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  #16  
Old 12-12-2017, 11:04 AM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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Patch is a nickname I picked up in first grade. One of my friends in recess liked it better than Pat or Patrick, and it kind of stuck. 'S good to meet another one!
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Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
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  #17  
Old 12-16-2017, 07:33 AM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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Here's Dan's latest update:

So, it's been a couple of weeks.

I sanded the outside of the deep bowl mold so the fiberglass splinters don't cut up my hands while handling it and trimmed the flange.



Now, this is ready to mold deep bowls. I've got some 8.5-oz 2x2 twill cloth on order, so I will probably mold a test bowl in the next couple of weeks or so.



I would have been done with the parlor bowl mold a few days ago, but I ran into a problem of my own making. Read on.

Since I'd planned to mold the parlor bowl and flange in two steps instead of one, I prepped the bowl and parting plate by waxing them and applying a fresh layer of PVA.

I mounted the bowl so it was about an inch off the parting plate, cut the cloth pieces I needed, mixed up the epoxy and laid up the bowl. Under normal circumstances the epoxy will start to gel, or what's known as the green state in a few hours. It's not gooey or tacky, but not yet fully cured. It's at this stage that it's easiest to trim.

After a few hours, the epoxy was still gooey. Given how slowly it was curing, I figured it would be a few more hours before it was green, so I turned on the heat lamps, then went to bed. When I got up in the morning, I checked it and it wasn't as gooey, but it was still was very soft and still very tacky. So, I carefully trimmed the edge of the bowl and left it under the heat lamps until I got home from work.

When I got home, I checked it and it was still very tacky. Weird. Since it hadn't been quite the full 24 hours for the epoxy to reach full cure, I left it for a couple more hours. I checked it again and still very tacky.

Hmmm... Normally, epoxy only acts like this when it's either very old, or not mixed properly. I knew I'd measured it carefully, so I checked the label on the can of hardener, which tells the proportion of mixing.

Whoopsie! I found the problem. The surface coat is mixed by weight to a ratio of 100:11. The epoxy is mixed by weight to a ratio of 100:27. I'd mixed the epoxy using the surface coat ratio, which means that I'd only put in less than half the amount of hardener than what was needed. No wonder it never cured.

Luckily, I'd put a layer of PVA on the bowl before I started, so I was able to carefully roll the epoxy and glass off the bowl leaving it pretty clean. I also cleaned the uncured epoxy off the parting plate using denatured alcohol.

Time to start over. I waxed the bowl and the parting plate and sprayed a fresh coat of PVA. (again) I cut new pieces of cloth while I waited for the PVA to dry. This time I carefully mixed up a new batch of epoxy using the correct ratio and started the lay-up again.

The 1-3/4 oz. and 5-oz cloth is on.



I added a strip of 17-oz tooling cloth to reinforce the center of the bowl, then another layer of 5-oz cloth on top of that.



I let this cure until it was green, then trimmed the lay-up so it was flush with the top of the bowl and let it cure for 24 hours.

Once it was cured, I separated the bowl from parting plate and fully sanded the outside while it was still on the plug so it was ready for building up the flange.



The bowl is separated from the plug and both are in good condition.



I cleaned up the parting plate, waxed it and added a fresh layer of PVA. I set the bowl onto the parting plate, then put a couple of small sand baggies on it to keep it from moving while I built up the flange.



Surface coat has been added to make the flange and to build up the fillet area between the bowl and flange.



Once the surface coat had kicked over to the green state, I removed the sand baggies and added tooling cloth to the sides and flange, then a final layer of tooling cloth to the bottom of the bowl. I turned on the heat lamps and left it to cure overnight.



Success! I removed the mold from the parting plate, trimmed the flange, sanded the outside so I don't cut up my hands and trimmed the flange.



I washed off the PVA and it is now ready to mold parlor bowls.



Phew! Finally I can get back to the process of building Patch's guitar.

The only thing left on these molds is to glue on a couple of legs to the upper bout area of the flanges so they sit level.

I'll do that when I get ready to lay up the test bowls in a couple of weeks. Right now, I'd rather step away from the molding process and build Patch's guitar.
__________________
Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
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  #18  
Old 12-16-2017, 08:39 AM
LouieAtienza LouieAtienza is offline
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Thanks for sharing the process, that was pretty cool!
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  #19  
Old 12-16-2017, 09:38 PM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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And now the important work begins...at least from my point of view anyway.

Moving right along.

I'm jointing the top. Once that's done, I'll route the groove for the rosette, then take it over to my sanding buddy for thicknessing.



I also rough cut the braces. This guitar will be getting an A-brace pattern using torrefied Adirondack spruce.



One change of plans is that I was going to make this a bolt-on neck. Because the dovetail is so thin, I'm afraid that it would split the heel when I drill it or try to screw in the threaded insert.

So, this is going to be a glue-on neck, with the neck glued to an SMC bowl, just like the 1624 the neck came from.
__________________
Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
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  #20  
Old 12-17-2017, 09:51 AM
GeoffStGermaine GeoffStGermaine is offline
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Very cool thread, thanks for sharing. I'm looking forward to seeing the rest of this come together. The mold work looks really nice.
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  #21  
Old 01-02-2018, 11:23 AM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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Posts: 1,995
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I was off-line for most of the holidays, but Dan's been busy during that time. I am officially at the "try-not-to-get-too-excited" stage of the process...

(December 29, 2017)

I had to acquire a couple of tools to route the rosette channel and cut and round the sound hole.

First step is to measure and drill the indexing hole. Even though it looks off center in the photo below, it's actually on-center for the glue joint. The glue line was caused by the masking tape I used when jointing the top.



The Dremel circle cutter is pretty crude. So I decided to splurge and buy the Stewmac circle cutter. It's pretty nice, but it only cuts to 6" and the rosette for this guitar is ~6-3/8". So, I had to use the old Dremel to route the outside of the groove, then use the Stewmac to route the inside of the groove, the sound hole and round the sound hole.

The sound board is clamped into the routing fixture.



The outside of the groove has been routed.



Now, switch to the fancy-schmancy Stewmac circle cutter. (All kidding aside, it is really nice)



Inside of the groove has been routed.



Routing off everything in-between.





Test-fit of the rosette --success!



Route open the sound hole.



Route a round corner into the sound hole. This will get fine-sanding after the sound board has been thicknessed.





Test-fit the rosette into groove.



Wet down with naptha to get an idea of how it will look. It's pwetty...



Put the top into the go-bar deck to glue the rosette.



Squirted a bunch of binding cement into the groove, then pushed the rosette in all around. Laid down a disc of visqueen, then a clamping disc made from a scrap test piece.

I'll let this dry for 24 hours, then it'll be ready for the thickness sander. Once that's done, things will start happening pretty quickly.


__________________
Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
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  #22  
Old 01-02-2018, 11:27 AM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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Posts: 1,995
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One day later....

(December 30, 2017)

I pulled the top out of the gobar deck. I'm happy with how it turned out. It was easy to get very clean edges when routing the redwood. The spruce tends to fray a little bit which requires sanding to clean up the edges. The depth of the groove leaves the rosette just a little proud of the surface.



Here's a shot of the top and rosette wet with naptha.



I'll take the top to the sanders next week to surface sand the top, then thickness sand it. Then, it's time to rough cut the top and glue the braces.

Once the top is made, I'll glue the kerfed linings to the bowl. Things should start moving pretty quickly now.
__________________
Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
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  #23  
Old 01-02-2018, 09:37 PM
jmat jmat is offline
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Posts: 488
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Interesting guys, thanks for taking time to document and share the build processes.
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Multiple guitars including a 1979 Fender that needs a neck re-set
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  #24  
Old 01-07-2018, 07:23 PM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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I've been home sick all weekend, so it was nice to see this update last night. Made me feel a little better, you know?


I got the top thickness sanded yesterday.



Bowl outline is traced onto the top.



Top is rough but to shape.



Time to start mating the top, bowl and neck. First job is to mock-up the bowl to the neck to fit the top.



Top is fitted to the bowl/neck. Bridge is in its approximate location.



This guitar will be getting the same under-saddle pick-up I used on my Frankenvation.



Bridge location has been measured and hole for pick-up lead drilled.



Matching hole in bridge.



Bridge and pick-up mocked-up.



Brace locations are marked onto the underside of the top.



Braces being glued. I'll let the OBG dry for 24 hours, then glue the aluminum reinforcements.



While that's drying, time to start prepping the bowl to get the top and neck glued to it.


Continued in next post.....
__________________
Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
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  #25  
Old 01-07-2018, 07:26 PM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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Location: Steeler Nation
Posts: 1,995
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First step is to sand the periphery so the kerfed lining can be glued to it.



Soaking the mahogany reverse-kerfed lining in water to help minimize fractures.



After soaking for an hour or so, it's time to start clamping the lining to the bowl to help mold it to shape. Piece #1 is clamped and working my way around the bowl.









Filler piece made from scrap mahogany. I'll let the lining dry for 24 hours. Once it's dry, I'll remove each strip one at a time and glue it to the bowl.

__________________
Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
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  #26  
Old 01-09-2018, 09:25 AM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Steeler Nation
Posts: 1,995
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Man was I ill yesterday! I hope this virus gives up soon. I'm falling behind with Dan's updates. I think this was yesterday......


I glued the aluminum reinforcements this afternoon.



Once the aluminum reinforcements are cured, the top is pretty much done and can be set aside until it's time for final fitting.

Time to give the bowl some attention. The kerfed lining is dry. I added a strip of masking tape to the inside of the bowl underneath the lining.

This will do two things for me. First, it'll show me where to stop gluing and second, once I get the lining clamped, I can peel the tape away leaving a clean glue line.



The linings come off one at a time. I ran a bead of Hysol 0151 on the inside of the bowl, then painted it smooth with an acid brush. Once the glue was spread out, I clamped the lining back into place.



All the linings are glued and clamped. The filler piece is also glued into place.


__________________
Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
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  #27  
Old 01-11-2018, 08:54 PM
JohnW63 JohnW63 is offline
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Man O man !

Patch is my Ovation G.A.S master.

Now I need to know the back story of this Ovation parlor.
__________________
2010 Guild F47R
2009 G & L Tribute "Legacy"
1975 Ovation Legend
1986 Ovation 1758 12 String
2007 Walden G2070
2008 Guild D55 Prototype
1998 Guild Starfire IV
2013 Guild Newark St. X-175B
2016 Guild Newark St. X-175 Sunburst
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  #28  
Old 01-12-2018, 07:20 AM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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Boy what a long week! I've never shot my entire year of sick leave by mid-January before! I think I'm turning a corner finally, but it took a lot out of me for sure. Watching this parlor come together has been a highlight while I've been stuck on my couch.

Now it's time too make it more "Ovationy" than it was already...

Next job is to get the electronics installed, which means cutting and drilling holes in the bowl.

First I drew a template in CAD for the jacks. The photo is kind of blurry, but you get the idea.



Test fit of jacks.



I used spray glue to secure the printed template to the side of the bowl.



Jack holes all drilled and ready for installation.



The Optima needs a molded mount to be glued to the inside of the bowl and a hole cut for the face plate/outer mount.



Mount location is marked on the inside of the bowl.



I also marked the location of the hole for the battery box.



Holes for Optima and battery box are cut.



The area where the mount is glued to the bowl is masked off.



And, roughed up with 220-grit sandpaper, as was the underside of the mount.



Mount is glued with Hysol 0151 and clamped to cure for 24 hours. Then, it's time to start final fitting of the top in preparation to gluing it to the bowl.


__________________
Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
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  #29  
Old 01-15-2018, 03:57 PM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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Location: Steeler Nation
Posts: 1,995
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It's all coming together now!!!


The bowl is ready to be glued to the top. All the holes are cut and/or drilled, label has been printed and glued into place.



Here's a close-up of the label. The gold metallic toner really makes this look like gold foil.



Holes are masked from the inside. Time to glue the top to the bowl.



Visqueen is taped to the gluing board, just in case. Top is in place.



A bead of Hysol 0151 is run along the lining.



Top and bowl are joined and excess glue scraped off. I'll wait 24 hours, then pull the body off the board.


__________________
Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
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  #30  
Old 01-19-2018, 05:56 AM
patchmcg patchmcg is offline
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Location: Steeler Nation
Posts: 1,995
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Hey look! It's a guitar!

I pulled the body off the bench and sanded off the excess top overhang in preparation for routing.



I removed all the hardware from my Stewmac MacRostie binding trimmer to use it as a router table.



Purfling channel is routed.



Binding channel is routed. Next job is to glue in the zipflex abalone purfling, then bend the rosewood bindings to shape.


__________________
Well, it looks like one of those desiderata days.....

MY OVATIONS
Spruce: Patriot #76, 1768-7LTD, 1122, 6774, 1779 USA, 1657-Adi
Redwood: 2001-X, 1537-X, 1713-X, FD14-X
Koa: 2078LXF, 1768-X, 1997-X
12-string: 1755, 1615-X Walnut
Exotic tops: 1768-XWF (Bubinga), 1987-M (Mahogany), Adamas 1681-X (Q. Maple)
Others: MM-68-7LTD Mandolin, MM-868-X Mandocello
Reply With Quote
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