This puzzles me about Braggs and Fishman output jacks.

[duane v]

Do they think everyone that plays acoustic guitar either sits down or stands in a catatonic state while playing

You would think by now they would have designed a safety strap button that's large enough so that your strap wouldn't slip off.....

Another $14 to StewMac for their strap secure doohicky....lol

[duane v]

Take that back $21..... $7 shipping for an item that weight 6 ozs.... ****ing StewMac....lol

[martingitdave]

I bought Lockit brand straps for my guitars. Won't fall off and standard strap jack. Truly a better mouse trap.


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[Rmz76]

Originally Posted by duane v

Do they think everyone that plays acoustic guitar either sits down or stands in a catatonic state while playing

You would think by now they would have designed a safety strap button that's large enough so that your strap wouldn't slip off.....

Another $14 to StewMac for their strap secure doohicky....lol

Don't get me started with pickup designers... Two things that really annoys me about LR Baggs 1.) they have not standardized the strap button replacement jack on all their pickups. So if you own a M1 and want to upgrade to an Anthem if the jack for the M1 has already been drilled it creates more work than should be neccessary. 2.) They have several pickup models that require a volume rocker be installed in the sound hole, but they don't manufacturer a sound hole plug with a cut out for their volume rocker. This is not only a missed opportunity for a product they could offer, but it's a real pain for their customers dealing with the feedback problems some of their pickups have. I've tried to cut though though the thick rubber on a sound hole plug. I've tried several tools and ruined one sound hole plug trying... I finally just gave up.

I love a few of LR Baggs pickups and think they are some of the best but as a company i truly hate them. I don't like the communications I've had with them. From my experience (which I'll admit is limited) I don't like how they support their products. I think considering the level they've risen to their no excuse for them not offering a certified service tech program. Some of their pickups require specific placement so it would make sense for them to do this. I'm not going to stop using their pickups anytime soon because I like their products. and I'm sure a good number of other payers don't let their support issues stop them from being customers. A $200 pickup investment is a lot different than a several thousand dollar guitar investment afterall. I still think it's sad because they could do a much better job.

[tadol]

Whats interesting is that almost all the acoustic pickup designs are stricty retrofit options. Nothing that is easily integrated into new construction at very low cost and allows for a couple of options in use. I also am amazed at how much we rely on running the jack thru the endpin - some professionals have realized how much more convenient it is to have the jack independent of the strap pin, and at some small cost, they've had the side reinforced to allow that installation. It would be nice if the shops could agree on some standard interior reinforcement that would facilitate electronics installation, while allowing the exterior to look 100% traditional -

[Captaincranky]

Originally Posted by tadol

Whats interesting is that almost all the acoustic pickup designs are stricty retrofit options. Nothing that is easily integrated into new construction at very low cost and allows for a couple of options in use. I also am amazed at how much we rely on running the jack thru the endpin - some professionals have realized how much more convenient it is to have the jack independent of the strap pin, and at some small cost, they've had the side reinforced to allow that installation. It would be nice if the shops could agree on some standard interior reinforcement that would facilitate electronics installation, while allowing the exterior to look 100% traditional -

Still, people with high end guitars would sometimes fight you to the death if you told them the best idea is to rout out the guitar, and install a 1/4" output/ XLR, along with it's corresponding 2" x 2" mounting plate. Finish the job off by doweling the end pin hole, and install a set of Schaller strap locks.

As far as the question of the existing end pin outputs, they seem to have a fairly substantial strap retaining lip on them, and IMHO, are a lot safer than those nasty plastic push in end pins.

All you have to do to get your basic strap over the lip on an end pin, is nick the slit end of the strap with a razor blade, X-Acto knife or what have you, as necessary, to attach it. That doesn't compromise the strength of the lower circular end of the strap hole, and you're golden.

[tadol]

NO NO NO - I am in no way suggesting that any kind of visible electronics of any kind be installed. Just that an area of reinforcement, a small additonal backing block, perhaps immediately adajcent to the end block, perhaps predrilled so that only the side need be drilled thru, which would allow a very solid, reinforced jack to be installed in very easily as needed, but would otherwise be juat a few extra ounces of material deep inside the guitar where it might never be noticed -

[joeguam]

This is the reason I gave up and bit the bullet - drilled a second, really small hole in the endblock to install strap locks separate from the endpin jack. Best decision I've made with regards to my straps.

[Captaincranky]

Originally Posted by tadol

NO NO NO - I am in no way suggesting that any kind of visible electronics of any kind be installed. Just that an area of reinforcement, a small additonal backing block, perhaps immediately adajcent to the end block, perhaps predrilled so that only the side need be drilled thru, which would allow a very solid, reinforced jack to be installed in very easily as needed, but would otherwise be juat a few extra ounces of material deep inside the guitar where it might never be noticed -

Look, my crappy old brand new Epiphone EJ-200-SCE comes with an end pin jack. It has a nice big lip on it. And even if the retaining nut / strap button were to occasionally work loose, a drop of Loc-Tite (blue) would take care of the issue, and you'd still be able to separate the parts if necessary.

My final assessment, those antiquated push in end pins are garbage. Back in the "good old days" they were made of ivory. Which didn't perform any better, it just had a touch of snob appeal.

FWIW, Fender glues a reinforcing block into the upper front bout, then hangs the strap button it. The lower bout already has a reinforcing block, to which a standard electric style strap button is installed at the factory. The electronics feed out through a plate mounted 1/4" / XLR connector. The guitars are 1/10 the price of a Gibson(*) or Martin, but the logistics for performing with the guitar(s), are far superior.

Pretty much any Asian built mid price AE instrument carries a similar solution. The Epi Ej-200 is a bit different, because it's stereo routed out through two separate outputs, but without the bulky, (but possibly useful), XLR jack.

(*), I'm guessing about Gibson pure acoustics. The last thread we had on this issue, (IIRC), was with a Martin.

[Earl49]

I have the Stew-Mac over sized end pin button - bought three of 'em as soon as I learned of them. It works great to retain the strap, but I almost have to leave the strap on all the time. If you loosen and tighten it very much, it also loosens the nut holding the pre-amp in the end pin hole. About every third time, I've had to get some pliers and tighten it back down again. I don't want to over-tighten the pre-amp nut to help avoid the issue. So I'm still looking......

[duane v]

Originally Posted by Earl49

I have the Stew-Mac over sized end pin button - bought three of 'em as soon as I learned of them. It works great to retain the strap, but I almost have to leave the strap on all the time. If you loosen and tighten it very much, it also loosens the nut holding the pre-amp in the end pin hole. About every third time, I've had to get some pliers and tighten it back down again. I don't want to over-tighten the pre-amp nut to help avoid the issue. So I'm still looking......

I just cut a bigger slit in the strap, and no problems. When I first used the SteMac doo-hickey it would grab the input hack nut and remove that as well, and the jack would fall into the belly of the guitar... GRRR... I had to file the corners of the jack nuts sow the SteMac Doo-Hickey would clear the jack nuts... But since I cut bigger slits on my straps the over-sized button never gets removed, and the straps stay on very securely.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by duane v

…since I cut bigger slits on my straps the over-sized button never gets removed, and the straps stay on very securely.

Hi duane…

Yup.

All my acoustics have the same jack/endpin and I made sure my straps fit the end-pins (not adapting end-pins to fit the strap).

[joeguam]

Originally Posted by Earl49

I have the Stew-Mac over sized end pin button - bought three of 'em as soon as I learned of them. It works great to retain the strap, but I almost have to leave the strap on all the time. If you loosen and tighten it very much, it also loosens the nut holding the pre-amp in the end pin hole. About every third time, I've had to get some pliers and tighten it back down again. I don't want to over-tighten the pre-amp nut to help avoid the issue. So I'm still looking......

I normally put a tiny drop of Loc-tite CA glue on the threading before I install it, this keeps it in place and it doesn't come loose.

[Captaincranky]

Originally Posted by joeguam

I normally put a tiny drop of Loc-tite CA glue on the threading before I install it, this keeps it in place and it doesn't come loose.

FWIW, "Loctite", is not a "CA", (cyanoacrylate) glue. It's a it's billed as a "thread locking compound". The reason I mention this is because they also market a CyA, "Super glue", and a heavy duty "this ain't ever coming apart", thread locker. (#271 red).

For holding the output jack in place, Loctite blue #242, is the strongest I'd ever recommend.: http://www.loctiteproducts.com/p/10/...r-Blue-242.htm And even this milder version will give you a tussle coming apart at times.

Originally Posted by Earl49

I have the Stew-Mac over sized end pin button - bought three of 'em as soon as I learned of them. It works great to retain the strap, but I almost have to leave the strap on all the time. If you loosen and tighten it very much, it also loosens the nut holding the pre-amp in the end pin hole. About every third time, I've had to get some pliers and tighten it back down again. I don't want to over-tighten the pre-amp nut to help avoid the issue. So I'm still looking......

Earl, you can't actually, "over tighten" the retaining nut on the output jack, since all you're doing is compressing the wood. You'd have to go a long way before the nut or jack would strip.

So, as is being suggested throughout the thread, clean up the jack parts with a full strength Isoprophyl alcohol, allow the parts to dry completely, and put a small drop of Loctite 242 (blue) on the threads. Assemble snuggly, and stop worrying about it.

Even it the parts were to appear a bit loose due to wood shrinkage from a bad spell of low humidity, the jack nut wouldn't loosen.