Music Theory? Does it help?

[HHP]

Originally Posted by SunnyDee

More theory you just might know. It's not practical to have no knowledge of where the notes in a given key will be on the fretboard and just hunt and peck till you find a good one. Imo, to play quickly, you need to know which notes to ignore, where to find intervals you want as you create a melody, etc. You don't have to know what they are called, but you have to know them and where to find them and that requires some knowledge of intervals and how the fretboard presents them in different tunings.

Of course, there are those players who just use muscle memory to play a box shape of minor pentatonic over everything.

When I was in highschool, I was told that I had to learn to type, because it was the only job I would ever be able to to get. Needless to say, I absolutely refused to learn to type. For years, I refused to put typing in any job application, but that doesn't mean I sit here hunting and pecking each letter. It just means I never wanted to be forced to do it their way.

That's fine but you might consider that people who never studied music, much less music theory, have been some of the most influential musicians the world ever produced.

Off the top of my head....

Every bluesman south of the Canadian border
Every Appalachian musician who laid the foundations for the recording industry
Maybelle Carter
Bill Monroe
Buddy Holly
John Fahey
Charlie Poole
The Everly and Louvin Bros
Turlough O'Carolan
Tommy Peoples
etc , etc.

[Looburst]

If you have no aptitude for music I can see how it would help but if you have an ear for or play great by your ears alone then I say no need for it. In other words if you can hear what a minor versus major sounds like and know a flat from a sharp then leave it alone unless you're diving into Jazz.

[s2y]

Originally Posted by HHP

The old fashioned way. Play what sounds good, don't play what sounds bad.

Lots of notes, chords, and trial and error if you don't understand basic theory. When you understand, you still need to make sure things sound right.

[HHP]

Originally Posted by s2y

Lots of notes, chords, and trial and error if you don't understand basic theory. When you understand, you still need to make sure things sound right.

Makes you wonder what all those musicians did before there was music theory. People weren't walking off cliffs before Newton.

[SunnyDee]

Originally Posted by HHP

Makes you wonder what all those musicians did before there was music theory. People weren't walking off cliffs before Newton.

You'd have to go pretty far back for that. The ancient Greeks had music theory and the Roman Catholics created the first music school in Europe. Notation and guitar tabs go back centuries.

[B3N]

Originally Posted by jessupe

BUT that being said....many "famous" guitar players have either no or very limited theory knowledge.

Actually they know probably a lot...they just don't know it :-)

IMO there are much greater proportion of famous musicians that studied a lot of theory...

[rick-slo]

For example the Beetles. They did not know any music theory or how to read music. That did not slow them down though. Subsequently books and articles galore have been written analyzing their music in detail (modes used, multiple time signatures, etc.).

[B3N]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

For example the Beetles. They did not know any music theory or how to read music. That did not slow them down though. Subsequently books and articles galore have been written analyzing their music in detail (modes used, multiple time signatures, etc.).

No but that's George Martin that did Eleanor Rigby's strings arrangement if I remind correctly.

What makes an artist great is certainly not the lack of their theoretical background. And at some point, someone with a bit of theoretical knowledge in a band will be an asset for sure.

[B3N]

Originally Posted by SunnyDee

You'd have to go pretty far back for that. The ancient Greeks had music theory and the Roman Catholics created the first music school in Europe. Notation and guitar tabs go back centuries.

+1 on that one

[B3N]

Originally Posted by HHP

That's fine but you might consider that people who never studied music, much less music theory, have been some of the most influential musicians the world ever produced.

Off the top of my head....

Every bluesman south of the Canadian border
Every Appalachian musician who laid the foundations for the recording industry
Maybelle Carter
Bill Monroe
Buddy Holly
John Fahey
Charlie Poole
The Everly and Louvin Bros
Turlough O'Carolan
Tommy Peoples
etc , etc.

Bach
Beethoven
Mozart
Ravel
Debussy
...



and a immense majority of jazz and classical musicians, composers, arrangers, conducters, ...

[HHP]

Originally Posted by B3N

Bach
Beethoven
Mozart
Ravel
Debussy
...



and a immense majority of jazz and classical musicians, composers, arrangers, conducters, ...

Which of those guys played steel string guitar?

[Gmountain]

Originally Posted by HHP

Makes you wonder what all those musicians did before there was music theory. People weren't walking off cliffs before Newton.

No, but they didn't understand why they were falling out of trees.

[Gmountain]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

For example the Beetles. They did not know any music theory or how to read music. That did not slow them down though. Subsequently books and articles galore have been written analyzing their music in detail (modes used, multiple time signatures, etc.).

You can always find a few geniuses, here and there, like the Beatles, but they were the exception, not the rule.

[lodi_55]

Originally Posted by Gmountain

You can always find a few geniuses, here and there, like the Beatles, but they were the exception, not the rule.

Your proof?

[Mandobart]

I'm ignorant on many subjects. I realize I don't understand much about many subjects such as string theory, computer programming and most languages other than English. I would never say my lack of knowledge on these and other subjects make me as good or better equipped to practice or discuss these subjects as those that are experts on them.

I am an expert on a short list of subjects, and it amazes me when an individual ignorant of one of them attempts to school me on my field of expertise.

In America today arrogant ignorance is now a badge of honor. The internet and even this forum have a few "I don't know and don't even want to know" personalities. All knowledge has value. None of us can have all knowledge. But for someone to claim they play music, yet profess no knowledge and no desire for knowledge on basic theory is baffling to me. The truth is we all possess some music theory knowledge whether we admit it or not. If you know what a I-IV-V progression is, if you know a sharp from a flat, if you know how to transpose with a capo then sorry, you do know some theory.

Those that think learning more theory, learning notation or learning to put a name to a concept they already understand will hurt their current musicality are like someone who doesn't want to learn to run because they're afraid it will change how they walk.