Blueridge BR-70AS ... Adirondack / Brazilian?!

[Folkstrum]

BR has many loyal fans here, and elsewhere (even on UMGF-although they hate to admit it ). The only BR's I played were both laminates, and likely not great strings. They looked fantastic, but I was underwhelmed by the sound (I tend to be not to fond of laminates, and I own one-not as nice as a BR, tho). I don't know about the CITES thing, other than a coupla years back on UMGF someone with a Braz BR was asked to take a pic of the certification that it was legal and didn't, or couldn't, or something. Jeff M will remember that one too.

I have read tons of posts of people who own the 3-digit (solid wood) ones who will stack them up against their Martins, or Taylors, or whatever. I also know that Greg Rich, who was responsible for the initial designs of the new BR's left Saga Music Corp--a mutual decision to part. Since then, he has gone on to one-up Blueridge it seems, hiring on with Johnson Guitars (also Chinese), and designing the "Carolina" lines-also solid wood--cutting down on some of the over-abaloned headstocks on BR's and a touching bass E and A string---then the name of "Johnson" was recently changed to "Recording King" (too many "Johnson" jokes I guess ). Anyway, the new RK line is at least as impressive as the BR's, now ALSO designed by Greg Rich-and coming out with slopes, and OM's and all sorts of variations.

If you're looking into Blueridge, you might want to check out Johnson/Recording Kings ASAP. You may be pleasantly surprised (and no, no one around here has the RK's that I know of).

[Jeff M]

Originally Posted by Folkstrum

BR has many loyal fans here, and elsewhere (even on UMGF-although they hate to admit it ). The only BR's I played were both laminates, and likely not great strings. They looked fantastic, but I was underwhelmed by the sound (I tend to be not to fond of laminates, and I own one-not as nice as a BR, tho). I don't know about the CITES thing, other than a coupla years back on UMGF someone with a Braz BR was asked to take a pic of the certification that it was legal and didn't, or couldn't, or something. Jeff M will remember that one too.

I have read tons of posts of people who own the 3-digit (solid wood) ones who will stack them up against their Martins, or Taylors, or whatever. I also know that Greg Rich, who was responsible for the initial designs of the new BR's left Saga Music Corp--a mutual decision to part. Since then, he has gone on to one-up Blueridge it seems, hiring on with Johnson Guitars (also Chinese), and designing the "Carolina" lines-also solid wood--cutting down on some of the over-abaloned headstocks on BR's and a touching bass E and A string---then the name of "Johnson" was recently changed to "Recording King" (too many "Johnson" jokes I guess ). Anyway, the new RK line is at least as impressive as the BR's, now ALSO designed by Greg Rich-and coming out with slopes, and OM's and all sorts of variations.

If you're looking into Blueridge, you might want to check out Johnson/Recording Kings ASAP. You may be pleasantly surprised (and no, no one around here has the RK's that I know of).

Yep.
As I understand it, Blueridge was not very receptive to some changes that Rich wanted them to make...one reason for him leaving.
I know he had talked about improving the neck profile, nut width, over the top HS "overlay". Not sure what else.

I'd love to get my hands on one of the new RK line. Nobody near carries them.

[Born2be]

I have a Blueridge BR-163. It's my second guitar. It's what I replaced my one hundred dollar pawnshop guitar with, and I gotta say I absolutely love it. I like the skinny neck, because my fingers aren't that long. Hopefully in a few years they'll be longer. (From what I know of guitars - which isn't much) the sound seems to be really nice on my guitar and the bass is full and rich. And it looks really nice. I think I like to look at my guitar more than playing!

[Yira Yira]

Originally Posted by Tony Burns

Their is also questions about slave labor in China - or should i say human rights violations !

Does that mean you have rid your life of all Chinese made products?

[Stockard]

Originally Posted by Jeff M

You should participate in the "Loading Dock" discussions more.

Ok Jeff,let's see: If I participate more in the "Loading Dock" discussions,I will be better at comparing guitars? Hmmm......I must try that.
(this stuff is fun aint it)?
Peace

[Jeff M]

Originally Posted by Stockard

Ok Jeff,let's see: If I participate more in the "Loading Dock" discussions,I will be better at comparing guitars? Hmmm......I must try that.
(this stuff is fun aint it)?
Peace

Stockard, calm down my friend.
I was alluding to the discussion going into the realm of politics and your to the point reply....very prevalent in the 'dock.

My reply was not meant in any way to be critical of you or of your preferred choice in guitars.

[Stockard]

Originally Posted by Jeff M

Stockard, calm down my friend.
I was alluding to the discussion going into the realm of politics and your to the point reply....very prevalent in the 'dock.

My reply was not meant in any way to be critical of you or of your preferred choice in guitars.

Jeff, I am not offended by your comments. I am just enjoying the repartee
I do not own a blueridge, and my favorite guitar is a Taylor.
That said, check out my "new thread" on open mike.
I truly appreciate you and this Forum

Peace

[Jim Bo]

He guys. I had been leery of Blueridge guitars but I have now become a believer. I became the proud owner of a used (in new condition) BR-180 a couple of years ago and I couldn't be happier with a guitar. It is so pretty (you even get used to the small "decorative" headstock) and it has a beautiful sound. So easy to play and the workmanship is impeccable.

This last week I bought a BR-160. Same as the 180. Sounds great, easy to play and again the workmanship is super.

I own several high-end guitars but I would just as soon play these two guitars as any of the others.

Blueridges are undervalued (or maybe some of the others are overvalued) in my opinion. Both of these guitars were made in November, 02 and both are in pristine condition with no structural problems at all.

Just my $.02 worth.

[Stockard]

You know, all this reminds me of the time in the '60s when Geo Gruen bought a big stash of pre-war D45s in Georgia somewhere, put 'em in a vault in Nashville and sold one for what was then an outlandish price to a player/collector. We were pretty sure that all the good guitars would wind up in someone's "trophy room", and the players would have to resort to.....I don't know,Yamahas? Anyway, guitars got better, evenn the less expensive ones, and the "players,some of them anyway, became collectors, and vice versa.
Could this (Chinese manufactured instruments) be just another link in that chain?
Did this series of events lend themselves to the rise of Taylors and customs?
Probably.

Peace

[MissouriPicker]

I figure that you play the guitar/s that you like and S C R E W whoever doesn't like it. Each of us is the only one whose opinion really matters in this. We are the one that has to be satisfied with the guitar.

I've heard alot about the RK guitars, but as someone already said, there are literally none to be seen, let along played. I won't buy a guitar on "hype" and bull we often find on the internet. On the BlueRidge Forum, they had people praising RKs to the heavens and they've never even seen or heard one or played one or found out anything about them aside from "hype." My only hangup on Chinese guitars is that I absolutly do not believe what the advertising says. I do not trust the Communist Chinese Government, nor the industries it controls. I'm not talking about "the" Chinese people who have very little say in any of this. I believe Greg means well and is very honest, BUT, I sincerely doubt that he has any control regarding what woods the Chinese actually use. HOWEVER, if a guitar sounds good, I really don't care what the wood is, and if it's a guitar I'd like to own. I'm not a "green" person who believes the planet is on the edge of extinction or that the sky is falling. But I am a person who does not trust the Communist Chinese. Naturally, "what kind of wood is it really?," can be asked of all guitars made in Mainland China.

[Randal_S]

Originally Posted by MissouriPicker

I figure that you play the guitar/s that you like and S C R E W whoever doesn't like it. Each of us is the only one whose opinion really matters in this. We are the one that has to be satisfied with the guitar.

I've heard alot about the RK guitars, but as someone already said, there are literally none to be seen, let along played. I won't buy a guitar on "hype" and bull we often find on the internet. On the BlueRidge Forum, they had people praising RKs to the heavens and they've never even seen or heard one or played one or found out anything about them aside from "hype." My only hangup on Chinese guitars is that I absolutly do not believe what the advertising says. I do not trust the Communist Chinese Government, nor the industries it controls. I'm not talking about "the" Chinese people who have very little say in any of this. I believe Greg means well and is very honest, BUT, I sincerely doubt that he has any control regarding what woods the Chinese actually use. HOWEVER, if a guitar sounds good, I really don't care what the wood is, and if it's a guitar I'd like to own. I'm not a "green" person who believes the planet is on the edge of extinction or that the sky is falling. But I am a person who does not trust the Communist Chinese. Naturally, "what kind of wood is it really?," can be asked of all guitars made in Mainland China.

But isn't it Greg/ Recording King's responsibility to ensure that the guitars that they sell conform to some standard? If Greg Rich/ Recording King are willing to stake their reputation on the quality of their guitars, I'd think they'd be extremely interested in keeping an eye on materials and production methods.

[Jeff M]

Originally Posted by Randal_S

.... I'd think they'd be extremely interested in keeping an eye on materials and production methods.

As much as they can, yes.
China is still a bit of a "black box" when it comes to their business practices/goods. Just look at the recent scandals with pet food and toy paint.
At some point companies/people outside of China have to just trust that their Chinese suppliers/manufacturers are doing good job and are being totally honest with them. That "trust" factor just isn't completely there for me.

[Randal_S]

Originally Posted by Jeff M

As much as they can, yes.
China is still a bit of a "black box" when it comes to their business practices/goods. Just look at the recent scandals with pet food and toy paint.
At some point companies/people outside of China have to just trust that their Chinese suppliers/manufacturers are doing good job and are being totally honest with them. That "trust" factor just isn't completely there for me.

I think that's only true of companies who are willing to either "look the other way" or subcontract to unknown suppliers. I don't think anyone has to at some point "just trust"... it can choose to spend the money needed to oversee manufacturing or verify suppliers as needed.

Ultimately, it's a matter of how much said company is willing to risk its reputation to save a few bucks. In the case of "Blueridge," "Recording King," or "Johnson," they have no reputation to protect. "So what if a batch of guitars falls apart? We'll just come out with a new name and claim that they're a cheaper version of a pre-war Martin."

No thanks.

[Jeff M]

Originally Posted by Randal_S

I think that's only true of companies who are willing to either "look the other way" or subcontract to unknown suppliers. I don't think anyone has to at some point "just trust"... it can choose to spend the money needed to oversee manufacturing or verify suppliers as needed.

Ultimately, it's a matter of how much said company is willing to risk its reputation to save a few bucks. In the case of "Blueridge," "Recording King," or "Johnson," they have no reputation to protect. "So what if a batch of guitars falls apart? We'll just come out with a new name and claim that they're a cheaper version of a pre-war Martin."

No thanks.

It's a bit of a slippery slope.
I've read reviews on some of the early Blueridges that complained about some construction problems....tops cracking, loose braces.
The folks over here who designed/commissioned the guitars from the factory in China had to hang in there for awhile and trust that things would work themselves out. They seem to have improved.
On the other hand, the company did not seem responsive to other issues, such as some design modifications lots of folks were hoping for..and as I understand it, Rich tried to push through.
I've seen the same thing with Eastman guitars....another Chinese built product.
Communist systems are not used to having to produce "quality", or having to respond to consumer complaints. China's manufacturing system will have to undergo some evolution to compete in global markets.

[Taylorplayer]

I own two instruments that were made in China. I have a Blueridge BR-163, and an Eastman 905ce.

They both "score" very high in three main catagories: Playability, sound, value. They also seem to exhibit excellent craftsmanship as well.

It will remain to be seen what they are like as more mature instruments (say, 20 years from now). Will they hold up as well as a Martin or a Gibson? I honestly don't know. But, I do think the same "rules" apply -- that is, always find the best example of any given model you are looing for, and buy from a shop that will "stand behind" you if you do have problems. Both of those conditions fully apply to the purchases I made .... so, time will tell.

Tp