Rhythm & vocal accompaniment

[drplayer]

Considering (4) guitars for predominantly rhythm play & vocal accompaniment. Not to say there aren't many others that could/would adequately do the job, but these are the guitars I personally like the best. I've spent a little time with each (except the Bourgeois), but not enough time with any of them to reach a concrete conclusion...probably because they are all so nice in their own right. So, for those of you that have extensive experience with one--or preferably a few--of the (4) on my list, I'd be interested in your opinions.

1. Gibson J-45 TV
2. Bourgeois Slope D Short Scale
3. Martin D-18GE
4. Martin 000-18GE

As you can see, these are all mahogany guitars because that is generally my preference in a dread, and my current "000" is rosewood. I play mostly with my fingers--even rhythm play--although I am trying to get a feel for using a pick (but struggling a bit). I'd be playing mostly singer/songwriter stuff...Neil Young, Jackson Browne, JT, Dylan, John Mayer as well as folky/bluesy/alt stuff along the lines of JJ Grey, Damien Rice, etc. and a splash of country. I have a tenor voice with decent range and a bit of a rasp when the vocals need to get powerful/loud.

[GibbyPrague]

Honestly, the J-45TV sounds like the ideal guitar for your needs.

[rockabilly69]

For what you are describing I know of a great guitar. An original 70's Gibson Gospel. Yes I know the back and sides are laminated maple but they are perfect as a rhythm instrument with vocals. Listen to this track I just recorded, and listen how it sits next to a vocal, electric guitar, and a Djembe...

http://soundcloud.com/daniel-weldon-1/waiting-on-you

[Mtn Man]

We have a D-18GE and while I think it’s an incredible guitar, I would not recommend it for a rhythm only player. It was designed to be a bluegrass cannon. It does ok on rhythm, but really excels at cutting through the mix on leads. Not something you want in a rhythm guitar, which should blend, not cut (IMO). The GE also has an Adirondack top which gives it a more urgent tone. Again, not necessarily what you’re looking for in a rhythm guitar.

Our favorite rhythm guitars always seem to be a rosewood something or other. Have you tried an HD-28? Cheaper than a GE, with a better rhythm texture IMO. We’ve played some used ones that were absolute beasts on rhythm.

Not familiar with the J45TV but we did a side-by-side comparison of the GE and a vintage J45 and the J45 definitely had a sweeter sound on rhythm. Nick was tired and cranky here (this followed a two-hour band practice) so he’s a little sloppy but it might give you an idea. The very last song is where the J45 really shone IMO. Note the "strident" tone of the GE on rhythm. Some of that is technique, but some of it is definitely the guitar.

2006 D-18GE vs. 1964 J45

[woodbox]

I am gong to agree with GibbyPrague.

I have a Gibson J-45 Standard that is delightful for what you are talking about doing. It compliments without competing with the vocals. Very well mannered guitar. It plays effortlessly and sounds perfectly at home letting the lead vocal be the lead vocal. I smile everytime I pull it out.

I also have and enjoy a 000-18GE. I have to pay attention with this one...it is strong! I liken it to a small car with a turbo. It is very expressive and dynamic, but you can get into trouble cuz there is a lot of power waiting to jump out and bite someone. Dont get me wrong, I love it!! But it is not a casual player..you have to pay attention.

I will agree also with Mtn Man...Remove the D-18GE from consideration for your application and stated purpose....you can move furniture with that guitar!! Knock pictures off the wall!!!
GREAT guitar, but, not for what you are doing.

[rmyAddison]

I've owned both GEs and I am a performing singer/songwriter, I primarily flatpick but also play fingerstyle.

If you mostly play rhythm and use your fingers I would not be looking at any large guitars (dreads, jumbo, slope D, etc.), you can play anything on anything but large guitars IMO need to be driven to be optimal. Singing over a D-18GE can be almost impossible with one microphone, or takes a lot of practice/setup, a smaller body guitar is much easier to balance with in general, especially if you don't use picks which add a lot of volume with less effort.

What's wrong with using you Clapton? Of what you listed I would go with the 000-18GE, mine just turned 10 years old and sounds wonderful, and it would make a nice complement to the rosewood 000-28EC.

I used to perform with dreads, including a D-18GE, but with both vocal and guitar microphones, and IMO OM/000's are just easier to work with, easier to balance vocal/guitar volumes, more comfortable, and better suited to using fingers than the big boys.

I recommend the 000-18GE, my .02 !!

[SalFromChatham]

Originally Posted by GibbyPrague

Honestly, the J-45TV sounds like the ideal guitar for your needs.

Agree.

The D-18GE - a phenomenal guitar no doubt - is known for its flatpicking prowess. You should also make sure you like the neck before you pull the trigger.

[hovishead]

I'm going to throw a standard D-28 and D-35 and an old standard D-18 (straight braced) into the mix.

I seriously love straight braced Martins for vocal rhythm stuff. They sound awesome mic'd up, have great balance and can be played hard without breaking up.

I'd say D-28 or J-45 would probably be my choice.

[MikeVB]

At the risk of insulting others...saying this or that guitar is too powerful or whatever to accompany yourself singing is just wrong and internet yacking.

Just look at all the different guitars used by thousands of famous and not so famous singers. Every type and size of acoustic you can imagine and some you can't.

The best thing to do is find the guitar that just attaches itself to your soul. That is what inspire you to make the best music.

[BoneDigger]

My favorite singing/rhythm guitar is my D28 standard. But, since you want mahogany, I would probably opt for the Gibson. Or, take a look at the Eastman offerings. I don't think the D18 GE will be well suited to your task.

Todd

[brencat]

Surprised no one has mentioned the Gibson Hummingbird or Hummingbird TV yet ... ?

[mikealpine]

I'm probably going to get in trouble here, but I think Takamine makes some really fine instruments that fall into the arena you're in, and they run quite a price range, so you can spend what you like and I'm sure you will find something wonderful.

[Glennwillow]

Hi drplayer,

My two favorites from your list are the Martins (D-18GE, 000-18GE). Since you already own a 000-28EC, then I would go for the dreadnought D-18GE just for some variety. The only reason not to use the D-18GE is if the larger dread body is uncomfortable for you. The 000-18GE is also a very nice guitar and may be easier to play because of the shorter, 24.9" scale, just like your Clapton.

-Glenn

[drbluegrass]

Originally Posted by Pater Familias

At the risk of insulting others...saying this or that guitar is too powerful or whatever to accompany yourself singing is just wrong and internet yacking.

Just look at all the different guitars used by thousands of famous and not so famous singers. Every type and size of acoustic you can imagine and some you can't.

The best thing to do is find the guitar that just attaches itself to your soul. That is what inspire you to make the best music.

I don't think most people here would argue your point (I certainly wouldn't). But the OP just wanted an opinion on some of the guitars he was considering. I definitely concur with your suggestion...play as many guitars as you can until you find "the one". Also, IMHO, I would include a short scale or 12 fret due to their relative ease of fingering.


Tom

[Aaron Smith]

I've owned 3 of the 4 guitars on your list, and my preference would be for the J-45 as a strummer to accompany vocals. But your preferences may be different, so get out there and start playing some.

Truthfully, I don't think a better guitar has ever been made for vocal accompaniment than the Gibson J-200. It's tonal signature sits perfectly alongside vocals.