Martin 00-18G

[Longer]

Thanks Andre & Chris, y'all have put my mind at ease a little bit.

Personally, I think Trigger is beautiful, but you know, there is a difference between looking and buying, and in general, I prefer to put the damage on myself instead of having someone do it for me! :-)

The price was a flat $1,200, after shipping and everything.
Of course, I've read of much better deals, but they seem to be the exception rather than the norm, and really, I had too much GAS to wait around for a steal.

Still, I was confident in this purchase for a few reasons.
Worse case, I have 48 hours to return her and I'm only out the shipping cost.
If she checks out ok and I keep her, yet end up selling after a while, or upgrading for a more pristine example, I don't think I'll lose money on her, you know?
And if I fall in love, then none of this really matters anyway!

So in a way, I don't feel like I can lose, because worse case, the return cost is kinda worth this much anticipation and excitement.

Of course, if you want to make God laugh, just tell him your plans. :-) But this much is somewhat certain, it will be a fun week waiting, feeling like a kid on Christmas Eve, not knowing what they may get. Socks or a bike? Man, I hope it's a bike! :-)

[CCFingerstyle]

In the grand scheme of things as guitar buying goes, I have long believed that these old Martin nylons are significantly underpriced. I do not know why...other than perhaps serious classical players seem to enjoy criticizing them and saying that they are "not really classical guitars." I actually agree with them...but that does not mean they are not great instruments for folk, fingerstyle, jazz, etc. If you look at similar specs and vintage on a steel-string model, they will usually trade for quite a bit more. So, the market undervalues them. Good news for buyers.

And as Andre and others have demonstrated, they are not too bad if you want to live-on-the-wild-side, be blasphemous and play classic arrangements on them.

I paid $1500 for my 18G years ago. One - I could probably still sell it for around $1500 today, so if I you ignore the "opportunity cost thing" that economist talk about...I am playing it free. Two - Although it is not worth more than $1500 in the current market...I'd much rather have it than $1500 more in the bank. Three - When I think about the enjoyment I have gotten out of owning and playing it all these years...it is worth much more than $1500 to me.

So, how much fun do you have to have for it to be worth $1200 to you? Again, if the neck needs resetting...don't judge it by the playability of that one. Just send it back and look for another one. If the neck is in good shape...do not stop playing it until you have at least $2400 worth of fun. That would be a 100% return on your investment...and you still have the guitar.

[CCFingerstyle]

Originally Posted by tkoehler1

Congratulations on picking up a great old guitar!

I had an old 00-18G a few years ago and sold it, and regretted it ever since.

Also does anyone have a preference between the G and C models? I understand the difference is in the body shape (with the G being a 14-fret body and c being 12-fret body, or is that just the 28 series?).

Also tone difference between 18 and 28 series would be interesting to get some opinions. The old 00-28G or C certainly are more expensive.

TK

I personally like the G slightly more than the C. But the differences are negligible to me in terms of tone. Either is a good choice if you want a nice folk guitar. Same thing with the tone difference in the 18 and 28. A bit of difference, but not significant. I am in the minority in that I actually prefer the 18 (spruce/mahogany) combo over the 28 (spruce/BRW). Most people feel the opposite. Again, in terms of tone, strings seem to make a big difference. In general, if they are priced correctly, the 28s are about twice the price of the 18s. I think if you get the bug for these old Martin nylons...the best thing to do is eventually buy all of the different models. It will be very inexpensive entertainment if you exercise a bit of patience. You can probably buy a "collection" comprised of the 16C, 18C, 18G, 28C and 28G for well-under $10,000 if that will fit in your budget and keep them all. Probably less than two people attending the Super Bowl (2016 average ticket cost $4512, $151.92 each for food at game, etc.) and much more lasting fun. They need a separate section in the Forums for "GAS Rationalization" so we can share examples of outrageous guitar-buying rationale with each other.

[Gitfiddlemann]

Originally Posted by CCFingerstyle

Too much.

[Longer]

Originally Posted by CCFingerstyle

In the grand scheme of things as guitar buying goes, I have long believed that these old Martin nylons are significantly underpriced. I do not know why...other than perhaps serious classical players seem to enjoy criticizing them and saying that they are "not really classical guitars." I actually agree with them...but that does not mean they are not great instruments for folk, fingerstyle, jazz, etc. If you look at similar specs and vintage on a steel-string model, they will usually trade for quite a bit more. So, the market undervalues them. Good news for buyers.

And as Andre and others have demonstrated, they are not too bad if you want to live-on-the-wild-side, be blasphemous and play classic arrangements on them.

I paid $1500 for my 18G years ago. One - I could probably still sell it for around $1500 today, so if I you ignore the "opportunity cost thing" that economist talk about...I am playing it free. Two - Although it is not worth more than $1500 in the current market...I'd much rather have it than $1500 more in the bank. Three - When I think about the enjoyment I have gotten out of owning and playing it all these years...it is worth much more than $1500 to me.

So, how much fun do you have to have for it to be worth $1200 to you? Again, if the neck needs resetting...don't judge it by the playability of that one. Just send it back and look for another one. If the neck is in good shape...do not stop playing it until you have at least $2400 worth of fun. That would be a 100% return on your investment...and you still have the guitar.

Yes, I agree.

Something is only worth what someone's willing to pay anyway, and I don't feel embarrassed by what I was willing to pay.

If her issues are only cosmetic, I plan to keep her and get to know her. If I do lose a little if I eventually sell, it will be worth it for the knowledge gained.

And I truly hope her inspection goes well. I've been thinking about an old 18G for a while now. On paper, videos, and reviews, it seems like it's what I'm looking for. It's exciting that I will finally find out if it is or isn't!

[Longer]

She came in on Friday.

The picks don't tell the story when it comes to all the nicks and dings.

Took her to get looked at. They gave her 7/10. Needs some minor help.
The crack at the bottom was glued very well but not cleated, and there are 2 minor cracks on the sides that could use some glue.

My biggest concern is the neck. The action right now is nice, 4mm low E to 3mm hi E, but there is ZERO room on the saddle to go lower.
She also looks like a neck reset has never been done.

Is this an inevitable issue I will have to deal with?
How concerned should I be?

[CCFingerstyle]

Sent you a PM (sorry, you probably got it more than once).

[Longer]

Update and Sucker Alert:

I couldn't send her back, issues and all. This poor girl needs me, and I've enjoyed my short time with her too much.

I'm going to get the minor stuff taken care of, and we'll deal with the neck once it's an issue.

So much for a good deal, but I'll take the hit. She plays great, sounds great, and already stole my heart.

Thanks everyone for your help and advice!

[Gitfiddlemann]

Originally Posted by Longer

Update and Sucker Alert:

I couldn't send her back, issues and all. This poor girl needs me, and I've enjoyed my short time with her too much.

I'm going to get the minor stuff taken care of, and we'll deal with the neck once it's an issue.

So much for a good deal, but I'll take the hit. She plays great, sounds great, and already stole my heart.

Thanks everyone for your help and advice!

That's nice to hear. If the guitar plays and sounds great as it is right now, it might not even come to a neck issue. And if it does, it can be fixed.
Glad to hear it worked out for you, our new "18G" club member!
Have fun!

[CCFingerstyle]

Alright...there is a special place in "guitar-heaven" for people who are willing to nurture an old Martin nylon back to health and give it a good home! Not a sucker move...a compassionate move. Best wishes for a long and enjoyable relationship with one of C.F.'s finest and I also welcome you officially to the 18G club...Chris

[Brandy1]

TK,

you asked about preference between the C and the G. I have an 1951 00-28G and 1968 00-28C . I also have owned a Guild mark V, and1972 00-18C and a 1974 N10. I was testing my way thru a few nylons to find one to keep and I found two, I have kept.

If I had to choose between the two, it would be the 00-28G, no question in my mind. every single 00-28G I have played has been incredible.

My 00-28C was the first nylon I played that I wanted to pick up as much as my steel string guitars. It just feels right and mellow. I still play it regularly and it is Fantastic, but different in sound than a 28G, when you get to this level of Guitars it is personal preference. Both are better than I deserve to be playing. You cant go wrong with either guitar.

I have never played a 00-18G. But am subconsciously looking for one.

The 00-18C and N10(Were both post 1970) had the longer scale 26 3/8 and 2 1/8" wide neck. Sound was excellent but i could not get comfortable with the neck.

I would not hesitate to buy a N10 or N20 from 1968 or 1969, Those two years have the neck i prefer. They also have thinner tops than a G or C.

My two cents...

[flamencoLVR]

I have a 0018G of about 1958 vintage that I bought in the 60's. I had the tech at Sam Ash look it over and play it , he said there was nothing wrong with it except for some dings and that he guessed it was worth some $1500 as is, said I should take it to McCabes for appraisal. I had just bought a Cordoba F7 Flamenco to hopefully progress in flamenco playing. PM me if living in Socal and interested in the 0018G