Emerald x20 Nylon Opus

[seamusknives]

I was to the point of getting very serious about a CF nylon string guitar. Even though I don't know where to find one to take for a test drive, the Emerald"s reputation and spec.'s satisfied me. When I got to the pricing I was amazed that it nearly doubles, feature for feature, going from steel to nylon strings. I get that the head has more labor in it and that Alistair wouldn't be charging this unless he had his reasons. Just disappointed that the discrepancy is so huge. What am I missing? anybody have one?

[Acousticado]

I know nothing about nylon string guitars and could be all wrong, but just because the nylon crossover is based on the X20, tension differences likely require overall design adjustments necessitating unique molds. Since there is likely much less demand for nylon crossovers, economies of scale would seem to dictate the need for Emerald to charge a (much) higher price. For those interested in such nylons and can afford it, they should just be happy someone is offering one of high quality.

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Hi Jim,

Not sure what specs you are looking for, but Rainsong offers their Parlor in a nylon string. It does have a different soundboard design to accommodate for the lighter string tension, but neck, and stings spacing are identical to the steel string, so it's more of a crossover, as opposed to a true classical. This model has been very popular for musicians looking to add a different tonal pallet to their stable. Plus, it's a hoot to play.

For a more traditional classical tone, and feel, look to the Blackbird Rider Nylon, it has a wider nut, slotted headstock, and a size that lets you take it anywhere. This is the guitar clients looking for a go anywhere classical have been buying from us for years.

BTW, I am still loving the knife.

[Earl49]

Unfortunately, nothing about CF is cheap. It is an expensive material and tricky to work with. The best values come from economy of scale when you pick something "standard" to built over an over. Emerald gets around the expensive aluminum mold issues ($$$$) somehow but even so they cannot build every variation imaginable without charging for the extra labor involved.

In the classical world, tradition is even more ingrained than in the bluegrass world, so open minded trials of non-traditional materials are rare with nylon strings.

[Tom2]

I see that you already have an NS34C, so you understand the importance of a true 48mm crossover neck. Right now, Emerald is the only cf option, regardless of price.

If the nylon string version was priced similarly to the steel string version, I would have one right now. But it's not, so I'm still using a wooden crossover.

If my financial situation were to change today, I would order a custom X10N with a 640mm scale and a 48.5mm nut width. However, what I would really like to see is someone offering an affordable production model that fully embraces the qualities of a true crossover, with a slightly smaller body, slightly shorter scale, and slightly wider neck than a standard steel string acoustic guitar. It's curious that such a thing does not exist.

In theory, this guitar could be less expensive than a steel string, because there is no need for a truss rod, and a lighter build means less material.

If anyone gets there, my guess is that it will be Blackbird. Their in-mold slotted headstock for the El Capitan is pure genius from a strength-to-weight perspective, and it doesn't need to be built by hand. The Savoy is a great size and shape, but the scale length is just a bit too short for nylon. Maybe, just maybe...

A redesigned production model of an Emerald X10N with an in-mold headstock would be great, but this could be years away from reality, if ever.

[seamusknives]

I'd gotten my NS34C, second hand off the Forum and have it sitting next to my PC where it's always available for learning something new off the internet. Since I've had it a couple nice guitars have come and gone due to still discovering exactly what I'm comfortable with. The 00-28VS was a great guitar but ultimately felt uncomfortable due to it's size. My Rainsong always crowded my left hand due to nut width. My latest Taylor 616 with custom 1-7/8" nut , I got from Ted and is working out beautifully. So both my steel and nylon guitars basically have the same neck and body size. This simply is what works for me.
I'd also always want to keep as much string tension with a new CF Nylon guitar so the scale length would need to be full length.
So, Tom2, I wish this love of Crossover style Nylon guitars would go viral and more production models would be made.

[CFW]

I don't recall any drastic markups in price. For nylon, or customization. Quite the contrary.

[seamusknives]

Personally I think the difference from $1495 for the X20 Opus to $2850 for the X20 Nylon Opus is pretty "drastic" if I can use your word. These are the prices on their website.
The nylon version is beautiful and that gorgeous headstock, I'm sure, is harder to make. Lighter bracing for the lower tension is also in the mix. Maybe, for some reason, Emerald just isn't geared up for these changes and this price simply reflects what they need for their time and to show a profit.

[Acousticado]

Originally Posted by seamusknives

Personally I think the difference from $1495 for the X20 Opus to $2850 for the X20 Nylon Opus is pretty "drastic" if I can use your word. These are the prices on their website.
The nylon version is beautiful and that gorgeous headstock, I'm sure, is harder to make. Lighter bracing for the lower tension is also in the mix. Maybe, for some reason, Emerald just isn't geared up for these changes and this price simply reflects what they need for their time and to show a profit.

And there you have it.

[Jimmy Koh]

Hi Jim,

Why don't you email Sean of Emerald to enquire more on pricing info?

I believe he can work your way through, and make that X20N possible for you.

[Strumalot]

I have a custom nylon Emerald X10. Emerald makes great nylon guitars with the benefit of customization, which I think is important. There seems to be a lot of variability in neck preference for these types of guitars and probably why making "production" crossovers is a problem. My X10 is 1.75. If I had to reorder I would go with a 1.69 and I would guess there is very little demand for that in the general guitar market.

Bottom line is, think through what you want, pay the price, and you will have guitar for life. And that will likely turn out to be "cheap" in terms of the value you get over time.

[Alistair Hay]

Originally Posted by seamusknives

Personally I think the difference from $1495 for the X20 Opus to $2850 for the X20 Nylon Opus is pretty "drastic" if I can use your word. These are the prices on their website.
The nylon version is beautiful and that gorgeous headstock, I'm sure, is harder to make. Lighter bracing for the lower tension is also in the mix. Maybe, for some reason, Emerald just isn't geared up for these changes and this price simply reflects what they need for their time and to show a profit.

On the face of it yes it does look like a very serious increase in price between the Steel and Nylon X20.
Actually the Nylon is a bit of anomaly on our website as we list it as a production model but essentially each one is built like a custom build.
We build the sound board structure in a different and more time consuming manner to make it lighter and more responsive.
Each neck is customised after moulding to modify the neck dimensions which means more time for us but also means you can spec a Nylon to your desired dimensions without an up charge. (within certain parameters)
The headstock is hand carved from a solid block of carbon fibre which we laminate with over 60 layers of carbon. Its a very expensive block of carbon and time consuming to carve. I agonised over whether I should make a simpler headstock design that would be more economical but in the end I just love our headstock design and the process that goes into building it so we went the premium approach.
The custom tie bridge is built in a similar fashion to the headstock.
Altogether a Nylon takes well over twice the hours of a steel string to build and this is reflected in the price.
If you are looking for a lower cost approach to a Nylon then we can start off with an X20 Artisan and add any of the above customisations to meet your desired price point.
I have often built Nylon guitars with a standard headstock and pin bridge along with the standard neck dimensions, the only modification we do is to alter the top structure.
With this you get the same tone at a much lower cost.
We package together our designs in the way we feel makes the best product but in guitar building there is no one size fits all so we have worked very hard over the last 19 years to create ways to be as adaptable as possible.
Drop Sean an email and he will work through the options with you.
Hope you all had a nice St. Patricks Weekend
Alistair

[jdinco]

That's very interesting to read about the process, we REALLY appreciate the post Alistair. Thank You....

[seamusknives]

Alistair,

Thanks for the information. I'll send an email to Sean with some questions!

[121]

Originally Posted by CFW

I don't recall any drastic markups in price. For nylon, or customization. Quite the contrary.

Such a gorgeous guitar.
IMHO the Amber color on Emerald's carbon fiber guitars is still the most attractive color. I like it even better than Emerald's wood grain top models.