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  #1  
Old 08-11-2017, 11:59 AM
Rescon Rescon is offline
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Default Neck Reset on Electric

Hey fellow Wanna-B-Luthiers, I have a repair project i am trying to help a friend out with. My bandmates nephew bought a Strat kit guitar and after all is said and done, its a great looking guitar for a 14 yr old's fist build project. Only problem, the neck angle is all wrong and the strings are hitting the frets at the 14/15th frets. Nothing wrong with the bridge, saddle or nut, neck is straight with a functional truss rod. Bolt on neck is secure and tight but something isn't right in the neck slot and it looks to me like some shimming may be in order. Either neck is to thin at the block or pocket is too deep at the body

Now, I have been doing my own basic setup work (saddle/nut adjustments) on all my acoustic for years but never a electric and the idea of a neck reset/shimming is a bit new to me. After being brutally honest with the kid and letting him know the problem i recommended a real tech but he doesn't have the $$. So in the spirit of trying to help a youngster get something that is decent and playable for short $$ he gave me the go ahead to attempt the fix.
I have read a bunch on these types of issues from many different places but can't find a single source that I can keep going to. Can anyone help with a online source that will kinda walk through the steps regarding proper neck angle and/or repair procedures when needed? I really want to get this into a playable place for him and I feel my understanding of the issues and knowledge of basic Luthiery skills can get him there without a costly tech bill.
Thanks for any direction and help that may be given.

Nick

was going to post a pic but the whole Photobucket thing has got me hot under the collar and I need to move away from them
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  #2  
Old 08-11-2017, 12:49 PM
jonfields45 jonfields45 is offline
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http://www.stewmac.com/Materials_and...or_Guitar.html

Or some pieces of business cards.
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Old 08-11-2017, 04:35 PM
Rescon Rescon is offline
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Well that certainly makes it a bit easier
Thanks for that Jon
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Last edited by Rescon; 08-11-2017 at 04:52 PM.
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Old 08-11-2017, 05:03 PM
murrmac123 murrmac123 is offline
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I have never been able to understand why Stew Mac describe these shims in terms of "degrees" rather than just giving the length, and the thickness of the thick end.
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Old 08-11-2017, 06:23 PM
mirwa mirwa is offline
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It sounds like the neck pocket is too shallow.

You can deepen the neck socket with a chisel or you can flat sand the heel with sandpaper or belt sander.

Steve
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Old 08-13-2017, 07:56 PM
JLS JLS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mirwa View Post
It sounds like the neck pocket is too shallow.

You can deepen the neck socket with a chisel or you can flat sand the heel with sandpaper or belt sander.

Steve
I'd suggest a router for either of these operations.
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Old 08-13-2017, 11:19 PM
mirwa mirwa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLS View Post
I'd suggest a router for either of these operations.
That is what I use as well for deepening the neck pocket or re-setting the angle of the base,, well I use an overhead pin router, not everyone unfortunatley has access to a router when assembling these kit guitars. Hence the chisel suggestion

Steve
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Old 08-14-2017, 11:00 AM
Rescon Rescon is offline
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When the guitar came to me the next was straight (very slight relief) with 10's on it up to standard 440... and the strings were hitting at the 13-14 frets.
Am I thinking wrong but wouldn't deepening the pocket make things worse?
Another note, the whole neck including end that sits in body pocket was painted. Is that typical or should the neck area be masked when painted so there is wood and wood contact with body. Actually, know that I think of it, the body pocket is painted as well with same finish paint for body
Should I gently sand that paint off?

Nick
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Old 08-14-2017, 12:45 PM
Howard Klepper Howard Klepper is offline
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So far I haven't seen anything to indicate that the guitar needs its neck angle changed. Sounds to me like a guitar that needs fretwork and a setup, unless you can't raise the bridge any higher.
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Old 08-14-2017, 04:29 PM
John Arnold John Arnold is offline
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The surfaces of the joint are normally finished. If the neck fits now, removing finish will make it loose.
Strings hitting frets 13 or 14 indicates that the neck has too much relief.
If the action is too low, deepening the neck pocket will raise it. A shim added to the upper end of the pocket also will raise the action.
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Old 08-14-2017, 06:43 PM
mirwa mirwa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Arnold View Post
The surfaces of the joint are normally finished. If the neck fits now, removing finish will make it loose.
That makes very little sense to me John. Removing finish from the base of a neck socket simply allows a neck to sit lower, it in no way makes a neck suddenly loose.

Steve
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Old 08-14-2017, 06:49 PM
mirwa mirwa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rescon View Post
Now, I have been doing my own basic setup work (saddle/nut adjustments) on all my acoustic for years but never a electric...............
Thanks for any direction and help that may be given.
Nick,

The key to anything is follow a set of mechanical steps and then tweak accordingly to how the instrument feels at the end.


Steve
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Last edited by Kerbie; 10-26-2017 at 08:23 AM. Reason: Edited
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  #13  
Old 08-15-2017, 11:52 AM
Rescon Rescon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Klepper View Post
So far I haven't seen anything to indicate that the guitar needs its neck angle changed. Sounds to me like a guitar that needs fretwork and a setup, unless you can't raise the bridge any higher.
The bridge adjustments are running on the high side almost maxed out. I didn't want to use that as my only adjustment to solve the problem. My thought was to set all six bridge levels in the middle range initially and look at what else needs a adjustment after that. With the strings hitting frets, neck fairly straight with some relief, bridge on high side.... doesn't neck angle seem like it could be too shallow (not enough angle)?
With how nice the neck and frets look, I'm assuming he bought the neck pre-fretted. Could the frets be that low on a prefab neck to cause a low action problem like this?
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  #14  
Old 08-15-2017, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rescon View Post
Hey fellow Wanna-B-Luthiers, I have a repair project i am trying to help a friend out with. My bandmates nephew bought a Strat kit guitar and after all is said and done, its a great looking guitar for a 14 yr old's fist build project. Only problem, the neck angle is all wrong and the strings are hitting the frets at the 14/15th frets. Nothing wrong with the bridge, saddle or nut, neck is straight with a functional truss rod. Bolt on neck is secure and tight but something isn't right in the neck slot and it looks to me like some shimming may be in order. Either neck is to thin at the block or pocket is too deep at the body
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rescon View Post
The bridge adjustments are running on the high side almost maxed out. I didn't want to use that as my only adjustment to solve the problem. My thought was to set all six bridge levels in the middle range initially and look at what else needs a adjustment after that. With the strings hitting frets, neck fairly straight with some relief, bridge on high side.... doesn't neck angle seem like it could be too shallow (not enough angle)?

With how nice the neck and frets look, I'm assuming he bought the neck pre-fretted. Could the frets be that low on a prefab neck to cause a low action problem like this?
If it's only hitting the at the 14th/15th frets, the neck cannot be straight. Have you checked the neck with a straightedge (not a string) that spans the first to last frets? I'd suggest getting that straight first, with about 0.005"-0.010" relief. Then check nut slots and reduce those to fret height or only a 0.002"-0.003" above fret height. If after doing all that the action is still to low with the saddles adjusted near max, you should look at shimming the neck pocket to increase the angle of the neck relative to the body.
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  #15  
Old 08-15-2017, 01:11 PM
Rescon Rescon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mirwa View Post
Nick,

This is my general setup process, the key to anything is follow a set of mechanical steps and then tweak accordingly to how the instrument feels at the end.

http://www.mirwa.com.au/HTS_Guitar_Setup.html

Steve
Thanks Steve for this, very helpful. I got some pocket shims from Stewmac on the way.
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