Electric Novice looking for advice

[mandobaron]

I'm a long time acoustic musician wanting to get into some electric guitar sounds and know almost nothing about any of it. All I can tell you is I want to make sounds like these:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5ggv-5s4bs

Warm, a little crunchy but mostly clean. It sounds very "organic" to my ears, but thats a word I just made up, maybe there is a real word in the electric world.

My inclination is to mimic Julian's setup (but likely in a more economically feasible fashion). A tele and a champ, or so I read, but I'm only regurgitating information I read online.

My ultimate question is, what should I be looking for, and what price range am I looking at to make a similar sound? I'm all for buying used/beat up gear that's structurally sound, and want something that isn't going to frustrate me quality-wise or break the bank.

So, in short, I'd loved to be schooled on this foreign world and get some suggestions of how to jump in.

Thanks!
Baron

[Steel and wood]

He is playing a Telecaster using his neck position pickup (you can see in the video) through a clean channel. (Couldn't tell you what amp he is using). In some ways it's unusual as most Telecaster players get their lead tones from their bridge pickup.

If this is what you like, a value for money Made in Mexico Fender Stratocaster or Telecaster (or potentially a top end Squire) through a clean channel on a solid state amp (like a Fender Mustang) or a good clean tube amp like the Fender Blues Junior. If you wanted to fatten up the tone a little, then a guitar with hum-buckers will work also.

Good luck!

[muscmp]

good name for a band, "electric novice."

if you are fairly knowledgeable about the inner workings of guitars in general, i would recommend a good used tele and a used blues jr. but first, you may want to go to your local big box store and play every guitar and amp you can. that will give you a better idea of what to look for used. then, check for sold listings on ebay and reverb to give you an idea of what you may likely spend for both. note that the amp is considered about 40% or so of your electric sound.

mr. lage is one of my favorite guitar players.

play music!

[FrankHudson]

Other than good musicianship (no small thing) that's pretty much a standard Telecaster neck pickup into a Fender Tweed style amp. Looked like it might have been a Fender Champ. But in this case the amp wouldn't be critical. Even a slightly brighter, more mid scooped, "blackface" amp like a Deluxe Reverb or a Princeton can get close to that tone. The smaller cabinet on the amp in the video sounded a bit "boxier" perhaps than a Deluxe Reverb. And yes, a Fender Mustang can get those kinds of sounds.

Close to Bill Frisell's tone, and he uses Deluxe Reverb Reissues on the road all the time. and rarely moves off the neck pickup on his Telecaster.

Doesn't sound as dry as just a tweed Champ to me. There may be a bit of reverb or tremelo (from a stomp box or something?) in there too. Princeton Reverb and Deluxe Reverb have those effects build in to the amp, but since it looks like a Champ, that's gotta be from outside the amp.

[rampix]

Baron,
Steel and Wood gave you solid advice. One of the MIM telecaster models would certainly do it, at a very good value. I have a 50 buck Squier strat, won on eBay, that I hot-rodded and will probably keep forever.

That said, if interested please take a look at the Fender Tele that I listed in the Classifieds just today. I think it will look familiar to you. If this in any way violates forum policy please advise and I will edit to remove immediately.

BTW- Steel and Wood hit another homer with the Mustang amp suggestion. That's exactly what I play through the most. The tele sounds best to me on some of the Fender amp settings. But having the various Vox and Marshall emulations allows us beginners in the electric world the option to sample, which helps when upgrading to a tube amp...IMHO They also allow you to experiment with basic effects without dropping the money on the pedals.

Good luck on your electric quest. Knowing the sound you are chasing is a big advantage!

[Bob Womack]

Looks like a tweed champ but I'd be willing to bet he's got a really nice compressor in line there as well.

Bob

[Otterhound]

From what I saw , the switch is in the middle position . That could be neck only or neck and bridge depending on how it's wired .
The amp looks too wide to be a Champ .
My Rosewood Tele has a neck pickup with this fat , smooth tone to it . No compression needed and certainly no humbucker .
What people tend to forget is that jazz was the dominant genre at the time that Fender and Gibson/Les Paul were designing their first electric guitars . The Telecaster certainly can do jazz . It is people that prevent it or try to .
If you are looking for a good jazzy Tele neck pickup , try a Klein AlNiCo 4 . He still has the magnets and will build them on request . He stopped listing them because so few were willing to order a pickup with the AlNiCo 4 magnets since Fender never used them .
I like this particular pickup set and have used it in 3 builds including one right beside me .
Even the bridge pickup has this sweet and smooth tone .

[FrankHudson]

Champs compress naturally even at lower stage volume levels, one of the cool things about them.

I agree the idea of sending the OP to a MI Mexico Tele is fine. I have a Squier, MI Japan, MIM, and US Telecaster. They all could have their stock neck pickups, and they all can do this timbre (at my musical level I won't be playing those chord stretches though). There might be subtle differences in the pickups, but they have that sound. And then a small Fender tube amp or decent emulation of same (the current Fender Mustang modeling amp for example). And some reverb and possibly mild tremolo. I've become a tremolo junkie with Tele's lately.

It's possible there'd be more differences that might be significant to the OP between Telecasters based on other things (neck carve, fretboard radius, frets, nut width) than between neck pickups, as odd as that might seem. I don't know why that is (in my experience). I care deeply about the differences I sense in Telecaster bridge pickups, but not neck pickups.

[muscmp]

here is a quote from an interview with him in may 2016.

Right now, my touring rig is a 1954 Fender blackguard Tele and a ’58 tweed Champ—no reverb and only five watts. When it sounds good and everything clicks in, you don’t feel like you’re a pretender.

play music!

[mandobaron]

Thanks everyone! I went to my local shop and played a bunch of different guitars and really leaned towards the teles. I tried some modeling amps and a couple larger tubes, and the tubes definitely sounded more organic to my ears which I enjoyed. I also learned that there are so many variables between guitars, pickups, amps, guitar knob settings and amp settings that drastically affect the tone. Fun to have the options but bewildering after playing acoustic for all these years.

I looked around on Craigslist and found a couple things that piqued my interest.

A "new England custom guitars" tele made by Eric brown, Lovely instrument, solid new England black Walnut, humbucker in the neck position. The seller wants 800, but I could probably talk him down a little. Anyone heard of this builder? I can't find much online.

A recent and almost brand new looking Chinese champion 600 for under $150, probably could get him closer to 100. Anyone have thoughts about these cheap little amps?

Thanks very much
Baron

[roylor4]

Originally Posted by mandobaron

Thanks everyone! I went to my local shop and played a bunch of different guitars and really leaned towards the teles. I tried some modeling amps and a couple larger tubes, and the tubes definitely sounded more organic to my ears which I enjoyed. I also learned that there are so many variables between guitars, pickups, amps, guitar knob settings and amp settings that drastically affect the tone. Fun to have the options but bewildering after playing acoustic for all these years.

I looked around on Craigslist and found a couple things that piqued my interest.

A "new England custom guitars" tele made by Eric brown, Lovely instrument, solid new England black Walnut, humbucker in the neck position. The seller wants 800, but I could probably talk him down a little. Anyone heard of this builder? I can't find much online.

A recent and almost brand new looking Chinese champion 600 for under $150, probably could get him closer to 100. Anyone have thoughts about these cheap little amps?

Thanks very much
Baron

I have a Champ 600 RI, but play most through my Laney Cub 10. I find the tone through a Bugera V5 vastly superior to the Champ 600 - bigger speaker, and very good digital reverb.

My recommendation for attaining this tone with minimal budget and high quality?

Carvin Vintage 16

or the smaller Bugera V5

Used Blues Jr's can be had for 250-300 too.

and a G&L ASAT or Bluesboy - G&L at MF

[mandobaron]

Cool! Thanks for that info. I do like the look of that Bugera and the price is certainly right!

Any comments on the Bugera vs the Carvin?

Still wondering if anyone has any experience with "New England Custom Guitars" or Eric Brown?

Thanks,
Baron

[FrankHudson]

Originally Posted by mandobaron

Thanks everyone! I went to my local shop and played a bunch of different guitars and really leaned towards the teles. I tried some modeling amps and a couple larger tubes, and the tubes definitely sounded more organic to my ears which I enjoyed. I also learned that there are so many variables between guitars, pickups, amps, guitar knob settings and amp settings that drastically affect the tone. Fun to have the options but bewildering after playing acoustic for all these years.

I looked around on Craigslist and found a couple things that piqued my interest.

A "new England custom guitars" tele made by Eric brown, Lovely instrument, solid new England black Walnut, humbucker in the neck position. The seller wants 800, but I could probably talk him down a little. Anyone heard of this builder? I can't find much online.

A recent and almost brand new looking Chinese champion 600 for under $150, probably could get him closer to 100. Anyone have thoughts about these cheap little amps?

Thanks very much
Baron

I have a Champ 600. OK amp by itself, but a little on the dark side timbre wise. Actually matches up to a classic Tele bridge pickup about as well any anything else in my collection of electric guitars. Darker Tele neck PU? Not so much.

When I play it I usually plug it into a small 2x10" speaker cabinet which lets it match up well with more guitars/pickups.

Some personal advice, and understand it as just one person's opinion, that world of bewildering options is dangerous as you start out on electric, particularly from an acoustic background. One of the distinctive things about a Telecaster into a Champ (or similar) is that it restricts some options. Yes you have two pickups and a (useful!) tone knob on the Tele, and yes the Champ can be clean to crunchy depending on how high you turn it up--but that's fewer options than many electric guitar, amp, and pedal board setups. If you get to terms with an electric in such simplified terms, you have the basis for adding more spices later (and many Tele players find ways to do things, via playing techniques, that as a blind listener you would think would take extra equipment).

Start with a Tele or another "classic" design before thinking about custom options. In time, with playing, you'll understand where you want to go beyond those classics.

If you try a modeling amp, remember those featured presets will be someone else's idea of a good sound. Look for the simplest, least complex patches, or turn off every extra thing (except for maybe a little reverb and possibly a bit of tremolo) and turn down the gain if you're looking for the timbre in your video.

Again, personal opinion, but I think the perfect amp for a Tele player seeking a clean tone at lower volumes is a Fender Princeton Reverb or Deluxe Reverb, with the Vox AC series as an alternative. A Fender modeling amp like the Mustang series or the SuperChamp XD will get in the ballpark of those Fender Amp sounds at a low price.

[Tahitijack]

If you look at his youtube videos he appears with a lot of Fender amps but, as others have noted, in a Fretboard Journal interview Julian says his amp is a 1960 Fender Champ.

[roylor4]

Originally Posted by mandobaron

Cool! Thanks for that info. I do like the look of that Bugera and the price is certainly right!

Any comments on the Bugera vs the Carvin?

Still wondering if anyone has any experience with "New England Custom Guitars" or Eric Brown?

Thanks,
Baron

Baron, The biggest difference will be clean headroom at higher volumes w/the Carvin on the 16 watt setting. This is true of all tube amps, generally speaking - higher wattage = more clean headroom.

Some amps (like the princeton and deluxe reverb mentioned by Frank) have a lot of "clean headroom" or the ability to be played pretty loud with minimal distortion. Amps with a gain and volume control are very useful. Gain down + volume up = a lot of clean headroom. Gain up and volume down = similar volume with lots of grind (low headroom) - think AC/DC.

Don't mistake the volume of a 5 watt tube amp of being wimpy because of it's low wattage. To double a 5 watt amps volume, you have to go to 50 watts and to double 50 = 500watts. They are pretty loud. The wattage is power consumption, not decibels. I have heard 5-10 watt tube amps blow the doors off of a 50 watt SS amp.

I also agree that the Champ 600 is a bit "dark" sounding. The Bugera has more chime. Vox amps are particularly chimey, which I don't find a good match for single coils and Teles in particular, but that depends on your taste. The Bugera is kind of middle ground, as is the Blues Jr. The Carvin is slightly darker than a BJ, but not tremendously so. It also has the benefit of 5/16 watt settings.