Is a 'quack free' UST feasible?

[sam.spoons]

I dislike most UST pickups 'cos of that horrible spiky/quacky sound when you dig in a little bit. My Loar mando with a Fishman bridge does it a bit but is not too bad, my Selmer style with a BigTone sounds fantastic and is totally quack free (both into the desk via an Orchid DI or straight into the HiZ inputs of my Roland AC33 or AER Compact 60/2). Both of the latter have passive pickups encapsulated in the floating bridge. I'm trying not to add the complexity of an external preamp. Any ideas?

[elroyjetsn]

I've been using Teflon tape (used for plumbing). There are several grades and the pink seems to be just right. Thicker makes easier to handle.

I just cut a piece half inch longer than the saddle and lay it flat centered over the bridge slot and push the saddle in place.

Don't know of anyone else doing this.... My theory is that the saddle moves more freely in the slot instead of binding due to string pressure and tight fit. So the vibrations flow more freely to the piezo. I just trim off the excess as needed.

[jseth]

sam;

My edperience with USTs tells me that it MAY be possible... I had the Fishman Matrix Acoustic Natural UST in both my Mark Angus 6 and 12 string guitar for a long while during a period where I was truly making my living from playing music live...

Never heard a quack through any system through which I played, and certainly not my old PA ( EV Sx200 / Mackie VLZ 1202 mixer / Crown PowerBase II amp ). I consistently received a LOT of compliments on my guitar's tone...

It was not until I got my Bose L1 system that I ever heard anything resembling a "quack" from my guitars... and I don't believe that it's the fault of the Bose system.

Attack strength has a LOT to do with how much a UST will make that horrible sound; I tend to have a light to medium attack strength, just based on what I see and hear other players doing. Funny thing, that Bose sounds SO GOOD that I was actually relaxing and "digging in" a bit more than normal, and that's when the quack showed up!

I now have the Baggs Anthem SL in both those guitars, and I like the tone a whole lot, even though it is vastly different from those old Acoustic Matrix pickups... however, the Anthem DOES have a UST portion of the pickup; it is the Baggs Element, and there is a crossover in the internal preamp that only send low frequencies to the Element (140 hz. and below), with a little "bleed-through" from higher frequencies... but the mids and highs are mostly reproduced by the little True-Mic portion of the pickup, which attaches to the bridgeplate. I don't seem to get any sort of quacking with the Element in it's current "assignment" of tones...

I have heard MARVELOUS things about the Highlander, and I've heard them for decades now... perhaps someone who uses one will chime in about any "quacking"...

[rhancox]

If you listen to the folks at Radial Engineering, having a 5 to 10 meg ohm input will flatten out the spikes that normally occur with piezo transducers (like a UST or SBT). The typical input of a DI is around 1 meg ohm.

I'm no engineer and I'm only repeating Radial's marketing spiel. I just got their Stagebug SB-4 DI, which is designed for passive piezo pickups and it made a difference to these ears. Maybe they're on to something.

[fazool]

Piezo quack grates on me like nails on a chalkboard, or chewing on tinfoil. And given how much I love acoustic guitar sound, that's frustrating because I hear it so much and I guess makes me even more sensitive to it.

I'm surprised just how many people are OK with quack or maybe "nose blind" to it. I've gone to concerts where the quack is really nasty and it really degraded the experience, for me at least.

Unless an expert really sets it up right, a USE/SBT pickup is the exact opposite of what an acoustic guitar is supposed to sound like (to me).

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by sam.spoons

I dislike most UST pickups 'cos of that horrible spiky/quacky sound when you dig in a little bit.

Hi Sam…
Sounds like you are exploring a way to make inferior sounding pickups more tolerable so you don't have to go to the work of carrying an external preamp.

I personally recommend you pursue the best sound you can get at a reasonable price even if it requires a bit of new thinking and work to accomplish it. You'll sound better and be happier.

There is a K&K single source built-in pickup kit available now for guitars. They make a mandolin version, but I don't thing that's available for internal kits.

The best sounding mandolin, string bass, and guitar single source pickups I've heard at a reasonable price are K&K. They are easy to mix, and can be used passively, or you can add preamps.

K&K build sensors for about everything acoustic (including orchestral strings) and have the reputation to back the quality.

K&K pickups are superior to the cheap brands of similar looking pickups. The K&K have hotter output, better headroom, and expanded tone compared to the cheap models.

There is a reason so many people use them professionally, and rely on them for years. They are pretty much maintenance free, and durable. I've had them in my guitars for over a decade with zero failures. And I've never heard of one failing locally.

[tochiro]

A friend of mine has a Dtar Wavelength in his Guild D55 and there's no quack at all. He spent time finding the right Eq on the mixing desk so that he really has a great sound. I was really impressed when I heard it - Very natural sounding, bright and warm at the same time.

[dberkowitz]

Rick Turner seems to think the answer to this question is no. At least not with todays piezo materials. He's said its something to do with the transients at the bridge and the speed at which the material converts mechanical to electrical current that produces the tell tale quack.

[guitaniac]

I think Rick Turner is right. Even my beloved PUTW I/O UST and the much-respected DTAR Wavelength give me those crispty critters (the sound of crinkling cellophane) when I record them directly. In the context of running through a PA system, however, they both sound pretty good, especially the I/O UST (which is nearly as top-responsive as the K&K Pure Mini SBT).

While I prefer the Anthem SL system to any of the USTs which I've tried, I can observe that the two USTs mentioned are easier to EQ to my satisfaction. They both just need a mild mid cut from my Platinum preamp's sweepable midrange. I'm having to use a graphic EQ pedal to get the best from the Anthem SL rig.

[Ed-in-Ohio]

Originally Posted by tochiro

A friend of mine has a Dtar Wavelength in his Guild D55 and there's no quack at all. He spent time finding the right Eq on the mixing desk so that he really has a great sound. I was really impressed when I heard it - Very natural sounding, bright and warm at the same time.

I have the DTar Wave-Length Load-and-Lock VT (with volume and tone module) in my J-50. I play directly (no preamp) into my Carvin AG200 with the guitar's tone turned back to about 80%. On the amp I set the treble and mids flat, and boost the bass a touch (2:00). No hint of quack. I agree with tochiro, the tone is natural, bright, and warm. Also, the Wave-Length picks up right hand dynamics beautifully (better than any other pickup I've played).

It does not provide a perfect replica of the acoustic tone, but I actually really like the tone it does provides. I think it is a very desirable and interesting amplified acoustic tone. I prefer it to the tone I get with my K&K equipped guitars for most applications.

[SalFromChatham]

My Fishman Aura Spectrum is a great aid in dialing back the quack. Experiment with the images. Experiment with the blend between the image and the guitar's pickup. Roll off some treble. I am pleased with my sound.