Which Monitor

[virob]

Time to actually get some monitors. I have limited space, recordings are for the enjoyment of myself and a few others. Primarily, acoustic guitar, some electric guitar, maybe some vocals.

I will also use them for playing music while working on the computer.

So with that in mind, I have somewhat narrowed it down to two that are available locally, the Neumann KH 80 DSP, and Dynaudio Lyd 5. This first has a 4” woofer and the other a 5”. Both are already a little more than I would like to spend. I have listened to both, the Dynaudio sounded way better than the Neumann, but I think the Neumann’s were set up poorly because the reviews I have read in no way matched what I was hearing. I will be going back and listen to them both side by side next time.

Other than personal sound preferences, would one or the other be better suited to my purposes?

[midwinter]

What’s your budget?

I’m getting ready to buy some as well, and I’m probably just going to get a pair of Yamaha HS5s and add a sub.

[Gordon Currie]

I would look at Equator Audio D5s. They have an uncannily accurate mid-range. When you can actually hear the mid-range, your mix decisions become better.

Because they are direct sales, the price is killer for what you get.

[DupleMeter]

Originally Posted by virob

Time to actually get some monitors. I have limited space, recordings are for the enjoyment of myself and a few others. Primarily, acoustic guitar, some electric guitar, maybe some vocals.

I will also use them for playing music while working on the computer.

So with that in mind, I have somewhat narrowed it down to two that are available locally, the Neumann KH 80 DSP, and Dynaudio Lyd 5. This first has a 4” woofer and the other a 5”. Both are already a little more than I would like to spend. I have listened to both, the Dynaudio sounded way better than the Neumann, but I think the Neumann’s were set up poorly because the reviews I have read in no way matched what I was hearing. I will be going back and listen to them both side by side next time.

Other than personal sound preferences, would one or the other be better suited to my purposes?

IMHO DynAudio beats everything else...hands down. They are so well behaved, great freq. response & incredibly accurate imaging. I was introduced to DynAudio long ago by a couple mastering engineers who could have whatever they wanted & they swore by them.

[virob]

Originally Posted by midwinter

What’s your budget?

I’m getting ready to buy some as well, and I’m probably just going to get a pair of Yamaha HS5s and add a sub.

Hi midwinter

$500-600.
The HS5 should be able to handle a guitar, why do you think you need a sub?

[midwinter]

I don’t just record guitars.

I just nabbed a pair of HS5s on eBay to use for the time being.

[jim1960]

Originally Posted by virob

Other than personal sound preferences, would one or the other be better suited to my purposes?

I haven't heard the KH 80s but I have the KH 120 and they're excellent.

Something to consider though...
If your setup is going to require that you keep the monitors close to a wall, you might want to avoid those with bass ports on the back side, especially if you're going to be listening in an untreated room. Rear bass ports, when close to a wall, will overemphasize the low end. My current setup doesn't allow me enough space to move my monitors any significant distance from the wall behind them, so when I was shopping for new monitors 18 months ago, I took any with rear bass ports out of the running.

But here's the thing about audio monitors. The best monitors are going to be the ones that allow you to create a mix that transfers well to other audio systems (car, home stereo, etc.). That said, all monitors are going to require that you do some A/B-ing to see where your monitor/room combo results need tweaking to work in multiple environments outside your studio. How much tweaking will depend on how the monitors interact with your room. For example, if all other things are equal, a mix done on monitors with a rear bass port against the wall will likely sound thin outside the studio because inside the studio the monitor/room combination overemphasized the bass. The mixer will have to learn to take that into account on future mixes.

[MikeBmusic]

Jim's post ^^^ is spot-on. You have to 'learn' your monitors (playing music on them you are very familiar with will help). And how a set of monitors sound in a store (or in someone else's studio) will not really tell you how they sound in your room.
Spending a huge amount on monitors in a room without acoustic treatment is typically not a good idea.

[SprintBob]

Not related specifically to the OP’s question but based on comments above, if your room environment where you will be doing most of your recording and mixing/editing is acoustically poor, would it not make sense to invest in a really great pair of studio monitoring headphones?

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by SprintBob

Not related specifically to the OP’s question but based on comments above, if your room environment where you will be doing most of your recording and mixing/editing is acoustically poor, would it not make sense to invest in a really great pair of studio monitoring headphones?

Yes and no, so maybe, (ya I know I should run for office ) HP and monitors reveal different things differently and are really not a good straight apples to apples comparison (regardless of room)
HP are good for hearing the minutiae of sounds in the mix.
But Monitors are good for getting the best sense of left to right stereo field placement and overall balance.
"Really good" mixing HP's are best used as a supplement to good monitors, not a replacement .

If your budget restricted, then it makes just as much sense (perhaps more ) to invest a bit less for the monitors, and invest the rest in room treatment, as it does to invest in only in high end HP's

[jim1960]

Originally Posted by SprintBob

Not related specifically to the OP’s question but based on comments above, if your room environment where you will be doing most of your recording and mixing/editing is acoustically poor, would it not make sense to invest in a really great pair of studio monitoring headphones?

If a room is acoustically poor, it's going to be reflected not only in what you hear coming out of your monitors, but also what your microphones hear on the way in. You get dinged twice. Headphones can eliminate part of that problem but they can't eliminate the sound issues you get on the way in. Plus, as Kev pointed out, you're trading one set of issues for another when you mix on headphones exclusively.

[ChuckS]

Originally Posted by Gordon Currie

I would look at Equator Audio D5s. They have an uncannily accurate mid-range. When you can actually hear the mid-range, your mix decisions become better.

Because they are direct sales, the price is killer for what you get.

I'm using a pair of Equator D5s for solo acoustic guitar work. I do like them for my purpose, the port is in the front, they seem to provide a high value (around $400 a pair), but may not be your ideal for general listening.

Edit: There seems to be questions about whether Equator Audio is still in business.

[SprintBob]

Originally Posted by jim1960

If a room is acoustically poor, it's going to be reflected not only in what you hear coming out of your monitors, but also what your microphones hear on the way in. You get dinged twice. Headphones can't eliminate part of that problem but they can't eliminate the sound issues you get on the way in. Plus, as Kev pointed out, you're trading one set of issues for another when you mix on headphones exclusively.

In my instance, my DAW computer is a laptop and when I record, it will probably be setup on movable bench with a Focusrite AI and the mic setup. Once the raw recording is in the computer to my satisfaction, I anticipate moving the laptop into another room with a better desk and setup with the laptop interfacing with a larger monitor and bigger wireless keyboard and mouse. At this point I would be doing the editing and mixing and my question was posed as to whether a really nice set of monitor headphones would work for that duty. Understand completely what you are saying above about the recording room acoustics but not really the issue I have. I own a pair of Sennheiser 280 monitor headphones that should be great for monitoring/tracking and I was hoping they would work for editing/mixing as well. I’m certainly going to give it a try.

[DukeX]

I agree with the advice to put part of your budget into room treatment, for reasons already stated by jim1960, MikeB, and KevWind. It's not sexy like mics, guitars, and monitors, but it might be the single best investment you make for your recording/mixing environment.

I also agree that you have to learn your monitors (and your room).

I also agree that mixing with headphones is not ideal. They have many shortcomings that have been well documented.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by SprintBob

In my instance, my DAW computer is a laptop and when I record, it will probably be setup on movable bench with a Focusrite AI and the mic setup. Once the raw recording is in the computer to my satisfaction, I anticipate moving the laptop into another room with a better desk and setup with the laptop interfacing with a larger monitor and bigger wireless keyboard and mouse. At this point I would be doing the editing and mixing and my question was posed as to whether a really nice set of monitor headphones would work for that duty. Understand completely what you are saying above about the recording room acoustics but not really the issue I have. I own a pair of Sennheiser 280 monitor headphones that should be great for monitoring/tracking and I was hoping they would work for editing/mixing as well. I’m certainly going to give it a try.

Interesting so essentially you're saying you are going to record in one location then mix in a different location. Not sure why you would want to do that but that's a different discussion.

I have always had monitor speakers I can't say unequivocally about only using them but I have also always had had HP's and I have mixed on them quite a bit ( I often have to mix quietly when the family is home)

But regardless of one room or two. The trade off will be the same as in my first post. You will still not escape trade off of mixing on HP vs. Speakers

That said you can learn to mix on just HP's just like you can learn to mix in a room with reflection issues. Either one is a learning curve
So :
Yes you can learn to mix on decent pair of HP's. However usually open back are the preferred design for mixing.


I actually have Senn 280's also, which I have used for checking detail while mixing . Now I only use them for for tracking as I have a pair of Senn. 600 HD I use for mixing quiety and for checking the detail a bit closer. But anything I start off mixing on the HP's I always also use my speakers later to check overall balance , L to R and front to back spatial placement. All three of which are harder to get right in HP's