Which CF guitar sounds most true to a high end wood acoustic? - Page 4

Captain Jim · #46 09-21-2023, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Eastwood

...

All in good fun, of course - but seriously, trying to ascribe a common sound to all wood (or CF) guitars ever made is like saying all wine tastes the same.

The Blonde will go with me to a guitar shop. She will not, however, take me to a wine tasting. The taste of wine is wasted on me. Might have been when I asked, "Were these grapes stomped? I don't know about 'smokey, oak, or apple,' but I detect a hint of feet."

I'm kidding again - she says she can't take me anywhere.

JackDaniel · #47 09-21-2023, 06:37 PM

Just had a realization today. Got my new Blackbird Savoy in the mail today and was playing the Savoy, the McPherson Touring, the Blackbird El Capitan, and the McPherson Sable to decide which one I liked most (and which one sounds most like wood). I realized that I actually no longer know what wood sounds like.

I havent owned a wood instrument in so long that "wood" is some sort of holy grail in my mind only.

So I still dont know. BUT, I do know this, I cant decide which ones to sell!! I need to whittle it down to one travel guitar and one full size but at this rate, I'll just end up with 4 guitars...

Captain Jim · #48 09-21-2023, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackDaniel

Just had a realization today. Got my new Blackbird Savoy in the mail today and was playing the Savoy, the McPherson Touring, the Blackbird El Capitan, and the McPherson Sable to decide which one I liked most (and which one sounds most like wood). I realized that I actually no longer know what wood sounds like.

I havent owned a wood instrument in so long that "wood" is some sort of holy grail in my mind only.

So I still dont know. BUT, I do know this, I cant decide which ones to sell!! I need to whittle it down to one travel guitar and one full size but at this rate, I'll just end up with 4 guitars...

4 is a good number.

hotroad · #49 09-21-2023, 08:49 PM

Curious..... has the tone of the Emerald X20 been changed over the past ten years? Or has the X20 kept the same body size, thickness of CF, neck dimensions, and therefore tone since the early Emerald days? I know the electronics have developed since the beginning. How about the rest of the guitar?

Captain Jim · #50 09-22-2023, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hotroad

Curious..... has the tone of the Emerald X20 been changed over the past ten years? Or has the X20 kept the same body size, thickness of CF, neck dimensions, and therefore tone since the early Emerald days? I know the electronics have developed since the beginning. How about the rest of the guitar?

I think the biggest change in the X20 has been the elimination of the neck heel a couple years ago. I can't speak to any changes in tone due to that. My X20 is from 2017, and I love the tone.

The X20 has been what I would consider the flagship model for Emerald, so I wouldn't expect any tone changes with the latest iteration.

DavidE · #51 09-22-2023, 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Eastwood

“I've had several wood guitars that didn't sound like CF at all. One was an all wood Taylor... dread I think. It was a nice guitar, but sorta thin and bright sounding and I didn't care for the neck on that one. I had an original Martin D-18 that was great but again didn't really sound like a CF guitar. Sold it when I got my Guild. My Guild D40 sounds most like a CF guitar to my ears, but my Jasmine with the torrefied top sounds pretty close to a CF guitar as well.”

All in good fun, of course - but seriously, trying to ascribe a common sound to all wood (or CF) guitars ever made is like saying all wine tastes the same.

I never said that. In fact I said the opposite with regard to CF guitars. They all sound drastically different. But for most of them, they can easily be distinguished from wood guitars in general.

Earl49 · #52 09-22-2023, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidE

I had an original Emerald X20 that was great but again didn't really sound like a wood guitar. Sold it when I got my Sable. My McPherson Sable sounds most like a wood guitar to my ears, but my Rainsong Shorty with the unidirectional top sounds pretty close to a wood guitar as well. Those are the ones that remain in my stable.

We'e heard that same comment before. I haven't owned a Sable (yet) but this thought intrigues me. I have also been enamored of the APSE which is basically a painted Shorty. The unidirectional top seems to warm up the Rainsong sound versus the CF weave.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackDaniel

...BUT, I do know this, I cant decide which ones to sell!! I need to whittle it down to one travel guitar and one full size but at this rate, I'll just end up with 4 guitars...

That is a good problem to have, and a very tough choice.

It would be hard to choose between the Savoy, the El Capitan, and the McPherson Sable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hotroad

Curious..... has the tone of the Emerald X20 been changed over the past ten years? Or has the X20 kept the same body size, thickness of CF, neck dimensions, and therefore tone since the early Emerald days? I know the electronics have developed since the beginning. How about the rest of the guitar?

I can speak to this somewhat. I own a 2016 X20 and at the moment also have a 2021 X20 acquired in a recent trade. The tone of the older one is slightly rounder and warmer, you could call it "Martin-y". The newer one is just a touch brighter (Taylor-y) if you will. Both are good tones and equally loud.

Over these years, something changed about the layup process, the resin used, or the CF fabric -- but I have no idea just what. That is all proprietary information. Except for the small details as updated a couple of years ago (fretboard surface, pinless bridge, scalloped fretboard end, rib bevel, neck heel gone) the two guitars are essentially the same. I have a slight preference for the older tone, but unless you heard them live and side by side, you would never know. The EQ difference is quite subtle.

tbeltrans · #53 09-22-2023, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Jim

4 is a good number.

...'Cause one is the loneliest number that you'll ever do.

Tony

Aspiring · #54 09-22-2023, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Jim

4 is a good number.

You mean 4 types of guitar right?

boneuphtoner · #55 09-22-2023, 05:46 PM

I’m late to this post, but I’ll say arguably the most conversial thing here: for the classical fingerpicking I do, the Sable beats nearly everything, including most wood guitars I’ve ever played on TONE.

Captain Jim · #56 09-22-2023, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aspiring

You mean 4 types of guitar right?

At my age, 4 guitars is the only multiple delight I can handle. Heck, I can't even eat 4 donuts anymore.

BigAl80 · #57 09-30-2023, 03:09 PM

The Composite Acoustics Legacy with “vintage voicing” (pre peavy) is hands down the best sounding carbon fiber guitar I’ve played. I check Reverb from time to time to see if one’s available

The McPherson Sable blew me away earlier this week (thank you Guitar Sanctuary in McKinney TX) it sounds deep, rich and clear. It didn’t want to put it down and plan on purchasing one

I’ve played several Rainsongs over the years and haven’t had a great experience yet. They seem very well built and are beautiful but I can’t get on board with the tone.

The Emerald X20 sounded pretty good as I played it but from the other side of the sound hole it sounds very thin and does not put out much volume.

I will say the the Emerald is the most comfortable to play by far. The multiple bevels are brilliant. Plugged in and for personal enjoyment they are probably great but I hate knowing that the sound is lacking for others in the room. (I usually play unplugged as the solo musician in the room which makes this the wrong instrument for me.

I would love to experience the X30 and a blackbird

tbeltrans · #58 09-30-2023, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigAl80

The Composite Acoustics Legacy with “vintage voicing” (pre peavy) is hands down the best sounding carbon fiber guitar I’ve played. I check Reverb from time to time to see if one’s available

The McPherson Sable blew me away earlier this week (thank you Guitar Sanctuary in McKinney TX) it sounds deep, rich and clear. It didn’t want to put it down and plan on purchasing one

I’ve played several Rainsongs over the years and haven’t had a great experience yet. They seem very well built and are beautiful but I can’t get on board with the tone.

The Emerald X20 sounded pretty good as I played it but from the other side of the sound hole it sounds very thin and does not put out much volume.

I will say the the Emerald is the most comfortable to play by far. The multiple bevels are brilliant. Plugged in and for personal enjoyment they are probably great but I hate knowing that the sound is lacking for others in the room. (I usually play unplugged as the solo musician in the room which makes this the wrong instrument for me.

I would love to experience the X30 and a blackbird

My recommendation regarding the X20 is to try it in a few open/alternate tunings and then see what it can do. When I tuned my X20-7 down a whole step, it just bloomed as if a completely different instrument. Now, fooling around with open tunings on my X20, I am experiencing the same thing. I honestly don't know if Alistair designed them for that purpose, but that (to me) is where these really shine.

I also own both a Sable and Touring, and they seem to do well in standard or open tunings. The advantage the X20 has (and the X20-7) is the wider string spacing at the saddle. It is amazing how much difference 1/16" can make in fingerstyle comfort.

I would not be able to pick a "best" between the McPherson and Emerald, so in true AGF fashion - own them all!

Tony

Earl49 · #59 09-30-2023, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigAl80

...The Emerald X20 sounded pretty good as I played it but from the other side of the sound hole it sounds very thin and does not put out much volume. ...Plugged in and for personal enjoyment they are probably great but I hate knowing that the sound is lacking for others in the room. (I usually play unplugged as the solo musician in the room which makes this the wrong instrument for me.

I would love to experience the X30 and a blackbird

I play my X20 at a bluegrass jam nearly every week, my main musical outlet these days. Digging in with a flat pick, I make plenty of volume to keep up with those danged banjos! The X30 was even better in that regard (I called it the D-28 killer) but I sold mine. It was simply too boomy on the low E for my ear and technique. But it sounded really good in the jam circle and garnered some nice comments.

My [limited] experience with the Blackbird El Capitan is that it is a small jumbo size and very comparable to my Taylor 414ce in size, volume and voice. FWIW.

Aspiring · #60 09-30-2023, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Earl49

I play my X20 at a bluegrass jam nearly every week, my main musical outlet these days. Digging in with a flat pick, I make plenty of volume to keep up with those danged banjos! The X30 was even better in that regard (I called it the D-28 killer) but I sold mine. It was simply too boomy on the low E for my ear and technique. But it sounded really good in the jam circle and garnered some nice comments.

My [limited] experience with the Blackbird El Capitan is that it is a small jumbo size and very comparable to my Taylor 414ce in size, volume and voice. FWIW.

While I agree the El Capitan has volume it is small for SJ size. The lower bout is 16" but the depth is under 3.5" and the curves on the back make it feel even smaller.