a non-religious but spiritual quandry

[ewalling]

On a slight tangent, I've never personally understood the compulsion to be listening to music all the time. There are times when we can really give ourselves to music, but the impulse to stick it on to fill every waking moment has seemed to me a need to avoid silence rather than genuinely listen to and appreciate music. I see kids round the college with headphones on as they navigate their way around corridors, stairs and classrooms. I can't help but think that this relentless barrage of noise somehow places a barrier between them and the outside world, reducing it to a TV screen-like visual image rather than a full reality.

[Silly Moustache]

I've been retired for seven years, and worked at home for the last three, but I spent about 40 years working in offices, most of them open plan.

I have NEVER worked in an office with music playing...wassamatter - got no work to do? Phones not rining? People not shouting at each other? Business not coming in?

Be afraid!

[reeve21]

I agree very strongly with the last 2 posts.

We seem to need to anesthetize ourselves from what is going on around us. Many do it with TV, but I know I tend to escape to music in a way that may not always be the best for me or those around me.

As much as I love music, I don't listen to it when I am hiking, when I'm working, when I'm reading something challenging, when my boat is underway or when I ride a bike. Sometimes I even turn it off in the car! We seem to be afraid of our own thoughts sometimes, I know I can be guilty of that if I'm not careful. I could say more but there are the forum guidelines to follow In keeping with the title of this thread, let's just say that there is more to spirituality than listening to music.

[cotten]

Until I retired a year ago, I was a full time music minister, a pastor whose primary tool for ministry was music. (Now that I'm retired, I'm doing the same job, just for a quarter of the pay!) I worked in a busy office with 4-7 coworkers within earshot. I almost never played music loud enough for anyone else to hear in the office, for two reasons:

1. Church music encompasses a very w - i - d - e range of musical styles, from that of the Renaissance to that of last weekend's youth retreat, and though I personally like nearly all of it, not everyone does. For instance, until a year ago, the office nearest mine was occupied by a lady who favorite kind of church music was the style of Southern Gospel that was popular in the 50s and 60s. Not really my cup of tea, though some is better than others. (She actually liked it when I picked up my 914 to play a little something, very softly, in the office.)

2) I am so sensitive to, or attracted by music that I can't really have it playing the the background and still get anything done. It is a huge distraction for me! For example, one summer while I was in college, I worked in a large department store, selling men's suits. One day, a customer asked why I made such a sour face when he tried on a sport coat. "Does it not fit? Does this color not look good on me? Is it the wrong size? What??" He had a hard time believing my truthful answer. In the very soft background music being played over the PA system, an alto sax soloist had been really flat on a high, sustained note. That customer said he hadn't even noticed that there was music playing! I can't read or balance a checkbook or do much of anything with background music - to me, it instantly moves to the foreground ! That may be a gift, but it also has a down side. I love music, but when I listen I like it loud enough to really hear the various nuances!

At work, when I wanted to listen to music, I'd go to another room away from the office, and crank it up!

cotten

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by cotten

Until I retired a year ago, I was a full time music minister, a pastor whose primary tool for ministry was music. (Now that I'm retired, I'm doing the same job, just for a quarter of the pay!) I worked in a busy office with 4-7 coworkers within earshot. I almost never played music loud enough for anyone else to hear in the office, for two reasons:

1. Church music encompasses a very w - i - d - e range of musical styles, from that of the Renaissance to that of last weekend's youth retreat, and though I personally like nearly all of it, not everyone does. For instance, until a year ago, the office nearest mine was occupied by a lady who favorite kind of church music was the style of Southern Gospel that was popular in the 50s and 60s. Not really my cup of tea, though some is better than others. (She actually liked it when I picked up my 914 to play a little something, very softly, in the office.)

2) I am so sensitive to, or attracted by music that I can't really have it playing the the background and still get anything done. It is a huge distraction for me! For example, one summer while I was in college, I worked in a large department store, selling men's suits. One day, a customer asked why I made such a sour face when he tried on a sport coat. "Does it not fit? Does this color not look good on me? Is it the wrong size? What??" He had a hard time believing my truthful answer. In the very soft background music being played over the PA system, an alto sax soloist had been really flat on a high, sustained note. That customer said he hadn't even noticed that there was music playing! I can't read or balance a checkbook or do much of anything with background music - to me, it instantly moves to the foreground ! That may be a gift, but it also has a down side. I love music, but when I listen I like it loud enough to really hear the various nuances!

At work, when I wanted to listen to music, I'd go to another room away from the office, and crank it up!

cotten

My wife has the collection of Gaither DVDs, where all those gospel singers and groups get together to share their tunes. Though I m not really into all that, I think those rich harmonies are really good, as are the individual voices. I would say that, overall, those singers are much more pleasing to my ear across the board than much of the pop music I hear on the radio. These gospel singers seem to really know how to sing, rather than just bellowing and hoping something comes of it, as much pop singing sounds to me (with some notable exceptions, of course).

I also find listening to music and reading/studying to be nearly impossible. I tend to really listen to music, and I can't concentrate on two things at once very well.

Tony

[fazool]

Very glad to see thoughtful dialogue on this topic. I was worried it might devolve into an AGF-forbidden topic so thank you to everyone for your restraint. I was also worried that it might offend some folks whose musical sensibilities are different than mine. Thank you for letting me express my own tastes constructively.


I have mixed feelings on workplace music. I find that music can energize me and I can be more productive with music going. I do think that it's a bit insulating to walk around with headphones on and be disconnected from the world around you - seeing that everywhere is mildly troubling to me.


I did some google-searching and found a lot of info the the status of this musical genre. This music has a fabulous rich history of some of the best music in mankind's history, but certain religio-political-social events led to a change in the application of music so this genre became.........hmm.........markedly less rich, let's say. Some really interesting reading out there.

[ewalling]

Originally Posted by fazool

I did some google-searching and found a lot of info the the status of this musical genre. This music has a fabulous rich history of some of the best music in mankind's history, but certain religio-political-social events led to a change in the application of music so this genre became.........hmm.........markedly less rich, let's say. Some really interesting reading out there.

One interesting feature about this genre is the way in which modern forms of it have transitioned from being a music of the people to being the unequivocal property of a faithful few. Virtually no one on the outside of western religion can stand modern religious music, even as background. Contrast this with the music of such as Johann Sebastian Bach and Verdi. In its day, it reached a broad spectrum of people and it continues to do so today, even in these more skeptical and scientific times. It seems we do not have to be affiliated to any faith to respond intensely to music inspired by very specific faiths, providing that the music was composed within a classical/chamber music genre. Why is that? Why does Gounod's St. Cecilia Mass lift me on a wave of joy despite its devotion to something I barely recognize? Why does a modern devotional song have me frantically reaching for the tuner almost before the third bar? Do some forms of music lend themselves to transcendental devotion while others do not?

[architype]

As far as confronting your co-worker and asking him to turn it down, you could always take the coward's path and complain to HR and have them send out a memo. Something like:

All employees are to turn down desktop radios to a volume level that their adjacent neighbor cannot hear, or wear headphones.

You avoid confrontation. He doesn't feel singled out since it applies to everyone.

[RedJoker]

This is an interesting discussion. At work, I am almost ALWAYS wearing headphones. Most times I have on music but sometimes they just act as earplugs. I'm an introvert so I'm OK with people taking it as rude and not talking to me.

If I'm trying to concentrate, the music can't have lyrics or I get too wrapped up in them. Classical music isn't very good either as it is too dynamic. I'm usually listening to "Relaxation", " Yoga" or something like that on Pandora at work.

[Pitar]

Originally Posted by jdmulli

I think playing ANY music in an office environment is inconsiderate.

Yep. I'm pretty sure the man making payroll is not understanding of how much of it goes unearned by people distracted with personal entertainment and recreation while on the clock.

I don't care about the so-called study made by people (always prone to fail) who assert that music is conducive to better working conditions. What would be better is open dialogue about the work at hand during the performance of it, which I encourage and prompt, rather than some background music setting a slower, disconnected pace (my observation).

I bar music, all manner of personal electronic devices (including cell phone use), smoking and drinking during normal business hours. If one man disturbs another, which I'm always monitoring, I take action to ensure it's only a one time event that will meet with consequences if repeated.

It does not matter to me the context of the disturbance in the work place. I deal with it quickly and resolutely. Human Factors in the workplace needs to have a seamless presence in the fore thought of supervisors on up. It's a formal observance of human behavioral control that take into account the management of People, Environment, Action and Resources (The PEAR Principle) such that employee productivity is managed to an enjoyable and goal achieving outcome.

One man's imposition on others can become miserable working conditions and evident of poor management.

[fazool]

Well except our work is not mindless rote production. We are in a creative developmental environment.

[buddyhu]

Originally Posted by ewalling

One interesting feature about this genre is the way in which modern forms of it have transitioned from being a music of the people to being the unequivocal property of a faithful few. Virtually no one on the outside of western religion can stand modern religious music, even as background. Contrast this with the music of such as Johann Sebastian Bach and Verdi. In its day, it reached a broad spectrum of people and it continues to do so today, even in these more skeptical and scientific times. It seems we do not have to be affiliated to any faith to respond intensely to music inspired by very specific faiths, providing that the music was composed within a classical/chamber music genre. Why is that? Why does Gounod's St. Cecilia Mass lift me on a wave of joy despite its devotion to something I barely recognize? Why does a modern devotional song have me frantically reaching for the tuner almost before the third bar? Do some forms of music lend themselves to transcendental devotion while others do not?

Yes, this is quite interesting, and I appreciate your noting it.

Even today any people LOVE to listen to Gregorian chanting (which is enjoying a bit of a resurgence in popularity in the last decade or so), even some who would never go into any kind of church. And going to a performance of Handel's "Messiah" is something that many enjoy, despite the absence of belief in the Messiah that is being praised in that music. Whereas most modern praise music has a much narrower appeal.

[Dirk Hofman]

Originally Posted by ewalling

One interesting feature about this genre is the way in which modern forms of it have transitioned from being a music of the people to being the unequivocal property of a faithful few. Virtually no one on the outside of western religion can stand modern religious music, even as background. Contrast this with the music of such as Johann Sebastian Bach and Verdi. In its day, it reached a broad spectrum of people and it continues to do so today, even in these more skeptical and scientific times. It seems we do not have to be affiliated to any faith to respond intensely to music inspired by very specific faiths, providing that the music was composed within a classical/chamber music genre. Why is that? Why does Gounod's St. Cecilia Mass lift me on a wave of joy despite its devotion to something I barely recognize? Why does a modern devotional song have me frantically reaching for the tuner almost before the third bar? Do some forms of music lend themselves to transcendental devotion while others do not?

Good, thoughtful and interesting post.

Personally I don't think it's about classical versus modern. I think you nailed it when you refer to inspiration. We all respond to inspiration, sincerity, deep mastery, and originality, in all its varied forms and manifestations. Music inspired by faith or any other commonly held human experience and abstracted into instrumental form can be profoundly compelling and have broad appeal. Everyone can bring their own experiences and emotion to it.

Music which is generally prosthelitizing a very specific kind of faith, which often superficially mimics original musical forms is surely going to have very narrow appeal, largely confined to a subset of adherents of that specific kind of faith. For the rest it feels inauthentic and unrelatable, and even grating.

[Nyghthawk]

Art inspired by one's faith is often quite amazing. Think Taj Mahal and Sistine Chapel. Music is the same. Handel, Mozart, Beethoven, Vivaldi, etc. Modern 'inspirational' music is not in the same category at all. JMHO.

[Seby]

Coming from way, waaaay outside the socio-cultural context from within which you are posting your question, the following occur to me (but I could be very wide of the mark here, as I simply have no personal reference point for anything like this even remotely).

If he is playing music with one type of message only, and he is playing it constantly, then you might as him why. Is his belief system so brittle that it needs constant and endless reaffirmation, or does it simply give him constant joy? That is, is he concerned about something deeply spiritual, or is he celebrating something about it? If the former, then maybe he has something on his mind. If the latter, then I think that you have two options.

One is the say that although you are happy for his happiness, the fact that he plays the same kind of music, all the time, is kind of doing your head in, and that basic intercollegiate courtesy might suggest to him that he mix things up a bit.

If this does not work, then go for gold. Find a belief system with uncompromising music. Oh, I don't know, join The Process and play Throbbing Gristle all day. Or, some spiritual music from Asia has rather a lot of stuff going on in the upper treble areas that I am sure would have an effect pretty quickly. It's up to you.

Then I reckon that you might be able to strike a deal along the lines of "You don't play this for such and such an amount of time, and I won't play _this_ for such and such an amount of time." I had a good deal like this with a coworker in a cafe years ago. I would not play Tom Waits, he would not play Radiohead...I would not play Leonard Cohen, he would not play Counting Crows etc. We are friends to this day!