Songwriting: Melody vs. Lyrics

[Bob from Brooklyn]

Hi, first time down this part of the dial thanks to our friend Kerbie.

One thing I've resolved to do this year is to try to up my game at songwriting. I always have a couple of nice melodies in my head. Nothing too complex but certainly passable.

Lyric writing is something else. It certainly doesn't come naturally to me. I really have to sit down and work at at.

I have a couple of 'how to write songs' books around. One of them was the type that had exercises at the end of each chapter. One of the exercises was to simply sit down for 20 minutes and write whatever came into your head.

This seemed simple enough. I committed myself to 20 minutes each night. The blank page can be intimidating but even on the driest of nights I forced myself to write a couple of lines or phrases. Some nights I would get on a little run and go over 20 minutes organically which made me happy.

After a couple of weeks things seem to be getting easier. I have a small handful of songs in the works. I want to keep it down to a few that I can really focus on. I even find myself at various times of the day coming up with some lyrical ideas and writing notes on my phone for later when I get home.

I'm interested in any other techniques that you folks use to get things going and what has worked for you.

Thanks!

[leew3]

Bob,
A great thread idea! My writing has been happenstance as I've not taken a disciplined approach so my feedback might not be helpful to you. It seems like lyrics are typically the more interesting and easier part for me. In that sense then lyrics usually come first. That said, one of my favorite originals began with a bass hammer on riff and grew from there (check out 'everybody's happy' at our website oekb.weebly.com). Another song posted on our website began when I was simply walking through our backyard last fall and asked my wife what the bush next to the fence was. Learning that it was a weigelia led to 'Out Among the Weigelia" (who could resist a 3/4 time song about a serial killer?) The third song I'm thinking of (Since you Changed My Mind) was a result of my challenging myself to write a country love song. Most of the lyrics were developed during my daily walks with our mixed breed dog Frank. As I said, happenstance so far but maybe this helps a bit!

[DukeX]

I think you are off to a good start.

I always say songwriting is a craft as much as an art--especially lyrics. There are many good books just on lyric writing (perhaps you already have one). Shelia Davis and Pamela Phillips Oland have good ones IMO. These books not only provide theory, principles, and techniques, they provide examples of how successful songs utilize them.

Read some poetry. I recommend Robert Frost for his extraordinary, lyrical ear.

All songwriters should have a copy of Tunesmith, by Jimmy Webb (IMO).

Write everything down, immediately...and keep lots of notebooks.

[Mbroady]

Groove, chords, and melody always came easy to me. Lyrics were always a challenge.
I now also do the 20 minute writing anything exercise. It helps
I found the best thing I did for my writing was to ignore the committee in your head that says "Those lyrics suck".

[Bob from Brooklyn]

I do enjoy the process. It's like going to the gym. Just have to check in every day and flex my muscles.

[jessupe]

Originally Posted by Brooklyn Bob

Hi, first time down this part of the dial thanks to our friend Kerbie.

One thing I've resolved to do this year is to try to up my game at songwriting. I always have a couple of nice melodies in my head. Nothing too complex but certainly passable.

Lyric writing is something else. It certainly doesn't come naturally to me. I really have to sit down and work at at.

I have a couple of 'how to write songs' books around. One of them was the type that had exercises at the end of each chapter. One of the exercises was to simply sit down for 20 minutes and write whatever came into your head.

This seemed simple enough. I committed myself to 20 minutes each night. The blank page can be intimidating but even on the driest of nights I forced myself to write a couple of lines or phrases. Some nights I would get on a little run and go over 20 minutes organically which made me happy.

After a couple of weeks things seem to be getting easier. I have a small handful of songs in the works. I want to keep it down to a few that I can really focus on. I even find myself at various times of the day coming up with some lyrical ideas and writing notes on my phone for later when I get home.

I'm interested in any other techniques that you folks use to get things going and what has worked for you.

Thanks!

Here, let us all {anyone who wants to} write some lyrics today, starting now, and see what comes of it after input over a couple days.

I will choose a random topic....

a horse! of course....

perhaps some backstory, a brave horse that dies saving a drowning boy

now we don't need to use that in the song lyrics, but just to know what kind of horse he was, a good horse, of course....

So, I will start the first line about the brave horse ...we can work on the title later....

this style or writing takes "completion" pressure off, you just have tio use your imagination with the subject given and try to come up with the next line, in the end the song may suck, but it is an exercise in free association.

....................
VERSE 1.
"When he wandered the plains in days long ago

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by jessupe

Here, let us all {anyone who wants to} write some lyrics today, starting now, and see what comes of it after input over a couple days.

I will choose a random topic....

a horse! of course....

perhaps some backstory, a brave horse that dies saving a drowning boy

now we don't need to use that in the song lyrics, but just to know what kind of horse he was, a good horse, of course....

So, I will start the first line about the brave horse ...we can work on the title later....

My wife was the source
Of my misery of course
So I ran over her with a horse
Then she called the police force
So they could endorse
Her grounds for divorce
But I felt no remorse
'cos it could have been .. er .. worse

OK, over to you!

(50% of the royalties please. )

[Bob from Brooklyn]

Originally Posted by jessupe

"When he wandered the plains in days long ago

He created a legend that all would soon know

[jaymarsch]

I am part of a regular songwriting class facilitated by a local singer/songwriter/guitar player and she gives us some amazing exercises. Here is what I have discovered helps me.
Write down titles and then see what those titles lead to in terms of a story. You might draw on situations that happened during your week - did something make you sad or angry or make you laugh. If you could capture one of those in a song title what would it be?

Have a regular time of day that you set aside for writing and just start writing about anything ordinary - like what you had for breakfast or taking the dog for a walk. Write a verse or a chorus based on what comes up. It is not about writing a great song, though you might, but more about practicing putting words, chords and melody together on a regular basis. I find that eventually it leads to my writing lyrics with more ease.
And do not forget about sensory detail. Get used to asking yourself what does this smell like? Taste like. How does it feel or what does it sound like.

I tend to have the opposite problem in that I can write lyrics more easily than I can melodies but at the end of the day, they need to work together in unison so both are important.

Thanks for posting and I look forward to hearing more about your songwriting journey.

Best,
Jayne

[Bob from Brooklyn]

Sage advice Jayne.

I do have a page in my notebook with just titles, another with unmarried phrases that will hopefully find a home someday.

Thanks for posting!

[jessupe]

Originally Posted by Brooklyn Bob

He created a legend that all would soon know

His mane was white and his tail was black

[Bob from Brooklyn]

Originally Posted by jessupe

His mane was white and his tail was black

And he carried with him a young boy named Jack

[1neeto]

I’m a riff kind of guy. I can come up with tons of riffs or chord progressions. But when it comes to melody and lyrics, it feels like I’m ripping some artist off.

[jessupe]

When he wandered the plains in days long ago
He created a legend that all would soon know
His mane was white and his tail was black
And he carried with him a young boy named Jack
.................................................. .................................

{ok, so the above is a start, what I will now do is establish a "rule/s" as far as our stanza is concerned, I will do this in order to add "challenge" to our "game" but also to show one how they can be the rule maker or breaker....SO the next part will also have four lines, but this time they will be four lines that DO NOT RHYME....we will keep this pattern in the second verse as well....

The other rule I will establish will set an arrangement parameter, so the song arrangement will go as follows....

verse 1.

will consist of 2 sets of 4 lines, the first set has rhyme, the second set does not....

then after verse 1. I will call for a 3 line bridge, that will lead to a 3 line chorus, the bridge has rhyme, the chorus does not.

then verse 2 which is the same rule as verse one

which then leads into the 3 line non rhyming chorus which will repaetx2 and then lead to a 3 or 4 line outro' that does ryhme....so it would look like



V1.
B
C
V2
Cx2
O ]......

and so on we go, remember no rhyming in this next 4 lines

edit: also about lines that do not rhyme, this is important to understand that resolution can be had by the melody, not the words, so lines that do not ryhme can be made to sound "right" by using the music part

.................................................. .................

When he wandered the plains in days long ago
He created a legend that all would soon know
His mane was white and his tail was black
And he carried with him a young boy named Jack

A worn saddle and a whip

[Pitar]

Writing was a natural aspect of learning for me. I taught myself finger picking and made up stuff to aid in that. For me, it was a shorter path to picking by making stuff up than it was laboring to learn published music. I did not have to learn the changes and dynamics of published pieces, and work finger picking in at the same time. Simple three chord melodies of my own made learning a lot easier.

By the time I was getting pretty fluid with chord changes, and finger picking a few patterns, I had many melodies of my own. That's when I began writing lyrics for them. Nothing remarkable ever became of it but I got a lot of practice writing. Then I began collaborating with lyricists, because I had so many different melodies, and had a lot of fun with that.