Most overrated tonewood?

[Guitar1083]

Plywood....

[Wade Hampton]

After I wrote that anyone who "just doesn't get koa" just hasn't played enough koa guitars, Bowie wrote:

Originally Posted by Bowie

Some people just think it's a mediocre sounding tone wood. Not everyone has the same tastes and dismissing that is very close minded.

Bowie, I have very eclectic tastes, and try hard to understand viewpoints and opinions that I myself don't hold. But I stand by what I wrote: when all the stars align perfectly and the elements come together, koa is one of the very finest tonewoods that there IS.

I can understand not being a fan of particular tonewoods: I'm not especially enthralled with Brazilian rosewood, which is the heresy of heresy to some folks, and maple remains a case-by-case guitar wood for me.

So I have no problem with people who HAVE played some great koa guitars and say: "Well, I can see the appeal for some players, but it doesn't do what I want a tonewood to do." That's fine.

But if all somebody has played are a few mediocre koa guitars and they then get on a forum like this one to sneer at it and claim that it's nothing but eye candy for dorks with more money than musical taste, I actually DO have a problem with that. Because, quite frankly, they don't have the breadth of experience to be making that kind of statement.

I'm not referring to anyone who's posted in this thread, so don't assume that I am. But I have seen plenty of ignorant statements along those lines on this forum and elsewhere.

Note that I wrote "ignorant" rather than "stupid." Ignorance implies lack of knowledge rather than slow mental processes.

For years I avoided all Gibson acoustic guitars like I would herpes, and I made some rude and, yes, ignorant statements about the acoustic guitars coming out of Bozeman, Montana without having given any of them a fair chance to change my mind.

Then Fred "J-185-4ME" Shrimer sat me down and handed me one outstanding acoustic guitar after another after another from his collection, all of which happened to have the name "Gibson" on their headstocks. I realized what a complete and utter dork I'd been on the topic. I was completely ignorant of the profound positive changes that had been made to the acoustic guitar-building process at that company.

Fred helped me correct that attitude of mine by curing me of my ignorance.

So not everyone has to LIKE koa as a tonewood, and frankly, I'd just as soon they didn't, because that leaves more of the good stuff for those of us who appreciate it.

But to believe and argue and post online that it's a CRAPPY tonewood is a statement made from ignorance, not personal preference. I would never argue that Brazilian rosewood is a crappy tonewood, even though I don't care for it for my own playing. I know better than that.

Koa is one of the classic tonewoods, and has rightly been considered one since the 1920's. To argue otherwise is to show the closed-mindedness you've accused me of.

Originally Posted by Bowie

There's a lot of great guitars made of it, but not everyone has to like koa itself.

Agreed. But let's not imply or insist that it's somehow inferior and the favorite of people with visually-influenced preferences who can't actually hear what they're doing.


Wade Hampton Miller

[Sixfir]

Rosewood, lack some mids, often have some overwhelming basses, and metallic/thin trebles,it is not good for all purposes in my opinion

[MBE]

Originally Posted by Bruce Sexauer

Who knew we were talking about "factory built"? To get to the subtlety and potential of tonewood's "differences", you pretty much have to let go of production guitars as they are much more homogeneous. The magic usually requires, well, a magician!

I agree with this wholeheartedly.

EIR guitars with prominent and complex midrange. Maple guitars overflowing with warmth and bass. Mahogany guitars with overtones for days. These are all achievable by a talented luthier.

[ikravchik]

Originally Posted by Sixfir

Rosewood, lack some mids, often have some overwhelming basses, and metallic/thin trebles,it is not good for all purposes in my opinion

That's a pretty accurate description of what Rosewood sounds like to me. Although lately I have really warmed up to it because it has character, kind of like rich red wine

[dneal]

Originally Posted by Wade Hampton

Agreed. Anyone who "just doesn't get koa" just hasn't played enough koa guitars.


whm

What does that say about the wood, if you have to play a bunch of guitars made with it to "get it" or find a really good one?

I don't think it's a bad or over-rated wood. The "good" examples I've played were hand-builts (specifically Froggy and Goodall), which reinforces Bruce Sexauer's builder argument.

I wonder if there is simply a lot of variation in the wood (as opposed to rosewood or mahogany, which is pretty predictable), or if it demands more attention to optimize the results.

I haven't found one I liked enough to buy (but admittedly I prefer rosewood). It certainly is pretty.

[Wade Hampton]

Originally Posted by dneal

What does that say about the wood, if you have to play a bunch of guitars made with it to "get it" or find a really good one?

From a musical standpoint, koa can be very erratic from one set of wood to the next, which none of us who are fond of it have ever denied. In fact, if you go back and look at just about any thread about koa I've ever contributed to, I've said as much.

Originally Posted by dneal

I wonder if there is simply a lot of variation in the wood (as opposed to rosewood or mahogany, which is pretty predictable), or if it demands more attention to optimize the results..

Yes to both of those questions and - again - this isn't something anyone's trying to hide. Koa can vary in density by an enormous degree.

Look, if a player has played a few koa instruments and never found one that was to his or her liking, I realize that from a practical standpoint most people aren't going to continue to keep trying them out. I was that way about Gibson J-200's - all that I'd ever encountered were flabby-sounding, sort of the musical equivalent of tapioca pudding.

So after negative experiences with more than a couple I never tried them out when I'd see them in music stores.

It took someone putting a great one in my hands while saying "Listen to THIS one!" that made me realize I'd stereotyped all of those guitars, and that there some great ones out there. Prior to that, I wouldn't have let myself be convinced by any Gibson jumbo enthusiasts, because I was convinced I "knew" better.

But I didn't really know.

Same thing here with koa.


whm

[Mbroady]

Originally Posted by Bowie

Just because I think cheddar cheese is disgusting doesn't mean anyone needs to be offended or that they need to defend cheddar.

It's not the cheese but the cheese maker.