Finding a Guitar Teacher

[Pine]

I have been trying to find a guitar teacher who teaches using a structured method, like Hal Leonard, Mel Bay, etc. My goal is to be able to play light rock, folk, maybe some blues; just for my own pleasure. I would like to be able to read, understand, and apply music theory to guitar. I am not really interested in TAB at the moment, but will probably need at least a passing knowledge of it later.

I have tried two teachers so far. I discussed my goals with each prior to scheduling lessons. Each expressed their willingness to work in support of my Hal Leonard course. Once the lessons started, both immediately focused on having me learning a song using TAB.

I understand we all learn a bit differently. Many folks need quick success in order to keep going. (Hence the "learn a song" method of instruction) I don't learn well that way. I prefer/need to understand the theory, build technique, and then apply that technique to songs. If I can’t see the game plan for the next year or so, then it just feels like noodling around to me, since there aren’t specific goals. Learning to play “A-Team” is something I would like to do, but it is not one of my goals.

What I feel like is that I'm saying I want to learn to be an Architect, and the instructors are saying: "Choose a building you'd like to build, and I'll show you how to build it".

Do any of you have ideas about how to find an instructor that uses a structured method of instruction? (I prefer standard texts, like HL, Mel Bay, Gibson L&M Guitar)

[Pualee]

Find a place that offers lessons with multiple instructors. Ask them to detail each instructors teaching style.

Having goals defined is good, but it sounds like giving your goals to them is striking out. So reverse the order, try getting their approach first and see if it matches your goals.

Are you finding guys by asking at a music store, or through other means? A teacher that had formal music education, focusing on guitar, is probably a better bet than someone who is self taught.

Without telling your goals, ask what materials you will have to buy in the first week/month. If they say you need to buy a method book, then give it a shot.

[Pine]

Originally Posted by Pualee

Without telling your goals, ask what materials you will have to buy in the first week/month. If they say you need to buy a method book, then give it a shot.

That is an excellent idea. I'll try that on the next one.

I started my search by looking online for instructors in my area. None of the schools, or individuals web sites mention their teaching methods, except those that say they'll have you playing songs quickly.

When I call and ask the schools/music stores about teaching methods, they all say to contact the teachers about that.

I was hoping for a faster way to find candidates that are close to me.

[Gmountain]

You should probably look for an instructor with a degree in music education. You could also check at any local colleges.

Also, maybe you should consider that the instructor has a better idea of how to teach than you do.

When I went to my first lesson, my instructor asked me my goal. I wanted to play Jingle Bell Rock by Christmas. That was it, along with learning guitar.

for the first three months we didn't do any songs, except for Day Tripper, to practice finding notes. I did, and do, lots of scales, chords, finding notes on the fretboard, numerous ways to play each note, etc.

I figured there was some sort of method to his madness, so I practiced whatever I was told to do.

After 12 weeks I asked when I might start learning some songs, and he said to find a song I like and that will be the next lesson. He went over it with me, and then told me to go home and practice. Amazingly enough, all the things I had been working on fell into place. Still no perfect, but after a week it was a whole song. I was pretty happy.

The point is, if you knew what you were doing, you wouldn't need an instructor. Trust them, as professionals, to know their business, and then do what they tell you to do. You might be pleasantly surprised.

[amyFB]

I'd be bored silly if I was only playing scales and studying theory.

Taking your architect analogy another step, sometimes it is quite instructive to build something and watch it fall down in order to really appreciate the reason why something is done a certain way.

I was at a workshop the other day - a flatpicking class - where they showed us a 'weave pattern' to practice.

basically, it was playing notes position
1,2,3,1,
2,3,4,2,
3,4,5,3,
4,5,6,4,
5,6,7,5,
6,7,8,6

then, we were shown how easily we could take bits of that pattern and slip it into a song as a fill between chords.

I'm much more inspired to practice a boring repetitious pattern when I know how it will benefit my music.

You don't say if you can play already or are just starting out, but best of luck to you! it's a wonderful thing to play guitar.

[Pine]

Originally Posted by Gmountain

The point is, if you knew what you were doing, you wouldn't need an instructor. Trust them, as professionals, to know their business, and then do what they tell you to do. You might be pleasantly surprised.

I agree up to a point. Once I have found a teacher I trust to help me achieve my goals, your advice makes sense. Both teachers I've tried did the same thing after the first lesson. They wrote out some TAB on a blank sheet, and said, "practice this song. See you next week". I'm sure both these guys are great teachers. They just aren't the right teachers for me.

I suspect finding a guitar teacher is something like finding the "right" guitar. You have to try out a few. I'm hoping to find a better way to develop my short list of teachers to interview/try.

[keith g]

I get what you're saying. I have gone through similar phases in the past where I wanted "vertical knowledge" (fretboard knowledge, theory and technique) that would allow me to not be intimated by the thought of learning to play virtually anything I hear. Most teachers want to teach you to play songs, I think it keeps most people interested and is an easy way of teaching for instructors. You also pick up technique and knowledge along the way, but not in a focused way.

I never found a teacher that I thought would provide that type of instruction for me, so I just kind of taught it to myself. I also made/make a point of playing with people on a regular basis that are better than me and keep myself open to playing types of music that I wouldn't normally play. After many years of playing, I feel like I'm getting to where I want to be, but still feel like if I could have found the right instructor, I could have gotten there faster.

Good luck in your search, the journey is fun either way.

[Pine]

Originally Posted by amyFB

You don't say if you can play already or are just starting out, but best of luck to you! it's a wonderful thing to play guitar.

I've been self learning using the Hal Leonard and Gibson Learn & Master guitar courses. I can sight read and play the notes on the strings in first position, (not sharps or flats yet) and can move between the (Am, A, A7, B7, C, C7, Dm, D, D7, Em, E, E7, F, G, G7) chords reasonably well.

"I'd be bored silly if I was only playing scales and studying theory."

I don't mind the scales and learning theory at all, as long as I can see how they contribute to my goals. I actually prefer learning the notes, then developing the muscle memory so my fingers find the correct spot before I apply that to a song. That way I can focus on the song and its rhythm, not on the technique as much.

Thanks everyone for your thoughtful responses! I'm really enjoying the forum.

[Pine]

Originally Posted by keith g

I get what you're saying. I have gone through similar phases in the past where I wanted "vertical knowledge" (fretboard knowledge, theory and technique) that would allow me to not be intimated by the thought of learning to play virtually anything I hear. Most teachers want to teach you to play songs, I think it keeps most people interested and is an easy way of teaching for instructors. You also pick up technique and knowledge along the way, but not in a focused way.

I never found a teacher that I thought would provide that type of instruction for me, so I just kind of taught it to myself. I also made/make a point of playing with people on a regular basis that are better than me and keep myself open to playing types of music that I wouldn't normally play. After many years of playing, I feel like I'm getting to where I want to be, but still feel like if I could have found the right instructor, I could have gotten there faster.

Good luck in your search, the journey is fun either way.

Wow Keith, you summed up my experience much better than I did!

I am certainly having fun with it, and hope to continue for a long time.

[TimMChase]

+1 to finding a music college grad as a teacher. Most colleges have an advertisement board and students would jump on the opportunity to get some teaching. Also, in my program we actually were required to either teach or gig for a certain number of hours to complete the degree.

As a teacher of 9 years, I understand that in this day and age learning songs (with the help of the internet etc) is extremely easy and accessible, however, learning theory is not so much. I try and base my lessons accordingly. Learning a song teaches you how to play a song, learning theory and technique teaches you how to play 1000 songs.

[Pine]

Originally Posted by TimMChase

+1 to finding a music college grad as a teacher. Most colleges have an advertisement board and students would jump on the opportunity to get some teaching. Also, in my program we actually were required to either teach or gig for a certain number of hours to complete the degree.

As a teacher of 9 years, I understand that in this day and age learning songs (with the help of the internet etc) is extremely easy and accessible, however, learning theory is not so much. I try and base my lessons accordingly. Learning a song teaches you how to play a song, learning theory and technique teaches you how to play 1000 songs.

Thanks Tim. I love the "Learning a song teaches you how to play a song, learning theory and technique teaches you how to play 1000 songs." That clearly describes what I'm trying to accomplish.

If you wouldn't mind answering another question, do you think focusing on notation, and delaying learning TAB till later is the right strategy? I can only take on learning a few things concurrently. Do I really ever need TAB? I've heard opinion all 3 ways. (don't need notation, don't need TAB, need both)

[DupleMeter]

Originally Posted by Pine

I have been trying to find a guitar teacher who teaches using a structured method, like Hal Leonard, Mel Bay, etc. My goal is to be able to play light rock, folk, maybe some blues; just for my own pleasure. I would like to be able to read, understand, and apply music theory to guitar. I am not really interested in TAB at the moment, but will probably need at least a passing knowledge of it later.

I have tried two teachers so far. I discussed my goals with each prior to scheduling lessons. Each expressed their willingness to work in support of my Hal Leonard course. Once the lessons started, both immediately focused on having me learning a song using TAB.

I understand we all learn a bit differently. Many folks need quick success in order to keep going. (Hence the "learn a song" method of instruction) I don't learn well that way. I prefer/need to understand the theory, build technique, and then apply that technique to songs. If I can’t see the game plan for the next year or so, then it just feels like noodling around to me, since there aren’t specific goals. Learning to play “A-Team” is something I would like to do, but it is not one of my goals.

What I feel like is that I'm saying I want to learn to be an Architect, and the instructors are saying: "Choose a building you'd like to build, and I'll show you how to build it".

Do any of you have ideas about how to find an instructor that uses a structured method of instruction? (I prefer standard texts, like HL, Mel Bay, Gibson L&M Guitar)

Do a little research into area teachers and contact those that went to music school (or majored in music at college). That'll be your best bet.

[DupleMeter]

Originally Posted by Pine

Thanks Tim. I love the "Learning a song teaches you how to play a song, learning theory and technique teaches you how to play 1000 songs." That clearly describes what I'm trying to accomplish.

If you wouldn't mind answering another question, do you think focusing on notation, and delaying learning TAB till later is the right strategy? I can only take on learning a few things concurrently. Do I really ever need TAB? I've heard opinion all 3 ways. (don't need notation, don't need TAB, need both)

I'm not Tim, but I'm a music school grad & teacher. My advice: learn to read standard notation. TAB is easy enough to pickup later. You may never need TAB, but you might (e.g. for the free online songs that seem to only come in TAB). But, standard notation is the language of musicians worldwide. So start there.

[TimMChase]

Originally Posted by DupleMeter

I'm not Tim, but I'm a music school grad & teacher. My advice: learn to read standard notation. TAB is easy enough to pickup later. You may never need TAB, but you might (e.g. for the free online songs that seem to only come in TAB). But, standard notation is the language of musicians worldwide. So start there.

Thanks, I actually couldn't have said it better myself. In my opinion, learning TAB doesn't actually require any "learning"; it's a skill that you can easily pick up where needed. Here are a few times I use TAB in my own teaching (I try and avoid it as much as possible).

-Playing in any kind of altered tuning (i.e. DADGAD) because the time it would take a student to relearn where the notes are is simply not realistic
-demonstrating exactly how to fret a specific scale, esp. if it is higher than, say, the 5th fret (i.e. Em pent at the 12th fret)
-maybe some complex chord shapes well outside open position (i.e. c major triad in 3 inversions on the top three strings I might write as 5 5 3 (root) 9 8 8 (1st inv.) 12 13 12 (2nd inv.) This represents the fret numbers on the G, B, and E strings in that order.

However, I always use standard notation stems (in the first example for instance) to show rhythm and in the other examples I always back it up with drilling in the letter names to ween students off TAB as soon as possible.

In my own playing, if i'm learning a specific fingerstyle arrangement I don't mind having the TAB written below the staff to speed up the process, and be able to get inside the head of whoever wrote the arrangement as to which position to play in. When reading classical music, this is not necessary however, as the positions are clearly marked with roman numerals.

Oh, and whenever I get a sub to fill in for me when teaching the first thing I tell them is "no TAB please." Imagine a 6 year old student who is just starting to learn standard notation, and then a sub wastes a half hour teaching them how to play "Ode to Joy" via TAB, when the entire melody consists of only 6 notes anyways... They always come back the next week saying "he taught that weird numbers thing, and I didn't get it so I had nothing to practice."

[TimMChase]

And one more thing. If you do any kind of arranging or composing where you want another instrument to play a specific part, well...

You see where I'm going I think.