#46
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I had the same experience with an Avalon L32. A beautiful, great sounding guitar that just did not fit my playing style.
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#47
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I enjoy the occasional zombie thread. I usually find they are still relevant. I do a lot of searches instead of starting new threads though. I just got my first rosewood guitar a Larrivee OM09. I'm enjoying the overtones. It's fun switching between RW,maple and mahogany.
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Taylor 322,512ce 12 fret cedar/hog & 362ce Martin 00015SM Guild 1966 F20 Larrivee P03 sitka/hog,simple 6 OM & OM 09 Eastman E100ss-sb Gibson J185 & 2016 J35 Fender player plus telecaster & Mustang P90 Gretsch MIK 5622T Last edited by Lillis; 03-21-2024 at 09:03 AM. |
#48
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I wouldn't know an overtone if I tripped over it.
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Barry My SoundCloud page Avalon L-320C, Guild D-120, Martin D-16GT, McIlroy A20, Pellerin SJ CW Cordobas - C5, Fusion 12 Orchestra, C12, Stage Traditional Alvarez AP66SB, Seagull Folk Aria {Johann Logy}: |
#49
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You can never have too many overtones at your fingertips. It all depends on how you use them.
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2022 Martin 000-18 2022 Martin HD12-28 2022 Martin HD-28 2022 Gibson J-45 Standard 2022 Taylor American Dream AD27 Mahogany 2007 Breedlove AC250/SM-12 2006 Breedlove AD20/SR Plus 2003 Martin 000C-16SGTNE 2000 Taylor 410ce 1990 Martin Shenandoah (< 1990 a bunch of great old Yamahas I lost track of) My music: https://pro.soundclick.com/dannybowman |
#50
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I have an OM that is fairly "overtone rich" and it forced me to adapt my playing style to include more damping and muting with my right hand. It took about six months to tame the beast, but the sound I get now is rich and rewarding.
I love the possibilities it offers. That said, I played a lovely Martin Custom Shop 000 with back and sides made of waterfall bubinga. The sound was enchanting, but I could only imagine trying to record with it. I'd liken it to playing a piano with the damper pedal always down. For certain types of chord-based music I could see it working, but playing lines became a sonic mess very quickly. Notes just did not want to ever go away, lol. |
#51
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Quote:
I used to prefer guitars with mahogany back and sides to tame these things. My technique has improved to be able to control the sound of the strings on the soundhole side of the nut, but I still put something behind the nut on my more resonant guitars. |
#52
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Well, like so much in life. It depends. Not for me because I have quite a few guitars and appreciate having a range of characteristics and tonal qualities. I have one Adi/EIR guitar with overtones a-plenty, that would be too strong for some playing. However I have an all-mahogany guitar that sits at the other end of the spectrum, with a bunch of guitars in between. Pick the right tool when possible. If I only had 1 guitar, that would present me with a different set of decisions.
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#53
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You can somewhat control the lushness and overtone-ness with a judicious change in strings. I have a Cedar/Rosewood that is uber-lush, so when I do instrumentals it is beautiful, but when I compete with my voice - not so much. Changing to a silk and steel, silk and bronze, or a 'flatter' string like JP's that settle so quickly.
In this case, installing some Elixir nano electric strings (nanos) brought my lushness down to a beautiful, fundamental sound with just the right tones and sustain. I also use Thomastiks on occasion (not crazy about the price) and Martin Silk'n'Steels. Works for me. YMMV. Last edited by brancher; 03-22-2024 at 08:59 AM. |
#54
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I remember this thread when it first came out and at the time I would have said you can’t have enough overtones.
Be careful what you ask for. A few years back I picked up a beautiful Red Furch GC Cedar top. Wow. Sounded like I was sitting in a reverb chamber. Just did not know what to do with it. Sent it back. Still a Furch fan and not opposed to cedar but I do feel there is a such a thing as to lush for me.
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David Webber Round-Body Furch D32-LM MJ Franks Lagacy OM Rainsong H-WS1000N2T Stonebridge OM33-SR DB Stonebridge D22-SRA Tacoma Papoose Voyage Air VAD-2 1980 Fender Strat A few Partscaster Strats MIC 60s Classic Vib Strat |
#55
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Quote:
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Keith Martin 000-42 Marquis Taylor Classical Alvarez 12 String Gibson ES345s Fender P-Bass Gibson tenor banjo |
#56
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I like a guitar with a lot of overtones.
But yes, there are people, or playing styles, where lots of overtones is too much. Strong fundamental and less overtones can work very well. Depends on what you want or like.
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Breedlove, Landola, a couple of electrics, and a guitar-shaped-object |
#57
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Too many overtones
Is this a thing? Not me. While I keep guitars of different woods depending on what results I want, my favorite(s) are spruce over rosewood. Jumboes. Overtones 'R' Us. I fingerpick all my guitars, and realize that full strumming them is usually not what I want to hear, but fingerpicking is. I don't use picks of any sort except my fingernails. So I guess overall I like full overtones. And with Jumbo guitars, you can get great overtones no matter what woods you choose for playing. Be well, play well, and love those long multi-layered decays, Don .
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*The Heard: 85 Gibson J-200 sitka/rosewood Jumbo 99 Taylor 355 sitka/sapele 12 string Jmbo 06 Alvarez AJ60S englmn/mpl lam med Jmbo 14 Taylor 818e sitka/rosewood Grand Orchestra 05 Taylor 512ce L10 all mahogany Grand Concert 09 Taylor all walnut Jmbo 16 Taylor 412e-R sitka/rw GC 16 Taylor 458e-R s/rw 12 string GO 21 Epiphone IBG J-200 sitka/maple Jmbo 22 Guild F-1512 s/rw 12 string Jmbo |
#58
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Don't 12 string guitars have more overtones than six string guitars?
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Waterloo WL-S, K & K mini Waterloo WL-S Deluxe, K & K mini Iris OG, 12 fret, slot head, K & K mini Follow The Yellow Brick Road |
#59
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Overtones are the harmonic frequencies complementing the fundamental tones. These can be partials of the plucked strings (5ths, 3ds, octaves, etc.) and can also encompass sympathetic vibrations in the unplucked strings as well.
As Howard has mentioned, they can also cause unwanted ringing in the string section between the nut and the tuners, and in instruments with a floating bridge, like archtop guitars and mandolins, in the section between the bridge and tailpiece as well. We mandolin players have been muting these sections with felt or leather for years. The amount of overtones an instrument has is built into the instrument. It either has a lot or it doesn't. The extra strings on a 12-string don't increase an instrument's overtones. You can't add or subtract them, but you can, to some extent, control their prominence through strings and technique as others have mentioned, but this is limited. If it has too many for your playing style, its time to think about making a change. They are not the same as sustain, although a long sustain can make them more noticeable, which some may or may not care for. Nor are they the same as timbre (tone) which describes the quality of the sound (warm, bright, brash, intimate, etc.). They live in the background, and with the right balance, they can add a pleasing richness, complexity and spaciousness to the plucked notes. .
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Jim Magill Director, The Swannanoa Gathering Guitars:'07 Circa OM, '09 Bashkin 00-12fret, '10 Circa 00 12-fret, '17 Buendia Jumbo, '17 Robbins R.1, '19 Doerr Legacy Select, '12 Collings 000-28H Koa. Pre-War guitars: '20 0-28, '22 00-28, '22 000-28. Mandolins: '09 Heiden Heritage F5, '08 Poe F5 , 1919 Gibson F-4, '80 Monteleone Grand Artist mandolin, '83 Monteleone GA (oval),'85 Sobell cittern. Last edited by jmagill; 03-27-2024 at 05:45 AM. |
#60
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Like Mbroady, I used to think you couldn’t have too many overtones, but after buying my Halcyon, I now think differently. That guitar has SO many overtones and natural reverb. It’s kinda like the Yamaha transacoustic effect but with a more natural sound.
It’s lovely, and for certain styles, it’s perfect. But no technique I know of (short of putting in a PU) can make an overtone-rich guitar have more clarity. Technique allows me to control sustain and volume, but on faster songs, it’s tough to get that clarity I sometimes crave. Martin Retro’s do help. Like everything else, it’s all preference. I let the Halcyon do what it does best on certain songs and then use other guitars when a drier clarity is needed. |