Aftermarket fixes for Fishman Prefix+T on my Rainsong?

[dogdog49]

I just received a Rainsong CO-OM1000N2 which is blowing me away acoustically. Best CF guitar I've ever played, but the Prefix+T doesn't do it justice through my Compact 60. I've got K&K's in most of my wooden guitars and I'm very happy with the tone, but I'd rather not try to change out the Fishman if I can avoid it. Have you guys experimented with aftermarket items like the BodyRez, Xvive Mike, etc. to try to make the Fishman sound a little warmer, fuller and more realistic? I'm finger style only so no quack issues. It just sounds so much thinner and brighter than the acoustic tone I'm getting.

[Finger Stylish]

When playing with my metal finger picks this is how I EQ; alternating the phase at times when howling/feedback occurs. (the venue mostly determines that)


When playing bare fingers or flat pick lead. This seem to be the deal. Again, I will alternate the phase as needed.

[Captain Jim]

The Compact 60 has a reputation for reproducing nicely what you put into it. If it is an older C60, it didn't have as much mid-range control as the newer models. It may be a matter of just tweaking the mids more to your liking.

I use a TC Helicon Play Acoustic (with BodyRez), and it seems to work well with the Shorty I have with the Fishman Prefix+T... seems to thicken the tone to my ear. Without some EQ, I have found that the Shorty can sound brittle with that pickup when amplified.

I can't say it's the guitar, the pickup, or the combination, but I've found it sounds really good into my Fishman Loudbox Mini, and not so good directly into my Bose L1c... so there is a difference with the amplification. With more EQ before the Bose, there is a definite improvement.

Hope that helps.

[JohnDWilliams]

I installed a K&K into my P12, disconnected the UST from the preamp, and hooked up the K&K where the UST was connected. I think it was even screw terminals so no soldering.

The P12 has been my main gigging guitar, for country blues, for several years. Very happy with the results and can easily go back to stock configuration if I ever want to.

[dogdog49]

Originally Posted by JohnDWilliams

I installed a K&K into my P12, disconnected the UST from the preamp, and hooked up the K&K where the UST was connected. I think it was even screw terminals so no soldering.

The P12 has been my main gigging guitar, for country blues, for several years. Very happy with the results and can easily go back to stock configuration if I ever want to.

Interesting. I had written to K&K about possible impedence problems with that and here's what they said:

Jack@K&K Sound <[email protected]>
To russell graves Jun 5 at 8:03 AM
Our Pure pickups can be used with most preamps however due to input impedance differences there can be mismatches which result in tone changes, the Fishman preamps tend to boost the bass response considerably.
The locations for mounting the pickup must be smooth and flat. Many instruments need to have some attention to this issue. The only way to k ow is to inspect the bridgeplate area to determine if it is flat and smooth or needs some work.

Best regards,

Jack Baley
K&K Sound Systems
Technical Support


I guess you didn't have those issues. Teddy at Dazzo said his pickups are an impedence match for the Fishman however. Never tried a Dazzo but seiously considering it now.

[121]

The K&K Pure Mini pickup sounds best with lower input impedance like 500 k to 1 meg ohm, I believe the Fishman Prefix Plus-T input impedance is 20 meg ohm.

[jonfields45]

If it does not work well, put a 1M ohm shunt resistor across the screw terminals on the preamp where you also connected the K&K. The JJB 330 is a little lower output, which will inch you slightly closer to the much lower output of a polymer piezo UST. I've put a K&K Pure Mini in a CO-DR1100N2 with good results. It was a feedback problem with loud floor monitors but otherwise sounded good. My concern is the RainSong does not have a smooth hard bridge plate to glue the pickups to. Not that this won't work fine as it did for me, but the day that pickup dies or becomes obsolete, you will not be able to remove it with a razor blade as is easily done with a wood guitar.

Get a Fishman Aura pedal, IMHO.

[dogdog49]

Originally Posted by jonfields45

If it does not work well, put a 1M ohm shunt resistor across the screw terminals on the preamp where you also connected the K&K. The JJB 330 is a little lower output, which will inch you slightly closer to the much lower output of a polymer piezo UST. I've put a K&K Pure Mini in a CO-DR1100N2 with good results. It was a feedback problem with loud floor monitors but otherwise sounded good. My concern is the RainSong does not have a smooth hard bridge plate to glue the pickups to. Not that this won't work fine as it did for me, but the day that pickup dies or becomes obsolete, you will not be able to remove it with a razor blade as is easily done with a wood guitar.

Get a Fishman Aura pedal, IMHO.

That's probably a good place to start.
I know very little about Aura pedals and there seem to a wide variety available both new and used. Any recommendations? I'd prefer to get something used and less expensive so I can recoup my investment if it's not for me. I see some older Aura 16 Concert pedals on eBay for under $100.00.
Would that be appropriate for my CO-OM1000? Some reviewers have complained of a sort of lag when playing. Have you found that to be an issue? Also, has anyone tried the new AC-3 pedal from Zoom? Is their processing similar to the Aura system?

[jonfields45]

If you go Aura, get one that supports image download from the Fishman website. The image that works for you might not be labeled and derived from what might seem like a logical choice. I've owned them all (Zoom, Fishman, BodyRez...) and for me I ended up with a ToneDEQ to tame my USTs (a little EQ, 80 Hz sub bass cut, modest reverb, tiny touch of chorus, and a fair amount of compression). I think the Aura has the most capability to get you to a mic like tone. For more money ToneDexter appears to be perfect as you create your own "images".

[GibsonGuy]

I removed the Fishman and replaced it with a LR Baggs M80. Sounds great.