#17
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Steve
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Cole Clark Fat Lady Gretsch Electromatic Martin CEO7 Maton Messiah Taylor 814CE |
#18
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If you're looking for nice planes, it's hard to beat Lie-Nielsen. They're not cheap, but they're not crazy money either and they are of a quality to last a lifetime. They're also really beautiful.
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#19
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Hey snow - I'm enjoying your plunge into building.
I built my own thickness sander for about $150 plus motor (which I already have for my buffer). Basically it's hook and loop (Velcro) glued on 5" mdf disks glued onto a 1" steel rod that rests in pillow blocks and turned by motor-pulley setup. I based mine off of pat Hawley's design: https://woodgears.ca/sander/plans/index.html But If you're wanting a bit of motivation for the hard work you'd put in from hand planing as opposed to sanding, there's some evidence to support that a planed soundboard has better stiffness/weight ratio and improved glued surfaces than those sanded. Nigel Forster started recommending hand planed tops after reading a peer reviewed study demonstrating that abrasive planing (sanding) breaks down the cell structure of Doug fir deeper than knife planing. Thus we can envision that the stiffness of those spruce cellular layers structurally compromised by the plucking and tearing from sanding is not as high as when cut cleanly by blades. The paper that shows this in photo micro graphs can be found here and is titled "SURFACE AND SUBSURFACE CHARACTERISTICS RELATED TO ABRASIVE-PLANING CONDITIONS". http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/pdf1986/murma86a.pdf As well, there's some evidence that knife planed surfaces make for a better glue joint. The paper showing that is called "KNIFE VS ABRASIVE PLANED WOOD: QUALITY OF ADHESIVE BONDS" https://wfs.swst.org/index.php/wfs/a...viewFile/94/94 Have fun! Sam |
#20
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Almost any plane can be set up to do the job. However, for smoothing a 'bench' plane is usually preferred over a 'block' plane. The difference is in how the iron (cutter) is set up. In a block plane the iron goes in with the bevel up, while a bench plane has the bevel down, and a 'chip breaker' attached to the iron. The chip breaker (or 'cap iron') does what it says: it breaks the grain in the chips as they come off the wood, causing them to curl up. This reduces the leverage of the fibers in the chip that can cause tear-out. This is particularly useful in softwoods, and figured woods, or woods with interlocked grain.
For smoothing you also want a plane that has some weight, so that once you get it moving it doesn't just stop at the first hard spot. This gets very tiring after a (short) while. Something on the order of a #4 bench plane is pretty much the norm for smoothing. Bigger planes have higher numbers, in general. A well set up #4 will get you through almost everything you'll need a plane for, although there are jobs where a smaller block plane makes a lot of sense. It's somewhat surprising how uniform a job you can do taking a plate to thickness. The best way I've found is the one Cumpiano showed in his book; planing on diagonals. Clamp the work down on the bench edge nearest you, and plane away from the clamps. Start, say, on the upper left corner, and go diagonally across from left to right at 45 degrees to the center line. Make another stroke right next to that one, and work your way down. Then go on the other diagonal, starting on the upper right hand corner, and planing from right to left. The important thing is to hit all of the plate every time, even if the plane isn't removing a shaving there at first. Work on one end of one side until you've got the biggest bumps off, and reverse it, so you're working on the same surface in the other direction. Then flip it over and work on the other surface the same way. Don't ignore the surface you're working on. You can't easily get the plate flat and uniform if the bench top is not flat. Also, a bench that jiggles and 'walks' will tire you out in a hurry. For this job I like a peninsula bench that is fastened to the wall, so that I can get at both sides of the work easily. Hope this helps. |
#21
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The amount of information I've learned from this thread is amazing. Thanks OP for starting it, and thanks to all the luthiers here sharing so much knowledge.
__________________
Solo acoustic guitar videos: This Boy is Damaged - Little Watercolor Pictures of Locomotives - Ragamuffin |
#22
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I notice the cuts are drawn with the blade at an angle and a fair amount if weight on the front handle (or do it appears). Something I've read, but it makes SOOO much more sense after seeing it. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
#23
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I have a thickness sander but I always hand plane the tops unless it's a mahogany top. I use the thickness sander to get the show face close to my spec then finish off the braced side with a hand plane. My reasoning goes way back when I first learned to do this. I learned that a planed surface is a stronger surface, some would argue better for tone too (I have my doubts). Since the show face ends up getting sanded anyway as part of the finishing process then I don't bother to plane that and risk a tear out.
Anyway... I never really understood using a tooted plane blade or even planning on an angle. Spruce or cedar plane so well you can just take straight strokes and rip off paper thin strips. I use a pencil to mark wavy lines across the top so that I have a visual reference for when the whole top is evenly planed. Like Charles said planning tops is pure joy. |
#24
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thats a really pretty cedar top!
(hopefully I'm right about the cedar haha) |
#25
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Redwood
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#26
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Zircote is a relatively hard wood: skewing the direction of the plane is helpful, though probably not necessary. (The zircote simply refused to be thickness sanded, hence why I'm hand planing it.) It is more about the ergonomics of pushing the plane through the wood: most of the push comes from your rear leg, not your arms. Eliminating the skewing of the plane requires the waist to turn more so that both hands are on the same plane parallel to the direction of the stroke. Get a plane, make some shavings. Much is learned in the doing. Start with soft, straight-grained woods, and work up to the hard stuff with whacky grain. Have some fun. Last edited by charles Tauber; 11-17-2016 at 09:46 AM. |
#27
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#28
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#29
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The reason I didn't suggest a plane earlier is due to the OP's obvious inexperience using one. Easy to bite a big chunk out of the soundboard if it's not set up right or not sharp enough.
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Bryan |
#30
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Quote:
Rick
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”Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet” |