Hand plane choosing today

[SnowManSnow]

NOTE: please don't turn this in the direction of new expensive planes vs. reconditioned old iron. Thank you.

I'm going to invest in a good plane, as I'm tired of going to other people's shop, taking their time, and using their time to thickness tops and such.
The reason I'm posting here is because I've had some disagreement between what I've researched online and what the tech at LeeValley stated.
I'm looking for a tool that will straddle the fence between jointing the back and top as well as thicknessing.
THAT being said... I would rather lean TOWARD being able to thickness if I HAD to choose.

What generally turns up in my research is a #5 or 5.5 jack, however the gent at LV suggested a #4 smoother. I realize the use of planes is SOOOOO subjective, but I don't see what it has to be so complicated to get INTO in the first place. My thought would be that the #4 would simply be too short to minimize wobble when jointing the ends at the top and lower bouts.

so, although I'm sure it has been discussed... what would you do... ? s

[ManyMartinMan]

Sorry mate. I just tuned in to see what a hand plan was....... You can fix that and likely get some responses.

[SnowManSnow]

Originally Posted by ManyMartinMan

Sorry mate. I just tuned in to see what a hand plan was....... You can fix that and likely get some responses.

ooopps
thats what happens when you are cooking breakfast for 2 kids cleaning house and creating a thread haha

[Gitarre]

I'm not able to advise you on which to choose however, just two weeks ago I purchased a new Lie Nielsen #4 1/2 smoothing plane. This thing is a beauty. It's 10.5" long and close to 5 pounds. I'm not sure a smoother would lean towards you preference of a thickness plane but the 4 1/2 could be a consideration between the 5 and the 4. I know Veritas makes very nice handplanes and with no doubt they would be a great choice. If you're open tot he idea take a look at Lie Nielsen, maybe give them a call and see what they think of your needs. Their tools are impeccable.

[charles Tauber]

Length can help in jointing edges, but technique matters just as much as the length and setup of the plane. Using a long jointing plane to good effect isn't just running the plane back and forth across the edges to be jointed. Ditto for using a shorter plane for the same job.

Either a 4-1/2 or a jack plane will work for both edge jointing and thicknessing. What does matter, if you are planning on using a shooting board, is that the sides of the plane are flat and perpendicular to the sole. If not, the plane won't work laid on its side, as is common in using it with a shooting board.

Long term, you'd probably want to aim for three planes: a small block plane, a mid-size plane and a longer plane. For a mid-size plane, just starting out, I'd recommend a 4-1/2 rather than the 4. There isn't much difference in size between the 4 and 4-1/2, but the 4-1/2 is a pretty standard mid-size smoother choice and you can't go wrong with that choice. A jack plane is also a viable size to fill mid-size needs, and I often use one or the other pretty interchangeably. If you purchase a bevel-up jack plane, it will typically have a mouth size that is easily adjustable with a knob: being able to quickly and easily change the mouth size can be very helpful on difficult grain. What size you prefer to use is personal preference.

In addition to LV and LN, another plane manufacturer you might consider is Wood River - good quality, good value.

[SnowManSnow]

Originally Posted by Gitarre

I'm not able to advise you on which to choose however, just two weeks ago I purchased a new Lie Nielsen #4 1/2 smoothing plane. This thing is a beauty. It's 10.5" long and close to 5 pounds. I'm not sure a smoother would lean towards you preference of a thickness plane but the 4 1/2 could be a consideration between the 5 and the 4. I know Veritas makes very nice handplanes and with no doubt they would be a great choice. If you're open tot he idea take a look at Lie Nielsen, maybe give them a call and see what they think of your needs. Their tools are impeccable.

I did speak to a rep today.. that is who i referenced in the OP . At least someone from Lee Valley .. not sure if they were directly associated w Veritas or LN

[SnowManSnow]

Originally Posted by charles Tauber

Length can help in jointing edges, but technique matters just as much as the length and setup of the plane. Using a long jointing plane to good effect isn't just running the plane back and forth across the edges to be jointed. Ditto for using a shorter plane for the same job.

Either a 4-1/2 or a jack plane will work for both edge jointing and thicknessing. What does matter, if you are planning on using a shooting board, is that the sides of the plane are flat and perpendicular to the sole. If not, the plane won't work laid on its side, as is common in using it with a shooting board.

Long term, you'd probably want to aim for three planes: a small block plane, a mid-size plane and a longer plane. For a mid-size plane, just starting out, I'd recommend a 4-1/2 rather than the 4. There isn't much difference in size between the 4 and 4-1/2, but the 4-1/2 is a pretty standard mid-size smoother choice and you can't go wrong with that choice. A jack plane is also a viable size to fill mid-size needs, and I often use one or the other pretty interchangeably. If you purchase a bevel-up jack plane, it will typically have a mouth size that is easily adjustable with a knob: being able to quickly and easily change the mouth size can be very helpful on difficult grain. What size you prefer to use is personal preference.

In addition to LV and LN, another plane manufacturer you might consider is Wood River - good quality, good value.

thank you sir,
the biggest curve is choosing WHICH type. The issue I run into when asking advise is that often experts give advice. That is a greats thing, but an expert can use almost anything to accomplish almost anything and that can be confusing to a beginner. Thank you for being specific. That helps out someone who is developing skills that will later come into play.

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by SnowManSnow

I did speak to a rep today.. that is who i referenced in the OP . At least someone from Lee Valley .. not sure if they were directly associated w Veritas or LN

Veritas is the tool design/manufacturing arm of Lee Valley. Lie Nielson is an independent designer and manufacturer of hand tools.

Before Veritas got into the hand plane business, Lee Valley used to sell Lie Nielson planes. They don't sell them now.

[Frank Ford]

Originally Posted by charles Tauber

Length can help in jointing edges, but technique matters just as much as the length and setup of the plane. Using a long jointing plane to good effect isn't just running the plane back and forth across the edges to be jointed. Ditto for using a shorter plane for the same job.

Absolutely! As always, it ain't the tool, it's the technique. Learn to sharpen, adjust and use it effectively, and a regular ol' Stanley #5 jack plane grabbed off eBay will turn out work as fine as any of the high-end planes. There's a reason it's the perennial favorite all-around model for general use.

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by SnowManSnow

an expert can use almost anything to accomplish almost anything and that can be confusing to a beginner.

On the contrary. What that tells you is that the specific choice of tool doesn't matter all that much - a wide range of tools are capable of being used to good effect. What that tells you is that what matters is the skill that is used with whatever tool is chosen. THAT is the commonality in the expert advice: the developed skills, not which specific tool is used. Don't rely on the tool to provide the skill.

Any of a #4, #4-1/2 or #5 can effectively be used to do the job you want to do. Buy one - it doesn't matter too much which one - and then learn how to set it up, sharpen it and use it. The "better" the plane, the closer it is to being ready to use out of the box. Think of most handplanes - and chisels - as kits to which you have to apply the final work of "fettling". Some of the more expensive planes are ready to use out of the box: most are not.

If you don't already have a cabinet scraper, buy one of those as well and learn how to sharpen it and use it. In many cases, it is, or can be, used in conjunction with hand planning.

[Ned Milburn]

http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/pag...30,41182,52515

I got this plane a couple years ago and I'm sure I'll die with it in my possession.

It's variety of angled blades, and its optional "rake" blade make it extremely versatile. The irons work well right out of the box.

[murrmac123]

Personally, I wouldn't have a Stanley (Bailey pattern) plane anywhere near me these days ...and that's after a lifetime of using them , and being pissed off with their design. The Bedrocks are of course much better but go for silly money second-hand.

I have compromised by buying Quangsheng planes, which are slightly less than half the price of Lie-Nielsens but a total match in quality IMO, and way better than the Stanleys.

[redir]

FWIW I've been using the same jointer and block plane for 25 years. that's the only two planes I have, aside from some finger planes.. I like the long plane. I guess I like the two extremes. A Jack plane would put you right down the middle though, good choice.

[runamuck]

I'd also recommend a 4 1/2 bench plane but you'll also need a small block plane and I can't recommend the one here enough. I love it.


https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/...anes?node=4072

https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/...lane?node=4065

[clinchriver]

Get the #4 or #4-1/2 for smoothing, it will do a decent job on joining your plates. I really like the PVMII steel gets a fantastic edge and holds it.