This can't be good news for musicians

[SongwriterFan]

There's a local restaurant here that hosts music on Tuesdays and Thursdays through Saturday. Closed on Monday, and no music on Sunday or Wednesday.

I tried to float the idea to them on Wednesday nights of getting a host (or hosts) that would do song swaps with other singer/songwriters, allowing the restaurant to shift the burden of booking acts/etc onto the hosts.

Well, it turns out that the running/walking event they host that night (weekly) brings in more money than most of their music nights, so they're not at all interested . . even though they bill themselves as a music venue.

That can't be a good sign for musicians hoping to get gigs at restaurants. Unless said restaurants simply can't get business any other way, I suppose.

[rmyAddison]

Or, just maybe, the owners of the restaurant know what's actually works best for them, it's a business, and you want them to change the night that quote "brings in more money"......I side with them.

How this turns into a generalization for all restaurants.....

[Brick is Red]

I don't see how this has broader application.

[rogthefrog]

One restaurant != Musicians in general.

[Nama Ensou]

Originally Posted by SongwriterFan

...can't be a good sign for musicians hoping to get gigs at restaurants.

It's actually a trend that's been going on for a few decades now, and sporting events aren't the only alternative that's been chosen.

I hold out hope for the OP though due to his signature lines which make me believe he may just be having a bad day.

- Reality doesn't care what science thinks.

- I'd rather have a single book that's always right than a library full of books that are often wrong.

[Goodallboy]

How this impacts musicians as a whole, escapes me.

This is a business decision by a musician friendly venue that isn't taking away anything from the musicians, it's just not replacing a more lucrative event for an additional music night.

It's all good, relax.

[SongwriterFan]

Originally Posted by rmyAddison

Or, just maybe, the owners of the restaurant know what's actually works best for them

Of course they do

and you want them to change the night that quote "brings in more money

I wasn't trying to get them to change. I was offering an idea/opportunity that I thought perhaps they hadn't considered, and that perhaps there were other reasons that they hadn't expanded music into that night yet.

I just recently offered up a replacement singer/songwriter for one of their shows after they had a cancellation. The manager (who now does the booking there, too) seemed very appreciated of my suggestion and he booked the person I recommended soon after I mentioned the name to him.

The conversation took all of a minute, two tops. I simply said something like "if you've ever thought of having music on Wednesday nights, too, I've got an idea that I've seen at other places that works well and that would save you the responsibility of having to book the acts yourself". The response was simply something like "we do quite well that night so we don't have an interest in that right now". Short and sweet. No hard feelings either way.

[SongwriterFan]

Originally Posted by Nama Ensou

It's actually a trend that's been going on for a few decades now

I imagine so.

which make me believe he may just be having a bad day.

Actually a pretty good day compared to the last week.

But this wasn't about ME, really, as I'm not a working musician.

I simply like to be able to listen to good singer/songwriters, and this venue is a very good place for that and have done quite well with it from what I've seen. I was merely trying to help them in that regard, if I was able to.

[SongwriterFan]

Originally Posted by Nama Ensou

It's actually a trend that's been going on for a few decades now

Originally Posted by Goodallboy

How this impacts musicians as a whole, escapes me.

See Nama Ensou's quote above.

It's not about the restaurant's decision . . . it's more about the trend that people seem to appreciate live music less and less these days . . . leading to decisions like this one.

Fortunately, there are still restaurants out there (including this one) that do, IMO, go out of their way to have good live music, even if it means that it might be costing them some of their profit potential.

[hotroad]

Here is more on the theme.....
I gig quite a lot in the summer in my local town where music is thriving. But, I am hearing from store and restaurant owners that the music does NOT bring in more people or cause them to stay longer, therefore spend more. While questioning deeper, I am hearing that because we have so many musicians here who want to gig locally, many of the younger players who have more energy to get those gigs, are not musically prepared to gig, ie not very good musicians and are therefore leaving a bad image for us who are prepared and able to bring a nice evening of music. More specifically, I hear that the younger players are often out of key, not on time to the gig, have poor equipment that cannot be heard or is way too loud. This is not a case of an over demanding owner. It's a case of the business owners deciding now to not have live music at all.
Forgive me if I offend since there are plenty of young musicians who put me to shame musically and are ready to gig and do a great job of it. I am not stereotyping, just reporting what I hear. Interesting, huh?

[SongwriterFan]

Originally Posted by hotroad

have poor equipment that cannot be heard or is way too loud.

This place has its own PA and a mixer, if the musician chooses to use it. Or he can bring his own. But, the venue doesn't have a sound guy (or anybody who knows how to run sound). There's one guy who plays there who will always ask me to help him set up their sound . . the first time he was there he asked if somebody knew how to set everything up. Not sure why the waitress decided to tell him to come see me . . . though I do know enough about running a sound board to make it work.

Anyway, the issue here is that the music is almost always too soft or too loud. It's hard to be "just right". But the main problem is that so many of the people are NOT there to hear the music . . to them it's just background noise. So, if the musician turns it up, people just talk louder.

Even on the one night a month when they have a true "sell out" crowd for a local legend (really regional), so many of the people there still want to talk and the music ends up having to be pretty loud. Around 95db on average, I'd say (got an app for that LOL). So not ear-splitting, but plenty loud.

[Nama Ensou]

Originally Posted by SongwriterFan

It's not about the restaurant's decision . . . it's more about the trend that people seem to appreciate live music less and less these days . . . leading to decisions like this one.

Fortunately, there are still restaurants out there (including this one) that do, IMO, go out of their way to have good live music, even if it means that it might be costing them some of their profit potential.

My post actually was meant to encompass both meanings; less club owners wanting to be supporters of the arts, and less customers wanting to be the audience.

Like you said though, at least there are the places still knowing that a portion of the public wants the music. I've been playing four nights a week for the last month and a half after going out and doing some auditions and it feels great to be actually getting to work on more music and having somewhere to play it more than just once a week.

[archerscreek]

It won't be long before local venues start charging musicians for the privilege of performing live. Haha. Actually, it's already occurring. I came across a so called open jam that charges $5 to anyone that wants to play. No wonder so many people are sitting on their couches and recording YouTube videos.

[Nama Ensou]

Originally Posted by hotroad

I am hearing from store and restaurant owners that the music does NOT bring in more people or cause them to stay longer, therefore spend more.

Some places it does, and other places, no difference. Some of them even decide against music because they want the people to leave sooner so that others can sit at their table.

Where I'm playing on Friday's they have no advertising for music and at least partially due to that, no real difference, other than the couple or two who come in every week because they saw me somewhere else, or heard about it through a friend. They were hoping to see a big difference.

On the other hand, Saturday nights I'm at a hotel and they don't care if they see a difference in the receipts; they just want the music for the same reason they've got a giant goldfish pond outside. Cachet. They want it because it's just something that a nice hotel should have.

...not very good musicians...are therefore leaving a bad image for us who are prepared and able to bring a nice evening of music.
...there are plenty of...musicians who put me to shame musically and are ready to gig and do a great job of it.

I've been seeing a lot of this around here, mixed with some great talents too, but it seems to be a lackadaisical approach by both the younger and older musicians, that if they bring energy, or a long song list, or a bad *** appearance, that it's good enough and everyone should flock to see them. Too bad for a couple of them so far because they already had performers at two of the gigs I now have, and not because I'm any better than anyone else, but because even though I've been doing this for decades now, I still play as if every performance counts and I try to imagine how I would be singing if there were 10,000 people out there.

I told a drummer friend a long time ago not to complain about drum machines, because players like him would always have a place to play. Drum machines were only going to get rid of drummers who should have never had a gig in the first place.

[Nama Ensou]

Originally Posted by SongwriterFan

...the issue here is that the music is almost always too soft or too loud. It's hard to be "just right". But the main problem is that so many of the people are NOT there to hear the music . . to them it's just background noise. So, if the musician turns it up, people just talk louder.

Sometimes I realize that they don't want to listen because they're in the club to catch up with their friends, but some of those customers talking the loudest with their back to you all night will come up before they leave and name of the songs that they really enjoyed as they're putting money in the jar.

Other nights, people are trying to listen and they can't because of the cacklers and yellers at the bar. Doesn't always work, but sometimes I'll take the opposite approach, and it worked perfectly last Saturday. I was playing and the guy's girlfriend starts screeching. I started singing and playing louder but there was no change. Then I got really soft and quiet and stayed that way for a while, even stopping playing the guitar so that I could gently sing acapella, which made it glaringly obvious how inappropriately loud they were, after which they talked quietly for the next hour and I was able to return to normal volume levels. Like I said, it doesn't always work, but it sure is fun when it does.