Cure For "muffled" Open String?

[Steve260]

All,

I have a Breedlove OM (maple/adi), strung with .012 - .053 phosphor bronze strings that is exhibiting a strange problem that I have not been able to figure out (changing strings has no effect).

All open strings sound great (clear, rich, sustainey, nice overtones) EXCEPT the high E string. The high open E string sounds muffled - sort of "dead". It cleans right up when fretted, which leads me to believe the problem is somehow related to the nut. The nut slot is plenty high enough (rules out 1st fret buzz). If I apply significant sideways pressure to the high E string behind the nut, the tone cleans up a bit - nice and clear. The nut slot appears to be the proper width, and is clean and clear of debris.

My local luthier contends that "many acoustics sound like this", but I have quite a few acoustic guitars (Taylor, Collings, Breedlove, Goodall), and none of my other guitars exhibit this problem.

Any ideas on how to correct this problem, short of just replacing the nut?

Thanks for any help you might be able to provide!

Steve

[Bax Burgess]

That happens for me when, on the peg side of the slot, the string doesn't have a sharp enough/clean angle to the peg - a small bit of contact on the peg side causing either dullness or vibration. I use a file set to clear any hindrance.

[gitnoob]

Does it still sound dead if you drop the tuning down to, say, D?

If not, it may be resonance-related rather than nut-related.

[snowwis]

Steve,
Often, IMHO, too much string touching the nut will deaden the sound. You might try filing the nut slot angle parallel to the headstock angle, rather than parallel to the fretboard. That way the string only touches the nut very near the string break over the nut ( in reality the nut is sort of a zero fret)- It's kind of like the way the string breaks over the saddle, touching only a narrow area at the top of the crowned saddle. The same problem can result in a phantom open string buzz, especially if the slot is a bit wide for the string.
George

[M19]

I've heard tell of getting some graphite into the slot to make sure the string isn't binding in any way. Also, make sure that the nut slot is parallel with neck, and not skewed.

FWIW.

[Steve260]

Guys - thanks for all the great feedback! I will look at it over the holidays. If worst-comes-to-worst, I can always fill the high-E nut slot with baking soda/water-thin superglue, then re-cut the slot to the proper depth and angle to ensure I get a nice clean break at the front of the nut.

I'll let everyone know how I make out...

Thanks again!
Steve

[steveyam]

Originally Posted by snowwis

Steve,
Often, IMHO, too much string touching the nut will deaden the sound. You might try filing the nut slot angle parallel to the headstock angle, rather than parallel to the fretboard. That way the string only touches the nut very near the string break over the nut ( in reality the nut is sort of a zero fret)- It's kind of like the way the string breaks over the saddle, touching only a narrow area at the top of the crowned saddle. The same problem can result in a phantom open string buzz, especially if the slot is a bit wide for the string.
George

Well, almost. Ideally the nut slot angle is somewhere between the two that you mention. If the nut slot is parallel to the headstock (as you suggest), then yes you will have solid tone, but the sharp angle is likely to cause stiction and tuning problems. So use a suitable nut slot file (I doubt you'll have one that thin, if at all?) to cut a slot that is as I just described; neither parallel with the neck or the headstock, but between the two - maybe nearer parallel to the headstock if anything. I guess you would be better taking the guitar to a tech, it would be literally a 5 minute job to put that right. I'm pretty sure that that is the problem.

[snowwis]

Right you are Steveyam.
In trying to simplify the description, I used the loose term of "parallel" to the headstock to indicate that the string should slant downward in the direction to the headstock angle. Sorry if it sounded like I meant you should have a "knife-edge" contact point at the nut. As you said that can cause tuning and striction, as well as excessive nut wear and string stress.
George

[steveyam]

Originally Posted by snowwis

Right you are Steveyam.
In trying to simplify the description, I used the loose term of "parallel" to the headstock to indicate that the string should slant downward in the direction to the headstock angle. Sorry if it sounded like I meant you should have a "knife-edge" contact point at the nut. As you said that can cause tuning and striction, as well as excessive nut wear and string stress.
George

Point taken George.

[Steve260]

Originally Posted by steveyam

Well, almost. Ideally the nut slot angle is somewhere between the two that you mention. If the nut slot is parallel to the headstock (as you suggest), then yes you will have solid tone, but the sharp angle is likely to cause stiction and tuning problems. So use a suitable nut slot file (I doubt you'll have one that thin, if at all?) to cut a slot that is as I just described; neither parallel with the neck or the headstock, but between the two - maybe nearer parallel to the headstock if anything. I guess you would be better taking the guitar to a tech, it would be literally a 5 minute job to put that right. I'm pretty sure that that is the problem.

Thanks! I string the guitar with .012 - .053 light strings. I do have a .012 nut slot file (part of a gauged StewMac set I acquired years ago), so I should be able to cut the slot correctly. I know it should be a 5 minute job for a tech - my local tech (who is usually very good at diagnosing and correcting this sort of thing) has had 2 cracks at it, and the problem still persists - that's why I needed your advice here, so I could correct the problem myself.

Thanks again for the great information and guidance - wish me luck!

Steve