Budget Recording Chain Demo

[mesa]

I've been very thankful for everything Doug, Fran and Ty have posted on mic's.
It's a real jungle trying to grasp all this, I for one hope you folks will continue, I sure appreciate your labor!

[UKPhil]

Originally Posted by Doug Young

I recorded mics->Zoom inputs. So Zoom preamps, converters, etc. I popped the SD card out loaded into Logic using my card reader and trimmed off the garbage to get a section with an acceptable noodle, and faded the ending. Bounced the result in Logic with no processing, but with "normalize" checked on the save dialog. Then uploaded to SoundCloud. So no converters or soundcards involved other than what's on the Zoom, unless you think cutting and saving in Logic, or uploading to soundcloud affects the sound. (Actually, if you're listening on SoundCloud rather than downloading, that probably does affect the sound, for the worse)

This was a pretty cut-and-dry experiment. I didn't even monitor or check the sound in headphones. I just placed the mics 16 inches apart. Moved my chair around until the Zoom meters looked balanced, and hit record.

Mike, bbrown, I've posted examples of just using the Zoom with internal mics here before, and you can still find them on my soundcloud page:

https://soundcloud.com/doug-young/sets/zoom-h6-shootout

Others have posted great sounding tracks here using just an H2. So I think we have that covered. This was a demo of what it is: a fairly inexpensive mic in the general class often recommended here (Sound Professionals has the 2021's - not 2020s, but similar - on sale right now for $29) and a $400 recorder. I know that's a budget buster for some people, but I suspect it still useful to hear what you can do with that, so you know if it's worth saving up for. I'd encourage people to post examples of recordings using gear at all price points. Sorry if I somehow offended by calling a $300-600 recording setup "budget".

I feel a bit stuck in this thread, with some people apparently feeling I'm being elitist by flaunting a $400-600 setup, and Chris being outraged that I'd dare to demo something so cheap. Can't win....

The info you have shared (and others too) in this thread is really good Doug and I'm pleased you have taken the time to do it. From someone who uses the absolute 'budget' set up (my video of your 'Second Chances'?) - Zoom H1 direct into laptop usb and Windows Movie Maker - it is very interesting indeed and could possibly be the next step up for me.

Thanks again.

[mc1]

doug, that's some tasty fettuccine, done to perfection! a little al dente, not overcooked at all. and all within a modest family's budget. i have to ask myself why you don't have your own show, where each week you show us how to make something nutritious and delectible.

all food puns aside, i find these threads very helpful and done very intelligently. thanks.

[DoronD]

Originally Posted by Fran Guidry

I'm struck once again by the contrast between two posters.

One has presented numerous recorded samples using different gear, different instruments, different mic positions, different rooms, etc.

One has presented a lot of verbiage.

I find opinions accompanied by recorded samples useful and informative.

I find unsupported verbiage useless or worse.

On the specific topic of AT2020s vs more expensive mics, I've reposted these samples a number of times but continue to find them informative:

http://www.dougyoungguitar.com/mp3/AB_MicCompare/A.mp3
http://www.dougyoungguitar.com/mp3/AB_MicCompare/B.mp3

One clip was captured with a pair of Brauner VM1s at about $5000 each. The other was recorded using a pair of AT2020s bought on sale for about $50 each.

In past discussions the majority of folks have expressed a preference for the AT2020 recording.

Clearly the clips are not identical. Equally clearly, they both convey the musical and emotional content of the performance successfully. Isn't that the goal of our recordings?

Fran

Wait, which one is which!? I liked B more, but they both sounded very similar to these ears.

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by DoronD

Wait, which one is which!? I liked B more, but they both sounded very similar to these ears.

Congratulations! You liked.... the cheap pair :-) I had to go verify them myself to be sure I answered correctly, it's been a while. They sound different to me, and I prefer the Brauners, but if I wasn't comparing side-by-side, either would work fine.

[pf400]

Thanks for posting this thread Mr. Young it's great to know more about inexpensive gear and dead simple recording environments. I've recorded in a studio and came away not entirely satisfied because I didn't buy enough time to really do great editing. I didn't know about remastering until I read this thread so I understand now that maybe I could have my cd remastered.

If you or anyone could post and demo an even cheaper recording set up, I'm sure some of us would really appreciate it.

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by pf400

Thanks for posting this thread Mr. Young it's great to know more about inexpensive gear and dead simple recording environments. I've recorded in a studio and came away not entirely satisfied because I didn't buy enough time to really do great editing. I didn't know about remastering until I read this thread so I understand now that maybe I could have my cd remastered.

If you or anyone could post and demo an even cheaper recording set up, I'm sure some of us would really appreciate it.

There are all kinds of ways to go even cheaper. Keep in mind that a pro studio can easily represent $50K-$100K of investment or more, so at $600, you're already way, way in the budget range. Often, the best way to record on a budget is just to rent studio time, where you pay for a few hours, but get the great gear, and more importantly, the expertise of an engineer and the acoustics of the recording environment. Certain things, like the room acoustics of a good studio, are practically impossible in the home environment, so being able to pay a relatively modest amount per hour to access that can be a steal.

But if you want to do it yourself for less, one approach is to leverage what you have. You have a computer, a smart phone, an ipad? On the computer, you can get Audacity for free. You could just use a built-in mic on the computer, or get a very cheap mic to plugin to the mic input, or get a USB mic. On the iphone/ipad, there are recording apps for free up to a few dollars. Use the builtin mics or there are external mics you can add. So these paths will range from free to a $100+. Note that the total price is still higher (if you have to buy the computer, iphone, etc), but if you're leveraging what you already have, the incremental cost can be less.

Use the google search function at the bottom of the page to search for iphone recording, ipad recording, Audacity, Reaper, USB mic, etc, and you'll find lots of demos.

Or you can go with a cheaper hardware device. You could skip the external mics and use the Zoom H6, H4, H2, or H1 depending on your price point. There are similar units from Tascam, Sony, and others. Here's a demo of the H2 from Fran Guidry:

http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/f...d.php?t=226514

Here's a recording from me just using the H6 with the builtin mics:

https://soundcloud.com/doug-young/zoom-shootout-take-a

Your experience with recording in a studio and not being satisfied is important. It's not about the gear, really. It's what you do with it. If you pay for studio time, you at least have the engineer's expertise (which can vary) covered, but there's also the more important part, which is you. I started doing my own recording also after a less-that-satisfying studio experience. It wasn't anything wrong with the studio or engineer, it was that I realized that I needed to control the whole process, and be able to do as many takes as I wanted, spend as much time as I wanted, learn how my guitar sounds on a recording, and how to maximize that. I also needed to feel free to hit delete, go practice for another week and try again, and so on.

I wouldn't focus so much on editing or mastering. That's the basis of the jokes about "fixing it in the mix". Better to get it right going in. Yes, editing can fix a small glitch in a performance, and mastering can add a bit of final polish, but in the grand scheme of things it's not the answer. There's no editing on these clips I posted, and the "mix" track took about 5 minutes, just adding a touch of EQ and reverb.