Feedback Supressors

[dwstout]

Anyone use or have opinions about stand alone feedback suppression units? We play in some VERY confined areas, i.e. up against a stone wall, and sometimes feedback has been impossible to avoid. This is with mics and as well as instruments, any frequency. Sometimes it's not possible to move away from the wall. I was looking at gear like this:
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-a...sion-processor

Any ideas?

[MikeBmusic]

Is the feedback from your monitors or main speakers? If from monitors, consider moving to in-ears.

[clintj]

Originally Posted by MikeBmusic

Is the feedback from your monitors or main speakers? If from monitors, consider moving to in-ears.

+1. Stage volume has a direct effect on feedback likelihood. I prefer a simple graphic EQ on my monitors to ring out feedback, but if you're chasing multiple frequencies on different inputs an active system may be better for you. Another thing to consider is your microphone's pattern. If a different stage location is out of the question, sometimes a slight turn of the microphone can help put a troublesome noise source into a mic's null zone.

[RockerDuck]

Why not just buy a Planet Waves feedback destroyer for $8.

[dwstout]

Originally Posted by RockerDuck

Why not just buy a Planet Waves feedback destroyer for $8.

It's the mics feeding back. I have a sound hole cover on my guitar.
We're standing in front of a solid stone/concrete/brick wall. EVERYTHING coming back at us hits the wall and goes straight into the mics.
Moving 5' from the wall works great. Except that not an option. That space is needed for people, with money, paying the sponsor.

[clintj]

Maybe hang something both tasteful looking and sound dampening on the wall behind you? Even just a fleece blanket will knock down a lot of midrange to treble reflections.

[lschwart]

You might want to try using the monitors as side-fills, rather than angled up in front of you and hitting that back wall directly. That mgiht also help get you a little more space between the monitors and your mics. If you have to have them in front of you, getting them at an angle to the right or left can also help--and that's easiest to do with hypercardiod mics, since the null spot is at an angle to the back of the mic, instead of directly at the back.

I've been thinking about getting a feedback buster myself, and one thing I've read and heard from people about them is that they tend to work best when you only give them a single source to deal with, putting one in, for example, the channel insert for a particular mic or instrument, rather than trying to let them cope with a full monitor or FOH mix.

The general web wisdom about these devices seems to be that the better ones, used properly, can be very useful tools for people who have to run their own sound from the stage while also performing--the down sides of using these devices are preferable to the show-killing effect of feedback, especially in situations where there isn't even time for a proper sound check. But most people who run sound for others prefer to use the tried and true preventative methods good stage arrangement and the "ringing-out" of the system during sound check--and a good set of ears combined with quick a reaction time and the knowledge of how to use a 31 band GEQ.

I set up and run sound for my band and my acoustic trio. I try to prevent what I can with a careful set-up, and at the levels we usually play, I can usually work with the limitations of whatever gain before feedback and can achieve that way, but there are some gigs where I'm thinking some electonic help might be useful. FWIW, the units that I keep hearing the best things about are the ones by Sabine.

Louis

[The Bard Rocks]

When I first got my bigger system, I was getting tons of feedback, that I couldn't conquer by changing placement of the speakers. So I bought a Peavey Feedback Ferret. Seemed to work fine, then I discovered that in when I was actually performing I was not getting the feedback like I had in practice. So that gives me a like new Feedback Ferret to sell at half price.

[RockerDuck]

Howabout personal monitors, like a Behringer 205D, to keep it close and easy to control.

[simondylan]

Originally Posted by dwstout

Anyone use or have opinions about stand alone feedback suppression units? We play in some VERY confined areas, i.e. up against a stone wall, and sometimes feedback has been impossible to avoid. This is with mics and as well as instruments, any frequency. Sometimes it's not possible to move away from the wall. I was looking at gear like this:
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-a...sion-processor

Any ideas?

Feedback is tricky! To most effectively fight it you must first understand the causes. Everything in the chain including the instrument influences it. Most time people don't consider the instrument but its important to understand. Many of the suggestions above are helpful but don't address the cause. The gear you are looking at will do the job but knowing how to use it is crucial. There is too much to go into regarding the instrument/pickups/mics, but it all must be installed correctly and understood. After that it really comes down to phase, EQ, and notching or filtering. Notching is huge; this is where understanding the instrument comes in because typically what feeds back the most is the note that the top of the instrument produces, or the "top resonance". On an acoustic guitar its commonly somewhere between F sharp and B flat. If you effectively notch out that frequency or note, most of your problems go away at any stage volume, most! It requires some fine tuning but that is basically what that piece of gear should do for you. Again it's a lot to go into and there is no sure fire cure that doesn't require some work and understanding on you part. It is doable though. A good sound-man is worth whatever they charge.

[Tomm Williams]

Originally Posted by dwstout

Anyone use or have opinions about stand alone feedback suppression units? We play in some VERY confined areas, i.e. up against a stone wall, and sometimes feedback has been impossible to avoid. This is with mics and as well as instruments, any frequency. Sometimes it's not possible to move away from the wall. I was looking at gear like this:
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-a...sion-processor

Any ideas?

Every system has it's limit of GBF, what causes you to reach that limit can be a number of things. Reflective surfaces (as you've found) how the system is deployed, rejection patterns of mics, processing and (most important) how the system is operated. When someone says they are having system-wide problems like this, one of the first things I wonder is if FX (especially compression) is being used ?

Other questions

What is the system? (brands/models,etc...)
How many open mics?
What type of mics?
Vocal or instrument processors?
How many performers?
What are you doing on the board? (HPF,EQ cuts/boosts, panning,etc..)
How are you ringing out the system ?

Feedback devices can come in handy in limited situations but often are not needed once you become familiar with system operation. HOWEVER........anyone who's done this very long can testify that "things" happen. I keep a pair of Sabine 2400's in a rack as "life preservers" for specific events where I can guarantee the talent is going to do the wrong thing.

[zhunter]

Not applicable

hunter

[Irish Pennant]

How about a large enough piece of canvas with your name printed on it for a back drop sound absorber. You can build a tasteful free standing frame for it and mount some LED lights on it. Place it between you and the brick wall. If built right it won't take up much more than a few inches of stage space.

[lschwart]

Just noting that the original query that started this thread is well over a year old. One of many suddenly resurrected threads we've had today.

Louis

[Irish Pennant]

Originally Posted by lschwart

Just noting that the original query that started this thread is well over a year old. One of many suddenly resurrected threads we've had today.

Louis

I missed the date stamp on the OP. This thread seems then to have been resurrected as a bait and switch.