Advice needed badly

[adaw2821]

OK so update. I had been looking at amps and had my mind made up to get a good midrange real tube amp. And then a saw something that I've heard before a few times that made me stop and think. I'm going to be playing at home most of the time. No gigging I might play at church occasionally. I've heard a few times to get good tone on a tube amp you need to play at good volume, and most people when playing at home go digital.

Thoughts?

I like the idea of a tube amp but would not be practical if I was using it for 15% of my playing.

Or would a smaller am fit the bill?

[ericmeyer4]

Originally Posted by adaw2821

OK so update. I had been looking at amps and had my mind made up to get a good midrange real tube amp. And then a saw something that I've heard before a few times that made me stop and think. I'm going to be playing at home most of the time. No gigging I might play at church occasionally. I've heard a few times to get good tone on a tube amp you need to play at good volume, and most people when playing at home go digital.

Thoughts?

I like the idea of a tube amp but would not be practical if I was using it for 15% of my playing.

Or would a smaller am fit the bill?

At lower volumes I found I was more satisfied with modelers than with tube amps.

I ran through a blackface vibrochamp, silverface champ, silverface vibrochamp, a tweed clone, a modded champ 600, a Vox AC4 head/cab, a Peavy classic 50 (turned way down) trying to get a tone I was happy with at a lower volume. All with various attenuators, tubes, spearkers, etc to cut the volume.

The Vox I felt was the best because you could drop it to a half watt and overdrive it faster, but it was still loud with bedroom playing.

The best tone I got at low volumes was a POD HD500x that I ran through some powered monitors or headphones when I wanted to be quiet.

If you go the tube route 5 watts will be more than enough for home playing. In my experience, I was running the tube amps clean and using pedals for dirt. You could easily take it to church too. Especially, if you will mic it. I played an outdoor gig with a 6watt vibro champ. Sound system took care of everything so I was heard easily.

Now you can find a good tone with a tube amp on the lower end of the volume dial. They do tend to open up at higher volumes and the settings you use at low volume will be different than those you use at high volume. The best advice I can give is to go try a bunch of amps (tube, solid state, modelers) at low volume and see which ones sound the best to you.

[adaw2821]

Thanks. I plan on making a trip to guitar center soon and I'll try out a bunch of stuff keeping lower volume in mind. I'll be interested to see how stuff compares

[FrankHudson]

Late in the thread, but I just have to say that a Telecaster does not have to be a bright, twangy guitar. A good Telecaster neck pickup is as close as you can get to a mellow archtop tone in a solid body. Shocking how you can think you're hearing a hollowbody under that tone sometimes.

Now turn down the tone control. Tone controls on Teles are more useful than the same on just about any guitar. Turn it way down. Put it on the neck pickup. You can get way down to the sound CSNY "Wooden Ships" lead (even if that might have been a Gretsch) with a "twangy" guitar.

Enjoy your search!

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by eatswodo

True enough, Steve, but your average novice wouldn't have a clue about doing this...

Novice or not, it just involves tightening a few screws and tuning the guitar back up to pitch - no harder than changing a lightbulb (I'm waiting for the banjo jokes here), and for $20 one of the so-called "techs" at GC could even do it for him...

[Scotso]

I immobilize my strat trem and have been doing it for yrs. A stack of pennies held with painter tape placed between the body and the block. Remove wang bar and never worry about setting that dang thing up for the rest of your life.

I prob committed some guitar felony with this but I do not like whammies, bigsbies, floyds or otherwise. But strats are nice

[Steel and wood]

Originally Posted by adaw2821

OK so update. I had been looking at amps and had my mind made up to get a good midrange real tube amp. And then a saw something that I've heard before a few times that made me stop and think. I'm going to be playing at home most of the time. No gigging I might play at church occasionally. I've heard a few times to get good tone on a tube amp you need to play at good volume, and most people when playing at home go digital.

Thoughts?

I like the idea of a tube amp but would not be practical if I was using it for 15% of my playing.

Or would a smaller am fit the bill?

If you do most of your playing at home (and particularly if you want to use headphones to practice and/or play) then a solid state amp like the Fender Mustang is a great choice. (Where the tone is not effected by volume and the amp comes with multiple inbuilt simulated sounds, options and effects). If you want to play live with one, they will do the job handsomely also.

Having said that, I also love a good Fender tube amp and the clean sounds on a tube amp like the Blues Junior are where it's at for me. (Yes, I can hear the difference between it and the Mustang even at low volumes). Multiple tube amp enthusiasts other than myself rave about breakup and distortion they achieve from pushing their amp's tubes, but you need to play at relatively high volumes to do so. If distortion is your thing, you have the option of using a pedal and playing at reasonable volumes.

If you are starting out, then a solid state amp like the Fender Mustang in particular would be my choice. (Price, versatility and inbuilt options for starters).

Either way, good luck!

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by adaw2821

...I had been looking at amps and had my mind made up to get a good midrange real tube amp...I'm going to be playing at home most of the time. No gigging, I might play at church occasionally. I've heard a few times to get good tone on a tube amp you need to play at good volume...I like the idea of a tube amp but would not be practical if I was using it for 15% of my playing.

Or would a smaller amp fit the bill?

Originally Posted by Rumblefish

...The Bugera listed above is a good, lower cost option that will get you good clean sounds, has the reverb on board and has a second channel that can get you a good drive sound without a pedal...

Originally Posted by Steel and wood

...I also love a good Fender tube amp and the clean sounds on a tube amp like the Blues Junior are where it's at for me. (Yes, I can hear the difference between it and the Mustang even at low volumes). Multiple tube amp enthusiasts other than myself rave about breakup and distortion they achieve from pushing their amp's tubes, but you need to play at relatively high volumes to do so...

Not necessarily; many modern tube amps - the aforementioned Bugera V22 (and its little brother V5) included - can be scaled back to reasonable practice levels (0.1W in the case of the V5), and until you get into the realm of uber-buck modeling boxes like the Kemper you're not going to achieve "that" tone regardless of manufacturers' claims . Given the exceptionally reasonable price as well as the fact that the current Infinium circuitry makes power tube replacement a plug-&-play proposition (most amps require a trip to an experienced tech for a bias job - in layman's terms, matching/optimizing the new tubes to the amp's circuitry - and most emphatically not a DIY job for amateurs), I'd take a serious look at the V22 before settling on anything else...

[Eric_M]

Originally Posted by FrankHudson

Late in the thread, but I just have to say that a Telecaster does not have to be a bright, twangy guitar. A good Telecaster neck pickup is as close as you can get to a mellow archtop tone in a solid body. Shocking how you can think you're hearing a hollowbody under that tone sometimes.

Now turn down the tone control. Tone controls on Teles are more useful than the same on just about any guitar. Turn it way down. Put it on the neck pickup. You can get way down to the sound CSNY "Wooden Ships" lead (even if that might have been a Gretsch) with a "twangy" guitar.

Enjoy your search!

+1

Originally Posted by Steve DeRosa

Novice or not, it just involves tightening a few screws and tuning the guitar back up to pitch - no harder than changing a lightbulb (I'm waiting for the banjo jokes here), and for $20 one of the so-called "techs" at GC could even do it for him...

+1 blocking a trem isn't alchemy, especially in the YouTube age. And note the one performer the OP specified is John Mayer, best known for playing a Strat (and most frequently sans whammy if memory serves).

[Steel and wood]

I don't know of any solid state amp manufacturer who claims their amps to sound like tube amps. But what I do know is that solid state amps like the Fender Mustang offer great sounds, greater versatility and more options for home playing and for practice purposes. (They are cheaper also).

[adaw2821]

Originally Posted by FrankHudson

Late in the thread, but I just have to say that a Telecaster does not have to be a bright, twangy guitar. A good Telecaster neck pickup is as close as you can get to a mellow archtop tone in a solid body. Shocking how you can think you're hearing a hollowbody under that tone sometimes.

Now turn down the tone control. Tone controls on Teles are more useful than the same on just about any guitar. Turn it way down. Put it on the neck pickup. You can get way down to the sound CSNY "Wooden Ships" lead (even if that might have been a Gretsch) with a "twangy" guitar.

Enjoy your search!

Thanks for this. I have heard incredible tones from a tele and have heard that they are incredibly versatile but I didn't know much about how to file in those different tones and don't want a ton of pedals. May be simpler to mellow it out that. I thought.

[JeffreyAK]

One tip I heard from Robin Trower many years ago, that works and works for basses too, is, if you're looking at different electric guitars, play them unplugged and focus on the ones you like best unplugged before plugging in. You can do a lot with amps and effects, but you can only modify what's there in the first place, and you can notice a lot unplugged that you might not notice plugged in.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by FrankHudson

...a Telecaster does not have to be a bright, twangy guitar. A good Telecaster neck pickup is as close as you can get to a mellow archtop tone in a solid body...Tone controls on Teles are more useful than the same on just about any guitar. Turn it way down. Put it on the neck pickup. You can get way down to the sound of CSNY "Wooden Ships" lead (even if that might have been a Gretsch) with a "twangy" guitar...

Bought one of the very first, late-CBS '52 Tele reissues in early '83...

Owned a Gretsch Double Annie since May '64...

Used to do CSNY on both of them...

Rewired the Tele with a 5-way switch to get Gretsch-type tones...

Bought a MIJ Fender/Squier Strat in '86, set it up (as with nearly all my electrics) with flatwound 12's...

Sold the Tele 20+ years ago, still have the Gretsch and Strat, bought another Gretsch last year...

Tele didn't give me anything the Gretsch couldn't (with less weight on the strap), the Strat covers all the rest of the "Fender" tones - and my 3-PU Gretsch 5622T covers both bases...

Right now I'm only keeping the Strat for the collector value...

[Steel and wood]

Originally Posted by adaw2821

Thanks for this. I have heard incredible tones from a tele and have heard that they are incredibly versatile but I didn't know much about how to file in those different tones and don't want a ton of pedals. May be simpler to mellow it out that. I thought.

A Stratocaster is more versatile than a Telecaster in my opinion, even if my Telecaster has become my go to electric guitar. (Has a five way switch instead of three and a tremolo arm if you choose to use).

[roylor4]

Originally Posted by Steve DeRosa

Not necessarily; many modern tube amps - the aforementioned Bugera V22 (and its little brother V5) included - can be scaled back to reasonable practice levels (0.1W in the case of the V5), and until you get into the realm of uber-buck modeling boxes like the Kemper you're not going to achieve "that" tone regardless of manufacturers' claims . Given the exceptionally reasonable price as well as the fact that the current Infinium circuitry makes power tube replacement a plug-&-play proposition (most amps require a trip to an experienced tech for a bias job - in layman's terms, matching/optimizing the new tubes to the amp's circuitry - and most emphatically not a DIY job for amateurs), I'd take a serious look at the V22 before settling on anything else...

I do not care for modeling amps. Tubes or nuttin' for me. You can get a tube amp that goes from 5-16 watts too (pentode/triode modes) like the Carvin Vintage 16.

You can get a wider variety of tones from a modeling amp but IMO, a simple tube amp has the benefit of really making you use the knobs on your guitar and master them more fully.

My wife has a Vox ac-4 mini and it also has 4/1/.1 watt settings. For getting usable, clean tones, I find 5-10 watts to be good for home use.

Only you can discover if a modeler or tube amp is right for you. Take many test drives.