Epiphone Masterbuilt 2016 Olympic/Zenith Classic

[cu4life7]

I stumbled across these this morning while reading the Dave Rawlings article that someone posted in the General section, and they peaked my interest a bit. I was wondering if any of you have had a chance to try any of the Epiphone Masterbuilt Century series and in particular the Olympic or Zenith models. I have been toying with the idea of an affordable acoustic archtop for years, but haven't found one that inspires me. The plugged in tone in particular seems to really shine in the youtube videos, but does anyone have any hands on experience? Thanks in advance.

[gmr]

There are some videos on the epiphone website. The Olympic is not featured unfortunately but the deluxe is and it has a huge sound. I am not fond of those big guitars from a. Ergonomic perspective. I do love the Zenith as it has the same basic deme skins as my es125. The ES is great but not as purely acoustic sounding as these.

[madstone]

GC lists them as arriving this August.

[Archtop Guy]

I'll be looking to check them out as soon as they're available!

[Steve DeRosa]

If they can do a '39 Emperor for around $1300-1500 I'm in...

[Hot Vibrato]

I love the Pre-Gibson New York Epiphone archtops. I own three of them. They are wonderful sounding if they are in playable condition. Unfortunately, many of the old ones need fret work or neck resets (often both), not to mention binding replacement, and various other structural repairs. But IMO, when playing well, the NY Epi's often blow vintage Gibson archtops out of the water.

This is the first I've heard about Epiphone reissuing their classic archtop designs. I'm thrilled to see that they are producing modern versions of the vintage Epi tuners. They appear to be identical (albeit with a different gear ratio). I assume these guitars are made overseas? They state that they have a "solid top", but there is no mention of them being carved (I assume this means they're pressed?), so they might not sound much like the originals. I have a vintage pressed-top Framus archtop which sounds fantastic acoustically, but still, a carved top would be more historically correct, and would certainly result in a more authentic vintage Epiphone sound.

One shortcoming (IMO) of the current Epi Masterbuilt flat top guitars is the finish. They're not lacquered - it's a modern catalyzed finish (polyester I think) and the finish is too thick, so the tone is diminished as a result. I assume this will be the case with the Masterbuilt archtops as well, but one can hope...

That said, there is certainly room in the market for these guitars if their quality surpasses that of the other import brands (Loar, etc., which suck IMO). So far, the only import archtop brand I've been at all impressed with at all has been Eastman, but they have a softer, more modern sound, which I don't like nearly as much as the sound of a NY Epiphone.

The only downside of these guitars hitting the scene is the fact that those of us who have always loved to play archtops will not be quite as unique as we once were if they catch on. I kind of enjoy being different from my flat top-playing brethren. It's one of the things that I think makes me stand out from the crowd.

Having said that, the real reason I love archtops is the sound. At first, they sound thinner than a good flat top, but once you learn how to finesse the strings just right, there's nothing like it. Flat tops generally sound mushy and dark in comparison. I'll be an archtop man til the day I die!

[Jabberwocky]

Originally Posted by Hot Vibrato

...I'll be an archtop man til the day I die!

I have planks. I have semi-hollows. I have classical. I have archtops, many. But not one steel-string flat top in my little collection. Anytime I feel like getting a steel string I put it up against an archtop and I sez to meself, I'd prefer to get another archtop.

That Santa Cruz M13 or Eric Skye 00 is really tugging at me heart strings though. Some day. Some day.

[zombywoof]

They do look tasty don't they. I might be running to check a few out if I had not recently picked up a much in need of some TLC early 1950s blondie Triumph cutaway.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by zombywoof

They do look tasty don't they. I might be running to check a few out if I had not recently picked up a much in need of some TLC early 1950s blondie Triumph cutaway.

I used to own a beautiful birdseye maple (carved spruce top) Epi Triumph that was inside an original case that someone had sitting out with lots of other stuff sitting out for the trash collector. It had the DeArmond pickup and other case candy with it, too. I kept it for several years and finally sold it as I gravitated toward flat tops and realized it really needed to be in the hands of a player who could appreciate it.

I really like smaller guitars due to a severe shoulder injury a few years back and I'd almost consider one of the new Olympics, but that battery compartment on the lower bout is just so cheesy that I don't think I could stomach it.

[Hot Vibrato]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

I'd almost consider one of the new Olympics, but that battery compartment on the lower bout is just so cheesy that I don't think I could stomach it.

Didn't notice that until you mentioned it, but I guess they have to put the battery somewhere if they insist on installing a piezo pickup. Maybe I'm just a purist, but I hate the idea of an under-saddle piezo in an archtop guitar. There's a certain sound that people associate with an archtop guitar and you're not going to get it with a modern piezo system. What's the point of having an acoustic archtop guitar if on stage it sounds like you're playing a Takamine?

Furthermore, the shape of the Zenith is not the same as the vintage Zenith, which has a 16 3/8" lower bout, as opposed to 16" on the modern recreation. The f-hole shape looks wrong to me too. Also, I'm not crazy about the "falling snowflake" inlay. I don't think that was on any of the vintage models.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by Hot Vibrato

...the shape of the Zenith is not the same as the vintage Zenith, which has a 16 3/8" lower bout, as opposed to 16" on the modern recreation. The f-hole shape looks wrong to me too. Also, I'm not crazy about the "falling snowflake" inlay. I don't think that was on any of the vintage models.

In order:

• Agreed 100%; it appears they used a generic 16" archtop mold at whatever factory is producing these for Epiphone - should have gone with the mold they used for the '66 Century thin-body and just made it deeper...
• The f-hole shape used is also generic, albeit roughly similar to those used on many lower-end post-1953 New York Epiphones (as well as their competitors) - '30s/40s Zeniths would have featured either a three-segment (pre-1936) or "cello" design - and again, they went with what was on hand at the factory...
• The "falling snowflake" or "double diamond" inlay pattern is without question a proprietary Epiphone design dating at least to the mid-1920's, making its initial appearance on the Artist banjo and being adopted for the Recording Model "C" guitar circa 1930; although it was never standard on the Zenith it was OEM on the '31-32 Triumph as well as the circa-1935 Sorrentino Avon archtop (made by Epiphone for, ironically, CMI), and when the latter was discontinued existing stocks of necks with this inlay may well have been used on a few now-rare Zenith models until supplies ran out...

In addition to the above, the necks of all three models are an amalgam of '30s features: the '31-32 facing combined with the post-1939 center-dip headstock shape and "Episilon" enclosed gears, on a neck with a post-1936 lamination pattern; IMO they're trying to evoke the general vibe of an early Epi rather than recreate specific models in historically-accurate detail (a more-expensive proposition by any reckoning) and, given the niche market for archtops in general, it's probably a wise decision until they get their product into the hands of a broader-based clientele. FWIW they have the capability to produce era-specific models if they so choose - they already use the '34-38 asymmetrical headstock, '35-56 pearl script logo, post-1939 "bikini" headplate, and Emperor tree-of-life/split-V inlay on a number of other instruments - so it may just be a matter of demand...

[gmr]

It looks like there are at least some models arriving. I saw the round ski hole version of the Zenith in the sunburst finish on Sweetwater this afternoon. No others are yet pictured. Oddly, the archtop shape seems exceedingly subtle. Could be just the perspective of the photographs. Hopefully someone can get a hands on look at some of these soon!

[Rudy4]

Sweetwater has the others listed but not in stock yet, here's the Olympic:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/ETOLHBNH

[gmr]

Just re read my earlier post. I have no idea what a ski hole might be! But they do have the round sound hole version of the Zenith in stock at Sweetwater. At least one of them anyway. They have put up the photos on their website.

[Hot Vibrato]

The pickup sounds awful:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nV7FgZh4UQY

The sound in the video epitomizes the unpleasantly shrill sound of under-saddle piezo pickups. IMO, a floating magnetic pickup and/or a microphone is a much more appropriate choice for amplifying an archtop.

I wonder if it's available without the pickup and the giant battery hole in the side?