American Indian

[knuckle]

Wife says it's a dud. She's usually right. I can never tell what works and what doesn't. Have a listen and see what you think?

Deep 6 it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdNGXdoSbJg

[Bob1131]

I like it, very good playing and I like the rhythm and flow of it! You got the stomp down in volume, and it actually fits this song nicely. Your voice gets buried under the guitar, so I couldn't make out some of the lyrics. On a song like this, I would like to hear your voice more up front and with a lot less reverb. What I could hear of your vocals sounded good. The song is a little long (6.5 minutes) so, I would look for ways to cut it back some.

[knuckle]

Thanks Bob, Most of my songs are 3 minutes, I have to cut down the chorus parts a tad, sing each part 1x instead of two.

Here's the lyrics.
American Indian, white man come and take your life
communal land that can't be owned, the Algonquin met their demise

Croatan Sound in 1586, Pemisapan shot in cold blood
1622 Powhatans die... poisoned some died by the gun

RED SKINNED MAN, CAN YOU EVER FORGIVE
RED SKINNED MAN, CAN YOU EVER FORGIVE

TILL THEN WE WALK ON TAINTED GROUND
TILL THEN WE WALK ON TAINTED GROUND

Massasoit come in peace he had, but it didn't last too long
Metacom with his uprising, burn the settlements to the ground

1676 Metacom is killed, and his son is captured and enslaved
And King Phillips memory lives on as the ghost of the English colony

RED SKINNED MAN, CAN YOU EVER FORGIVE
RED SKINNED MAN, CAN YOU EVER FORGIVE

TILL THEN WE WALK ON TAINTED GROUND
TILL THEN WE WALK ON TAINTED GROUND

American Indian, white man come and take your life

RED SKINNED MAN, CAN YOU EVER FORGIVE
RED SKINNED MAN, CAN YOU EVER FORGIVE

TILL THEN WE WALK ON TAINTED GROUND
TILL THEN WE WALK ON TAINTED GROUND

[kscobie8]

Originally Posted by knuckle

Wife says it's a dud. She's usually right. I can never tell what works and what doesn't. Have a listen and see what you think?

Deep 6 it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zc9yNZSXZMk

No deep 6! I like what's happening musically with this song. The finger picking/slide work on the resonator is nice stuff and I like the chord combinations you're bringing in here. I also like the story. It's a little bit simple (not a bad thing), but as a folk ballad it has some serious potential.

A couple of things to think about:
1) It's a long song. Over six minutes with not too much dynamic variation can get boring. Lucky for you your playing is interesting! However, you have a LOT of little instrumental breaks throughout the song that could probably be shortened/cut to tighten things up. I read the lyrics along with your song and while you have them grouped together into what appears to be verses/choruses, the instrumental breaks are so frequent that they break up every line, leaving the story pretty disconnected. Someone listening without having the lyrics in front of them would likely forget what all you were singing about because of the number and placement of the breaks. Maybe think about how you could bring the lines together into a more traditional verse/chorus grouping and then add the cool instrumental breaks only between the verses and chorus, or only after a the chorus going back into a verse. Bottom line, the playing is interesting, but don't overdo it. Make us want it because we can't get enough of it.

2) I know you've mentioned that you have no singing experience and don't really know how to do it, and that is absolutely fine. You have a unique voice and you can add a lot to a song with it. But there are some things you can think about when singing. First and foremost, when holding out a note, make sure it's the vowel sound of the word, not a consonant. A few times I heard you holding out a "Ffffff" sound or a "Nnnnnn" sound. Those are generally not considered pleasant. In Celtic/Irish music and other-world folk music you might here the "N" being held out, but for the most part just stick to the vowels. Second, it sounds like your singing more from your throat than your gut. If not, ignore this. But if you are, try opening up your air supply getting the notes from deep in your lungs. It's hard to explain by a forum post, so you may need someone to walk you through it in person. I think you'll find it easier to sing and your tone will be a little more refined. Like I said though, if you're already doing it, then ignore all that.

3) Last thing I wanted to mention is the tempo. Because some of your resonator playing is pretty complex the tempo gets a little goofy. Really try to get a solid groove going and don't feel like you have to rush that playing.

Overall though I like what the future hold for this song. And I certainly wouldn't call it a dud. Like I said, there's some good potential for this song. It just needs some tightening and refining, as all songs initially do. But good stuff, Knuckle!

Thanks for sharing!


Bel isi,
-kyle

[knuckle]

Thanks man, yes I'm going to shorten it. I can't even listen to the whole thing

Thanks for the other comments too, I appreciate it. I'll have to reread the part about the vocals and think about that for a few. Hasn't really sunk in yet.

[knuckle]

Redid a shorter version of this. I didn't really incorporate the vocal thing into the equation. I think I'd need to sit one on one with someone to understand that.

Anyhow

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdNGXdoSbJg

[Tony from Tulsa]

Deep six it?!! Not hardly, The resonator sounds awesome, your playing is great. I like that you are working on songs that fit your vocal range and style. The "folk" sound is definitely you. Maybe a bit more whispery in the vocal department? I think you're doing a great job with it. I say its a keeper.

[mr. beaumont]

Maybe this isn't something you'd even consider, but if you're going to write a song about the plight of native americans, why resort to using two terms that are really outdated and not prefferred?

Other than that, I really like the resonator's tone and your playing. Your vocals sound very forced...you're singing from your throat, I imagine that's gotta hurt after a while! I think you could find that whispery, raspy quality and not force it so much...let the mic do more work.

Oh, and the footstomp thing sounds really good.

[66strummer]

I agree on this being a "keeper" and maybe going through a few modifications. Even if it had been an instrumental it would have been great to listen to. Real catchy playing!

[knuckle]

Well I have no idea what the "outdated" terms are?

American Indian? Red Skinned Man?

I thought about Native American? But that sounds whacky in regard to the tune. Red skinned man? I mean what would I use to replace that with?

Well I am glad some of you like it as I have no idea how to write songs, so I never know whether something sucks or not and can't rely on people close to me for an honest opinion.

I'd rather people tell me "that sucks, don't ever play it again"
I can handle the truth, not everything is going to be stellar.

[mr. beaumont]

Well, I don't think it sucks, so I can't tell you that. Like I said, I think the guitar tone and playing are great, and I really like the footstomp thingy...I though the vocals sounded "forced" and I balked at the title and those terms because I feel like if you're writing a song that takes the side of a certain people, at least use a term that they prefer...but I'm getting too silly PC maybe...

"American Indian" and "Redskinned Man" just sounds like my Grandpa talking...looks like it's just me, because nobody else thought so.

I was thinking more like "American Man." Let the song title hold some mystery--let people find through the song out you're talking about the "original americans."

[Mah ' Crub]

I think it has a good feel, and I loved the resonater, and the stomp box.
I am part Blackfoot and Cherokee, so any thing about the early people touches me. I would shorten it and in doing so you may find something else.
Also ....I know she means well, but...it may not be a good idea for your wife to critique you....Old Chinese saying..." No man is a tiger to his own wife". Meaning she knows all your short comings and faults. Play some of it to other people and see what they think....so far we all seem to like it.
Good luck.

Mah ' Crub

[knuckle]

Thanks Chief. Appreciate it. I've been reading a lot about this sort of stuff in the past month and I don't think people realize the extent of how bad it was for the Native Indians. I feel bad about that, real bad. But I'm not like that luckily, I don't believe in harming any form of life.

[Mah ' Crub]

Thanks knuckles, not a chief though, just a brave, and I know what you mean,
I no longer kill anything, even bugs in the house, I do the catch and release program...who am I to take a life...of any size. Keep up the good work and positive feelings.

Mah ' Crub

Ps. Saw a great bumper sticker the other day: " Sure you can trust your government...just ask any Indian !"

[Ranger1964]

Instead of Red Skinned Man how about My Native Brother or just Native Brother I think it ties in with the request for forgiveness and creates a kinship.