BagAmp in the house!

[FingerPlucked]

Spruce, yes you are. But you're not the first. I've been getting suggestions of all types (some nice, some not) on the AG forum.

The key differnce between last week & this week will be the use of test tones, probably 250Hz, 1kHz & 5kHz. I know I have those downloaded and functioning on my iPod. I also have pink noise. I think I'll use that too, although I'm not sure what it'll mean. (Pink noise is supposed to contain "all" frequencies.)

We will calibrate the amps this time for the same starting sound level. I'm told that it's not necessary, that the change in db's is what really matters, but it'll still be easier for most of us to compare if we pick the same starting point.

And we will make sure we have the sound level meter in the same exact spot for comparison tests. Last week I used a mic stand as a tripod. That gave us some consistency. But I didn't mark off the spots I was measuring from & then tried to get the mic stand back to the same general area on the next amp. I have to look to see how many mic stands I have at home. If I have enough, we'll set up the mic stands and then move the db meter from one to the next. If not, I'll be marking the measuring spots with duct tape so I can find it again.

[BoB/335]

Just want to make sure I clearly state how much I personally appreciate the efforts and that I have no problem whatsoever of the exactness of any of this. You guys sure sound like you're doing better than I ever would so be sure that there is NO criticism from this peanut gallery.

[FingerPlucked]

I don't think I'd want to do this for a living, but it's been kind of interesting so far. Basically, we're trying to figure out how to come up with a meaningful way to compare the amps, something more than just "My amp is better than yours."

Some people have gotten really worked up about the way we're doing this, implying that we're amateurs.

And we are.

---------------

I don't think I posted it here, but last summer on another forum, a guy was getting ready to travel across country with his guitar in his trunk. A lot of people, including me, told him not to do it, that he should keep his guitar in the passenger cabin. He said that he was going to have five people in the car and HAD to keep his guitar in the trunk. I tried to talk him into putting at least one of the passengers in the trunk. (Guitar first, right?)

But then a couple of us, me and another guy from Minnesota, started wondering just how hot a trunk gets in the summertime. I have since switched to carbon guitars and have no need for them anymore, but I used to have several thermometer/hygrometers with remote reading capability. The guy in Minnesota ran his own tests using his own methods. I ran my tests using my own methods. We both came to the same conclusion: because of the greenhouse effect with a car sitting (parked) in direct sunlight, a car's trunk will stay about 20% cooler than the interior of the car's cabin.

You should have seen the grief we caught over that one.

[Pegleg]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

Hi Pegleg,

Not being there to see how things are setup and to hear what's going on, my following suggestions aren't meant to criticize what I see you've posted as your settings for various pieces of equipment. First of all, from your previous postings, did you mention that your SoloAmp is directly facing a sliding-glass door? My first suggestion is to try and alter your physical setting by placing your SoloAmp or/or mic in a different location to try and minimize any room reflactions. Also, I don't see in your post as to where in your guitar signal chain that you have your Harmony G. Is it before or after your Platinum Pro EQ and Feedback Destroyer? Now that we've got that out of the way let me offer my comments and suggestions:

1) Physically remove the Feedback Destroyer and Fishman Platinum out of your signal chain--ONLY USE THE FISHMAN PLATINUM PRO EQ IF YOU CAN'T GET SUFFICIENT SIGNAL STRENGTH OUT OF YOUR GIBSON"S PICKUP! Plug your guitar into the Guitar In jack on the Harmony G and now run a line from the Guitar Thru jack to a channel on your SoloAmp. This will take your guitar out of the Harmony G's output mix and also defeat the Guitar volume knob. You can add a little reverb to your guitar via the SoloAmp's Reverb knob (9 o'clock max). Make sure the -10dB Pad is disengaged. Set the guitar channel EQ knobs to FLAT or center position. Adjust the channel Gain until it barely flashes red on your guitar's loudest signal generated by a good firm strum that you'd use when playing. Are you able to get enough guitar signal into your SoloAmp's guitar channel to make the Clip light flash on your firmly strummed passages? If so, try turning your Bass EQ knob to about 2 o'clock. Adjust the other two EQ knobs slightly to suit your taste.

IF YOU NEED TO OR WANT TO USE YOUR FISHMAN PRO EQ PLATINUM, INITIALLY USE IT AS A PREAMP ONLY AND FIRST TRY IT AFTER YOUR HARMONY G BUT IF YOU FEEL YOU'RE NOT GETTING A SATISFACTORY PERFORMANCE FROM YOUR HARMONY G, THEN PLACE IT BEFORE THE HARMONY G!

If you're not getting a sufficient guitar signal level, place your Fishman Platinum Pro EQ (with all EQ sliders set to FLAT or center position) into your signal chain after the Harmony G and set the Input Gain knob on your Platinum EQ to flash only on the firmly strummed passages on your guitar. Now turn the SoloAmp's Gain knob to about 12 o'clock and bring up the volume knob on your Platinum Pro EQ so the Clip light on your Soloamp's guitar channel only barely flashes on your firmly-strummed passages. Go back-and-forth between the Platinum Pro EQ's Volume knob and SoloAmp's Gain knob to get both controls in a useable-position range on their dials for future adjustments. Maybe now you need to engage the -10bB Pad to accomplish this?

2) Plug your mic into the Harmony G and adjust its Mic Input Gain so the light sometimes flashes Orange on your louder vocal passages. At your SoloAmp, set the mic Gain on the mic channel of your SoloAmp so your highest vocal level just barely flashes the channel's Clip light. Adjust your SoloAmp's Master Volume control fairly loud for the room so you can hear what's going on. With a harmony engaged, try singing a vocal with or without your guitar and hear how your melody/harmony loudness balance sounds and adjust the Harmony knob to get a pleasing loudness-level balance between them.

3) Start singing a song while playing your guitar and adjust your SoloAmp's guitar's channel and mic channel's Gain knobs slightly to bring the vocal/guitar loudness-level into a good balance. You can play around a bit with the Platinum EQ's Volume knob too for your guitar loudness.

4) If your guitar needs more or less bass, mid-range or treble or whatever, first try to get the tone you want by using the SoloAmp's tone controls with the Platinum Pro EQ's set FLAT! The way you had your EQ sliders set on your Platinum EQ was kind of shocking as your Gibson J-45 should be putting out a fairly well-balanced and resonant tone from its L.R. Baggs Element Active with all system components' EQ set FLAT. If your Gibson's pickup is working properly, you shouldn't have to adjust any EQ anywhere on your system to more than about +4 dB for the bass, maybe -3 dB for the mid-range and leave the treble at about zero or flat. Also, forget about trying to use the recommended Plaitinum Pro EQ settings for different playing styles and listen to what your ears are telling you about your guitar's amplified tone and adjust accordingly. You may find that you'll need the extra EQ control the Platinum Pro EQ can give you. If that's the case, return the SoloAmp's guitar channel EQ to their flat positions and use the Platinum Pro EQ BUT WATCH YOUR CLIP LEVEL ON YOUR SOLOAMP AS THE CLIPPING LEVEL WILL VARY WITH THE PLATINUM PRO EQ'S EQ LEVELS.

Pegleg, much of what I've written above you may have already tried but I want to stress that using the least amount of gear in your signal chain, and with all gain levels set properly, is the best action to take in trying to figure out a problem. Your feedback problem when activating your Harmony G's Harmony button may be more room-related than anything and you may find that changing rooms or your current room's arrangement will be all that's necessary to eliminate your problem.

Regards,

SpruceTop

Hey ST -

First, thanks for taking the time. I can't say that I've tried every one of your suggestions, but I've tried most, that is how I ended up buying the Platinum EQ. As far as the room is concerned, yeah I do have glass doors, but I open them when playing and the sound projects out into a larger "great room". And I've tried to "tame" the room(s) by buying black out curtains, which my wife sewed together, and I modified a couple of speaker stands with pvc to mount the curtains as a back drop. The idea was to put something behind me to reduce the refracted sound from getting back into the mic. I take the curtains if I'm playing a venue I know that will have a hard wall or glass behind me. My observation has been that it has helped when playing "out" in the larger venues but does not seem to help at home.

Having said this, I am going to go back and try your suggestions, as I doubt that I was as precise as you're suggesting relative to clip levels. And who knows, it might work! Again thanks!

[FingerPlucked]

A guy on AG just posted results from a Bose / BagAmp comparison:

http://www.acousticguitar.com/ubbcgi...999;p=1#000006