Any way to simulate a live gig?

[varmonter]

If you have a garage try setting up there.
If you can open the Bay door and stick your
Lawn mower out in the driveway running.
Make sure it's outside the garage so you don't
Die. You may get the same din as your bar room,

[MikeBmusic]

I always am annoyed when at a bar/club and the music is so loud that you can't be heard when talking to the person next to you = don't fight the crowd noise.
As others have said, if they want to listen to you, they'll move closer and stop talking.

[varmonter]

As a devote weekend warrior I have learned not
to let the crowd noise upset me. I find turning up
the pa in this case will either drive folks out or they
Will just talk louder. This is not a concert it's a bar.
Folks are there to socialize. So if the pa volume is tolerable
the overall din will be tolerable. Yes you need to be able
To hear yourself with this distraction. Try playing in front
of the tv. Turn it up (the tv)and focus on your playing.
Try playing a song on your stereo and playing a different
Song on your guitar .. this is hard but will help
Make you numb to distraction.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by PJ10

I own a Fishman SA 220, which is designed to be used as your monitor as well as your PA. I had been feeling good about the way things were sounding ahead of my gig last week, then the sound of the people in the bar threw me off. We had to keep turning up the PA and it sounded so distorted because it was right behind me. I hated it and it got in my head and because of that I turned a bit timid, which was apparent when I was performing.

In a way I’m asking if there is any way to simulate that atmosphere so I can practice that way. Also maybe there is a monitor that is compatible with the PA so I can put that out front and don’t have to worry about it.

As always any input is appreciated.

I have an SA 220 also... First thing I never put it directly behind me , I always put it slightly to one side or the other . In quieter gigs it sits behind and to the side , in the louder situations, first I put it all the way up on the tripod mount to get it well above my mic and the crowd. and I also start moving it forward .
In medium noisy situations I put it either only very slightly behind and to the side, and in very noisy situations I put directly to the side or even slightly in front of my mic position.
And as others have noted in noisy situations , that continue to be noisy or more so after you start playing is because most of the audience considers you as background music, not front row entertainment. and as such they will try to talk over the level of your music, and will increase their level as you increase yours. So pic a good level (that is not distorted ) and stick with it.

[El Conquistador]

Originally Posted by PJ10

OK, a couple of questions. Are you singing, because I don't see a mic. I'm guessing if I was that close to my SA with the mic and the volume that loud, I'd get great amounts of feedback.

Works either way.

EQ is just what you said. Dial down a boomy bass, ALWAYS leave the Mid at about 10:00 with K&Ks, and dial highs to taste.

If you have some runaway notes, use the notch filter to dial them out.

The RedEye Di is a separate pedal that can be purchased. https://www.fire-eye.com/red-eye-1/

Steve

[Chriscom]

Originally Posted by varmonter

If you have a garage try setting up there.
If you can open the Bay door and stick your
Lawn mower out in the driveway running.
Make sure it's outside the garage so you don't
Die.

Practicing for gigs is more dangerous than anticipated.

You can’t win the loudness wars and it’s not worth blowing out your ears anyway. If you can hear yourself play and neither the manager nor the crowd says you’re too soft, you’re doing fine.

[Chriscom]

EQ is just what you said. Dial down a boomy bass, ALWAYS leave the Mid at about 10:00, and dial highs to taste.

If you have some runaway notes, use the notch filter to dial them out.

The RedEye Di is a separate pedal that can be purchased.

Steve

Nice setup. Do you think you'd have any feedback issues in that photo if you were standing up? I always perform standing.

Edit: Probably obvious, but I'm asking since the mic, at that level, doesn't appear to be in the central blast zone of the SA220.

[open-road-matt]

Lots of great advice here!

There are a couple of downsides to the "you hear what the audience hears" approach.

That was Bose's slogan with the original L1 system and Fishman claimed it too when they released the Solo Amp (now the SA220) both companies telling us to put these behind us when we perform.

As others pointed out, it's a great theory and works well in quiet environments but can get problematic when things get noisy. I have found this to be especially true if the noisy venue catches me by surprise. Meaning I set up and did a sound check with a bit of volume to spare but the noise of the environment was WAY more than I thought it would be once I started playing.

If I put the system behind me, I may not have enough room to get safely away from the system (to avoid feedback and hearing damage) for the louder volume I need.

And even if I can move further away from the system to turn it up, people will (as others mentioned) just talk louder and I still won't be able to hear myself. Someone once wisely said, no one wins a volume war.

For what it's worth, I don't like in-ear monitors with these tower/stick type systems. I haven't tried them with the Fishman but I have with the Bose L1 and the JBL Eon One. These systems do a good job of spreading even sound throughout a venue and often can be heard well off to the side and even from behind the system. So even in a noisy room you can still hear quite a bit of yourself, it just isn't very clear.

When you put in your in-ears some (much?) of what you are blocking out is you! Now you have to turn up the in-ears to not only combat the noise of the room but to combat the evenly distributed, spread out sound you paid for when you bought the system! In other words you are fighting your own volume!

What I like with these tower systems is a little spot monitor. I use a TC Helicon VoiceLive FX150. I've also tried a cheaper one but I forget the brand. On their own these are just ok but when combined with a tower type PA, they give you the details you might be missing when you have the system off to the side or even in front of you. I know it's an extra thing to haul around but it allows you to leave your main system at one volume and monkey with your monitor as needed so you feel good about what you are hearing.

Hearing myself well is critical. I have friends that never use a monitor and I don't know how they do it. I start to push with my voice and that never goes well!

Matt

P.S. (I do like and did use in-ears for quite a while with a conventional set up of two speakers on sticks.)

[PJ10]

As mentioned, tons of great advice from those who have been in the trenches for much longer than me.

I like the idea of in-ear monitors, which seem to be compatible with the Fishman, but I also thing the personal PA might not be for me. I might cut my losses and go with a traditional PA and a wedge to go in front.

In the meantime, I also don't hate the idea of turning up the TV. That might be as close to getting outside noise with which to simulate a gig.

Thanks all!