, but it may be worth a look.

Cheers,
Mark