Scale length and strings

[adaw2821]

So I'm hopping somebody around here can educate me on a subject I guess I just now got smart enough to realize I didn't know a thing about.

Short scale length guitars. Haven't been around them much, or to my knowledge played any. I know a short scale will have less tension when tuned to pitch than a standard scale. So you could also but heavier strings to get the same pitch AND tension.

So here's the question. It seems in my head (again haven't played any) that you could do the exact same thing by detuning a standard scale.

Is that it or is there some other difference in the sound of a short scale. If I put mediums on and detune a step of half step, whatever gets the same tension, shouldn't that have the same type of sound as a short scale? Or are there more factors at play than what I'm seeing?

[Bax Burgess]

There will be a different vibe to the thicker strings - a fine tuning towards a target sound. Don't think it, try it.

[zmf]

I've gone through the same thought process, and have messed around with light/medium string combinations, either medium bass/light treble or the other way around. You can experiment yourself to see what suits you. I, for instance, happen to like .13 trebles, and keep the bass strings light if the guitar already has a good bass response.

One thing to consider, particularly on higher end guitars, is what string gauge and tension is the guitar designed around? If the luthier designed the guitar to respond best to certain string specs, moving the specs in either direction might not be optimal. Or you might prefer the change. I've found that sometimes heavier strings sound better to me. But, on other guitars, heavier strings can strangle the sound.

Play around with different combinations -- the only caveat being don't apply more tension than is recommended.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by adaw2821

So I'm hopping somebody around here can educate me on a subject I guess I just now got smart enough to realize I didn't know a thing about.

Short scale length guitars. Haven't been around them much, or to my knowledge played any. I know a short scale will have less tension when tuned to pitch than a standard scale. So you could also but heavier strings to get the same pitch AND tension.

So here's the question. It seems in my head (again haven't played any) that you could do the exact same thing by detuning a standard scale.

Is that it or is there some other difference in the sound of a short scale. If I put mediums on and detune a step of half step, whatever gets the same tension, shouldn't that have the same type of sound as a short scale? Or are there more factors at play than what I'm seeing?

In addition to string guage and tension the factor you aren't considering is the actual design of the guitar itself.

Various manufacturers handle response, resonance, tonal development by fine adjustment of wood dimensions, materials, design, shape, bracing, bridge location, etc.

[FrankHudson]

Originally Posted by adaw2821

So I'm hopping somebody around here can educate me on a subject I guess I just now got smart enough to realize I didn't know a thing about.

Short scale length guitars. Haven't been around them much, or to my knowledge played any. I know a short scale will have less tension when tuned to pitch than a standard scale. So you could also but heavier strings to get the same pitch AND tension.

So here's the question. It seems in my head (again haven't played any) that you could do the exact same thing by detuning a standard scale.

Is that it or is there some other difference in the sound of a short scale. If I put mediums on and detune a step of half step, whatever gets the same tension, shouldn't that have the same type of sound as a short scale? Or are there more factors at play than what I'm seeing?

In terms of string tension: yes, you could get something like the same tension by balancing the plus/minus of scale length, concert pitch and strings. However, the shorter scale would allow you reach some chord forms and added notes more easily with less finger stretch--not what you're asking, but a difference with the shorter scale none-the-less.

[adaw2821]

Originally Posted by FrankHudson

However, the shorter scale would allow you reach some chord forms and added notes more easily with less finger stretch--not what you're asking, but a difference with the shorter scale none-the-less.

Hadn't considered that. And I kinda have experimented with this some. I haven't been satisfied with the strings on my masterbilt for quite a while. Its gotten a lot darker of the years and none of the strings I tried helped. Either sounded harsh or ones the were supposed to be mellower just sounded dead.

Landed on a set of GHS Laurence Juber Signiture bronze somewhat by accident. I don't remember the gauge but they had .54 on the low E. So I left it tuned down a half step and they sound great. So that just got me thinking it the heavier strings tuned down had the same effect as a shorter scale tuned to standard pitch.

[Earl49]

It's an easy thing to experiment with. Tune down one-half step to Eb and put a capo on the first fret. Now you have both lower tension and a noticeably shorter scale -- roughly 24¼". If the strings are then too floppy or loose for your tastes, time to put on mediums (56-13) and do the same thing. This will achieve both short scale and tension equivalent to light gauge (53-12) at concert pitch E-e.

Some guitars like being tuned down, and others not so much. I have a couple that never see standard pitch, since they clearly sound better at Eb or even D with heavier strings. Don't overthink it - just try.

[murrmac123]

Originally Posted by adaw2821

Or are there more factors at play than what I'm seeing?

Google :inharmonicity

Thicker strings tuned down on a standard scale is not the same thing as thicker strings tuned to pitch on a longer scale.

Hopefully Howard Klepper will be along to explain better than I can.