Mic it up?

[min7b5]

Originally Posted by fitness1

I spent about 90 minutes this morning experimenting.....

Eric's position at the bridge was second, but seemed to take some of the string/air away and had more natural compression than I liked.
.

Nice! The best thing to do for sure is to spend time trying stuff at home. When I first started primarily using mics at gigs, I spent a lot of time setting up in our basement trying all kids of angles, relationships to the speaker, and of course mic placement. There's so many variables and variations, but slowly it comes together -untill you get in a new space!

Just wanted to reiterate that my go-to mic location (which I usually refer to as the "Tony Rice spot" because that's where I got the idea) is not what I think sounds the best, it's what I think works the best in a live situation. In my mind this about giving the mic the most to work with. It's all about finding the spot with the most volume and not too much feedback inducing boom. BTW I've only tried using two mics live once -I'm not in a big hurry to that again

Here's a video https://youtu.be/_YdLzn_Vb2I of me playing to almost six hundred people in a large theater with just a large diaphragm condenser in the aforementioned mentioned location, with bass roll-off engaged, and no monitors. It was super load and I thought felt and sounded really good. There were multiable acts that night, and I was the only one not using a pickup, and I got so many questions about using a mic after the show...

[fitness1]

Originally Posted by min7b5

Just wanted to reiterate that my go-to mic location (which I usually refer to as the "Tony Rice spot" because that's where I got the idea) is not what I think sounds the best, it's what I think works the best in a live situation.

Here's one of my vintage concert photos (with a very faded autograph) showing the TR position you are talking about. (actually after posting it I see he's closer to the soundhole - this was in a very small and quiet venue of 200-250)

I agree the spot you are talking about is probably the easiest to apply in many room situations. That natural compression I was referring to will go a long way to prevent problems.....especially with an LDC.

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by min7b5

Nice! The best thing to do for sure is to spend time trying stuff at home. When I first started primarily using mics at gigs, I spent a lot of time setting up in our basement trying all kids of angles, relationships to the speaker, and of course mic placement. There's so many variables and variations, but slowly it comes together -untill you get in a new space!

Just wanted to reiterate that my go-to mic location (which I usually refer to as the "Tony Rice spot" because that's where I got the idea) is not what I think sounds the best, it's what I think works the best in a live situation. In my mind this about giving the mic the most to work with. It's all about finding the spot with the most volume and not too much feedback inducing boom. BTW I've only tried using two mics live once -I'm not in a big hurry to that again

Here's a video https://youtu.be/_YdLzn_Vb2I of me playing to almost six hundred people in a large theater with just a large diaphragm condenser in the aforementioned mentioned location, with bass roll-off engaged, and no monitors. It was super load and I thought felt and sounded really good. There were multiable acts that night, and I was the only one not using a pickup, and I got so many questions about using a mic after the show...

Excellent, Eric!

[min7b5]

Good picture of Tony. I think that shows basically what I'm talking about -seemingly a bit more soundhole maybe... It is very hard to get info from photos of microphones on stands because the angles can be misleading, and of course the picture would look different if it were taken just a second later. But again, this a pretty good one

[Fran Guidry]

It's worth remembering that an SM57 or Beta 57 will have a substantial low cut because they are designed for close miking.

Fran

[fitness1]

Originally Posted by Fran Guidry

It's worth remembering that an SM57 or Beta 57 will have a substantial low cut because they are designed for close miking.

Fran

True - haven't used one in so long (probably 25 years) I'd forgotten that characteristic. You could probably put one right on the soundhole

[min7b5]

For what it's worth, of the four 57 and 58's, I actually prefer the regular 58's on a steelstring guitar. The regular 57 and 58's are the same mic, but my understanding is that the different grills make for the different frequency responses. And to my hear the regular 58 is just a bit less shrill in the high end. And that loose platic ring on the end of the 57 makes the worst sound in the world if you bump your hand into it mid-tune

The only reason I have a lot of experience with these Shures is because very often for a gig that requires air travel I skip bringing own mic these days (it almost always makes TSA search my bag) and every house rig seemingly has a full locker of Shure mics...

I do like the Betas. In particular because they're hotter and you can get little more distance from them. But there's a slight metallic quality to the tone sometimes that makes me prefer the good 58. Bonus; if there's a loose nail on stage floor you can hammer it back down with the 58 and it still sounds great

[cheer tunes]

Thank you all - especially fitness1 and eric for their insights. i've played around a bit by running the shure beta 57a into my fishman loudbox artist and just experimenting with mic position. i def hear what you're saying about aiming about 8 inches at the top between the sound hole and bridge towards the treble/ waist side. really sweet tones there. the gig is thursday and i'm definitely excited to try this out. very liberating considering i've been limiting my self the instruments with pickups instead of experimenting with using a mic. the venue is more of a listening room and 30-40 will prob be the turnout.

i will just have to keep my right hand in check and try not to hit the mic.

thanks again! great stuff

[Mr. Jelly]

I'm jealous. I'm thinking some of you have worked with allot better sound people than I have.

[guitaniac]

Originally Posted by Fran Guidry

It's worth remembering that an SM57 or Beta 57 will have a substantial low cut because they are designed for close miking.

Fran

That may be true, but I invariably need to roll off some bass at the channel when close miking guitars with an SM57.

[hotroad]

For laughs, I remember back in the early days, the 70's, a guy I knew put the SM 57 IN his guitar through the soundhole and it sounded amazing. Of course, he had to watch feedback and eq but what a crazy idea. Oh, and he did use some foam to sit the mic on in the guitar, and I think it was a D-28. Dont remember which direction or position he had it in. I might try that tonight just for fun. I would not recommend this as a mic placement though. Ha!

[buzzardwhiskey]

I used the Shure Beta 57 all last year with my Martin CEO7. It works well.

Check out the EV ND767a. Even though it's sold as a vocal mic, I really like it for acoustic guitar.

[cheer tunes]

Results are in! I was very pleased with the experience of micing my D18 with a Beta57a at the gig. The room had 30 ish people and was more or less a listening room vibe - think attentive crowd. The tone is the payback, it's pretty close to what i expected to hear all of these years. Wish I would have tried this originally, pickups have always been a disappointment on some level.

I prepped for about a week playing to the mic and stood about 10 inches away and minimized my lateral movement. Mic pointed slightly up at the treble side of the top between the sound hold and bridge.

I've been gigging with solo acoustic on and off for about 10 years and have always been a slave to using the guitars that had a pickup, NO MORE. It was very liberating to know that i can mic up in a small room successfully. Did not get any feedback worth mentioning.

It certainly does take a little practice and discipline, and probably a lifetime to master working the mic, but you can get 75% there in a week or so of regular practice. That said i would not recommend it to someone that has little to no experience playing solo gigs.

[cheer tunes]

Results are in! I was very pleased with the experience of micing my D18 with a Beta57a at the gig. The room had 30 ish people and was more or less a listening room vibe - think attentive crowd. The tone is the payback, it's pretty close to what i expected to hear all of these years. Wish I would have tried this originally, pickups have always been a disappointment on some level.

I prepped for about a week playing to the mic and stood about 10 inches away and minimized my lateral movement. Mic pointed slightly up at the treble side of the top between the sound hold and bridge.

I've been gigging with solo acoustic on and off for about 10 years and have always been a slave to using the guitars that had a pickup, NO MORE. It was very liberating to know that i can mic up in a small room successfully. Did not get any feedback worth mentioning.

It certainly does take a little practice and discipline, and probably a lifetime to master working the mic, but you can get 75% there in a week or so of regular practice. That said i would not recommend it to someone that has little to no experience playing solo gigs.

[guitaniac]

Thanks so much for following up. Its good to learn that things worked out for you.