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  #1  
Old 02-03-2011, 04:14 PM
jayhawk jayhawk is offline
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Default Custom Cittern Build

Hi Lawrence Nyberg has started a custom cittern build for me. I hope it will fit within the guidelines. Think of it not so much as a cittern as a 10 string 12 string guitar with a funny body shape.

Lawrence is out of Canada and has a reputation as one of the great mando and CBOM builders in North America. He also builds guitars. He has been great to work with. We talked for a couple of months before I decided to go ahead then talked for a couple of months to nail down details. It will be a mid scale cittern so it will have a 22.5 inch scale, the body is 14.75 inch across. I've asked him to make the body deeper than normal, it should be around 3.75 inches. I've decided on a walnut B/S and neck and blood wood binding. The top will be carved Port Orford Cedar. One of the reasons I decided on Lawrence was I could hear the excitement in his voice when I asked about POC.

The other thing that will be a little different is the fret markers. I have always admired the Bashkin style markers so I talked to Lawrence about that style. He had never done them, but liked the idea. I got help from our own Larry J and then traded some messages with Michael Bashkin as well. Mr Bashkin was very gracious about providing input. Lawrence and I kicked around ideas for the material and I was leaning towards copper, then he suggested turquoise. When he said that I went, 'Oh yeah'. The the fret markers will turquoise with a fine white line around them.

Here are some pictures from the start. As Lawrence shares more pictures, I will add the to the thread.

Here is the back



Another Picture of the back



The back being glued up



The Port Orford Cedar top



Jack
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The Princess looked at her more closely. "Tell me," she resumed, "are you of royal blood?"
"Better than that, ma'am," said Dorothy. "I came from Kansas."
--Ozma of Oz, by Frank L. Baum, 1907


1975 Mossman Great
1995 Taylor LKSM-12
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  #2  
Old 02-03-2011, 04:29 PM
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El Conquistador El Conquistador is offline
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Very Cool, Jack. I will look forward to watching and ultimately HEARING this baby.
Steve
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Old 02-04-2011, 04:32 AM
Trevor M Trevor M is offline
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I am looking forward to seeing more photos. What tuning are you thinking of?
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Old 02-04-2011, 08:12 AM
jayhawk jayhawk is offline
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Trevor

That is an interesting question. It seems that there is no 'standard' tuning on these things. While I'm learning I will probably keep the top four strings in mando tuning (GDAE) and let the bottom string be more of a drone (D). Now, saying that, I have Doc Rossi's book on order where he tunes the botton four to GDAE and tunes the top string to A.

Being in England I'm sure you see and hear more of these than I have heard, what do you see players tuning to?

thanks

Jack
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The Princess looked at her more closely. "Tell me," she resumed, "are you of royal blood?"
"Better than that, ma'am," said Dorothy. "I came from Kansas."
--Ozma of Oz, by Frank L. Baum, 1907


1975 Mossman Great
1995 Taylor LKSM-12
2008 Taylor Fall Ltd GC
2008 Applegate C Nylon Crossover
Fender Stratocaster - Eric Johnson Model
Nyberg Cittern
2011 Eastman AC508M
2012 Epiphone ES339
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Old 02-05-2011, 09:11 AM
Trevor M Trevor M is offline
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As you say, no standard tuning. I tend to keep mine I 5ths. At 22.5" scale you wont be able to manage CGDAE but as you say DGDAE should work. The other possibility for 5ths is GDAEB#, a variation on Doc's tuning. But there is no reason to stick to 5ths, try different tunings and see what works for you.
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Old 02-05-2011, 12:02 PM
jayhawk jayhawk is offline
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Thanks for the input Trevor. I think getting this is going to be a great adventure. I am sure I am jumping in over my head, but that's how we learn, isn't it.

Jack
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The Princess looked at her more closely. "Tell me," she resumed, "are you of royal blood?"
"Better than that, ma'am," said Dorothy. "I came from Kansas."
--Ozma of Oz, by Frank L. Baum, 1907


1975 Mossman Great
1995 Taylor LKSM-12
2008 Taylor Fall Ltd GC
2008 Applegate C Nylon Crossover
Fender Stratocaster - Eric Johnson Model
Nyberg Cittern
2011 Eastman AC508M
2012 Epiphone ES339
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Old 02-05-2011, 02:59 PM
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Very interesting, Jack! I look forward to seeing more pictures along the way, and to hearing the music that you're one day going to coax out of it!

cotten
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Old 02-05-2011, 05:12 PM
geordie geordie is offline
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Jack, ya need to check out this guy,
he play's in GDGDG and is the best "fingrerstyle" player of "celtic" dance tunes (including guitarists) I have heard - theres two or thee vids of him
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBWYY...eature=related
Geordie
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Old 02-05-2011, 10:08 PM
jayhawk jayhawk is offline
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Geordie

Oh yeah.

Joseph Sobol is the man. I ran across his You Tube stuff while I was learning about the cittern. I was absolutely blown away by what he does. The video you linked to he does such a good job of making what he does look simple. He has several others out there that are just as impressive. I wish he had more.

thanks

Jack
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The Princess looked at her more closely. "Tell me," she resumed, "are you of royal blood?"
"Better than that, ma'am," said Dorothy. "I came from Kansas."
--Ozma of Oz, by Frank L. Baum, 1907


1975 Mossman Great
1995 Taylor LKSM-12
2008 Taylor Fall Ltd GC
2008 Applegate C Nylon Crossover
Fender Stratocaster - Eric Johnson Model
Nyberg Cittern
2011 Eastman AC508M
2012 Epiphone ES339
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  #10  
Old 02-08-2011, 09:04 AM
jayhawk jayhawk is offline
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Hi

I got an update from Lawrence on the construction of the cittern. It will have a carved Port Orford Cedar top. He is currently carving the top.

Quote:
I have been carving the top. Boy, what a smell off that cedar. Not resiny like yellow cedar but more like powdered ginger. VERY pungent. I think you will still be able to smell it once you receive the commission. And as they say, it is a very stiff and strong wood-close to englemann/sitka I feel, so I am carving the top a little thinner than my usual red cedar tops.
I hope to have more pictures of the construction, soon.

Jack
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The Princess looked at her more closely. "Tell me," she resumed, "are you of royal blood?"
"Better than that, ma'am," said Dorothy. "I came from Kansas."
--Ozma of Oz, by Frank L. Baum, 1907


1975 Mossman Great
1995 Taylor LKSM-12
2008 Taylor Fall Ltd GC
2008 Applegate C Nylon Crossover
Fender Stratocaster - Eric Johnson Model
Nyberg Cittern
2011 Eastman AC508M
2012 Epiphone ES339
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  #11  
Old 02-11-2011, 07:43 AM
jayhawk jayhawk is offline
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I got an update from Lawrence on the cittern. Things are moving along very nicely. Lawrence's latest note says he should be putting the top and back on today.

Here are the latest pics from the build.

The bracing being glued to the back





Picture of the headstock. Notice in the last picture that it has a walnut cap that has been glued on over a think layer of red.





Here's the glued up frame




enjoy

Jack
__________________
The Princess looked at her more closely. "Tell me," she resumed, "are you of royal blood?"
"Better than that, ma'am," said Dorothy. "I came from Kansas."
--Ozma of Oz, by Frank L. Baum, 1907


1975 Mossman Great
1995 Taylor LKSM-12
2008 Taylor Fall Ltd GC
2008 Applegate C Nylon Crossover
Fender Stratocaster - Eric Johnson Model
Nyberg Cittern
2011 Eastman AC508M
2012 Epiphone ES339
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  #12  
Old 02-11-2011, 07:38 PM
Wade Hampton Wade Hampton is offline
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Jayhawk, I've been watching this build thread with great interest. I'm a huge fan of walnut instruments, as you might already know if you looked at the build thread I started for the Advanced Jumbo in black walnut that Howard Klepper is building for me.

Anyway, it looks very cool.

I have to ask, given your screenname - you're from somewhere in Kansas, I presume. Did you ever run into a Kansas City-based cittern player named Gerald Trimble, or meet his former bandmate Roger Landes? Both of those guys have done great things with the instrument. I knew them because we all came out of the same small Irish/Celtic music scene in Kansas City in the mid- to late-1970's.

There was an interesting twist of fate with an instrument Gerald had commissioned and received from the handbuilder John Monteleone, some time right around that period. It was a ten string cittern with an arched top and back, if I remember correctly, and at some point it got stolen.

Then some twenty or twenty five years later, the same instrument resurfaced in a shed behind a house in Raytown or Grandview, one of those 'burbs, which seems like just about the least likely place for an exquisite handmade cittern to show up. The new owner or renter of the house was an honest guy, and he tracked down John Monteleone, who put him in touch with Gerald.

So all's well that ends well, I guess!

Anyhow, your instrument looks like it will be a great one.


Wade Hampton Miller
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  #13  
Old 02-12-2011, 11:11 AM
Fliss Fliss is offline
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Very nice! I love the wood, and the detail of the layer of red under the headstock overlay. This is shaping up to be a beauty!

Fliss
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  #14  
Old 02-13-2011, 08:24 PM
jayhawk jayhawk is offline
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Wade

Yeah, 5th generation Kansan. My Great-Great Grandfather was a territorial judge in Atchison. I grew up around Wichita and went to college at Emporia. Outside of visits I never spent much time in KC so I don't know a lot of people up there. A great story about your friend and his cittern. One I hope I never have to live through.

Like you I love walnut instruments. I had the the opportunity a few years back to buy a Breedlove jumbo that was all walnut. This was one of those truly great Breedloves. It had an absolute smooth, rich sound. A guy at the shop described it as 'sounding like chocolate'. I regret not buying that guitar, the sound sometimes still haunts me at night.

Fliss

The instrument will be instrument will be bound with blood wood. I have seen walnut guitars bound with blood wood so I expect the cittern to be beautiful. I think the turquoise fret markers are going to accent nicely with the walnut and blood wood.

Jack
__________________
The Princess looked at her more closely. "Tell me," she resumed, "are you of royal blood?"
"Better than that, ma'am," said Dorothy. "I came from Kansas."
--Ozma of Oz, by Frank L. Baum, 1907


1975 Mossman Great
1995 Taylor LKSM-12
2008 Taylor Fall Ltd GC
2008 Applegate C Nylon Crossover
Fender Stratocaster - Eric Johnson Model
Nyberg Cittern
2011 Eastman AC508M
2012 Epiphone ES339
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 02-14-2011, 06:33 AM
Fliss Fliss is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayhawk View Post
... I think the turquoise fret markers are going to accent nicely with the walnut and blood wood....
I'm sure you're right. I have turquoise detailing on my redwood/walnut parlour, and I love it

Fliss
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