seagull yuk

[earthbender]

As most of you know I had to sell my gallagher.I'm left with my old Seagull s6 and it sounds like garbage. I'm losing interest in playing and that's not good. Let me clarify. It doesn't sound horrible but it often sounds dead. The action is so high that I find it difficult to play. I removed the saddle and sanded it down some but I don't want to go too far that I create some buzzing problems. Can I adjust the neck a little to get the strings closer to the fretboard? I have heard it said that this is not the correct way to lower the action but I have to make this guitar a bit more playable. I'm tempted to go to lite gauge strings. The thought of it makes me want to vomit. Any ideas?

[clintj]

That's too bad, I always liked how they sounded. Pull the saddle and make sure the bottom is still square to the sides if you haven't already. Poor contact there robs energy that should go to the bridge and top. If the neck needs a truss rod adjustment to reset the relief and make it flatter, that will have the side effect of lowering the action somewhat especially in the 7th to 12th fret range. I had an S6 that loved .012 gauge strings, BTW. Nice combo of sound and feel. I would try some new strings, maybe of a brighter type than are currently on there, and try a few different picks to see if the sound can go more to your liking. I would also ask the opinion of a luthier, and see if it maybe has a less obvious problem like nut or fret work needed, or maybe the string break angle is a touch too low. Always free to ask.

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by earthbender

Any ideas?

Several come to mind.

First, the truss rod has only one function - to change the amount of "relief" in the neck. For optimal playability, it should be set to allow the minimum amount of bow necessary to accommodate the specifics of your instrument, string type, gauge, string height and playing style. If that doesn't give you the action you want, no amount of playing with the truss rod is going to get you there.

Second, measure. A typical string height as measured from the top of the 12th fret to the bottom of the string is about 3/32" for bass E and between 2/32 and 3/32 for the high E. Measure what YOU have. Most guitars can achieve that string height and most players are pretty comfortable with that string height. If you play with a heavier attack than most, leave it a little higher. Double the difference and that is how much needs to be removed from the bottom of the saddle to achieve that height.

Third, determine if the nut is too high. An easy way to determine it is to fret a string at the first fret with the first finger and compare that with the effort to fret the second fret WHILE the first fret is still being fretted with the first finger. The amount of effort should be the same. If not, the nut is too high. Repeat for each string.

Fourth, a good player can make even a very mediocre instrument sound very nice indeed. Do what it takes to be able to appreciate the sounds that you can make that are independent of one particular instrument. While a high quality instrument can certainly enhance the subtlety of what can be coaxed from it, it is the ability of the player, not the quality of the instrument that makes something sound nice or not. Set it up well, then develop the ability to make it - or nearly any guitar - sound nice. Probably not what you wanted to hear.

[Roselynne]

Sounds like the Seagull needs a thorough exam and, most likely, a set-up.

I use PB lights on mine and it sounds great (to me). And, they're what Godin recommends. That said, according to Godin's Seagull FAQs:

Can I use a heavier string gauge other than the Phosphor Bronze Lights you ship the guitars with?
Yes. You can go up or down one gauge, usually without needing to readjust your truss rod, however if you use a much heavier or lighter gauge this will put different amounts of tension on the neck so an adjustment may be needed. When changing string gauge allow some time for the guitar to settle and then if needed have the truss rod adjusted by a qualified technician.

If you're using strings more than one gauge heavier than recommended, that just may be the problem.

[redir]

I've had customers complain that their guitar sounds dead and when I ask them when was the last time you changed the strings? I get either, umm I don't know, or, oh probably a year ago

Dead is a relative term. Strings sound dead to me after about two - three weeks of playing regularly.


So it begs the question, when was the last time you changed the strings?

[dhalbert]

Make sure it's humidified properly and check the neck relief: http://www.fretnotguitarrepair.com/r.../truss-rod.php.

If after adjusting that, the action is still too high, you can still sand down the saddle unless it's getting really close. Otherwise you are in for a neck reset, which is not so bad on older Seagulls if you are a little bit handy. See my travails on a Seagull neck reset and ultimate success here.

Along with the neck reset I replaced the old saddle with a new Tusq, and it sounds great.

[earthbender]

Originally Posted by charles Tauber

Several come to mind.

First, the truss rod has only one function - to change the amount of "relief" in the neck. For optimal playability, it should be set to allow the minimum amount of bow necessary to accommodate the specifics of your instrument, string type, gauge, string height and playing style. If that doesn't give you the action you want, no amount of playing with the truss rod is going to get you there.

Second, measure. A typical string height as measured from the top of the 12th fret to the bottom of the string is about 3/32" for bass E and between 2/32 and 3/32 for the high E. Measure what YOU have. Most guitars can achieve that string height and most players are pretty comfortable with that string height. If you play with a heavier attack than most, leave it a little higher. Double the difference and that is how much needs to be removed from the bottom of the saddle to achieve that height.

Third, determine if the nut is too high. An easy way to determine it is to fret a string at the first fret with the first finger and compare that with the effort to fret the second fret WHILE the first fret is still being fretted with the first finger. The amount of effort should be the same. If not, the nut is too high. Repeat for each string.

Fourth, a good player can make even a very mediocre instrument sound very nice indeed. Do what it takes to be able to appreciate the sounds that you can make that are independent of one particular instrument. While a high quality instrument can certainly enhance the subtlety of what can be coaxed from it, it is the ability of the player, not the quality of the instrument that makes something sound nice or not. Set it up well, then develop the ability to make it - or nearly any guitar - sound nice. Probably not what you wanted to hear.

I have become more realistic in my older age so the fact that I may be a sloppy player certainly enters into the factors that make up my problem. I am the type of player who needs an hour to become friends with an unfamiliar instrument. I was handed Rudy Penza's Taylor from the legendary Tree(don't tell anyone) and I darn near forgot how to play. I've always regretted not having enough time to warm up to her. As far as the Seagull goes, I have played enough guitars to know that she has the problem, not me. The intonations are all over the place. I retune every 3to4 minutes. I just played for an hour and my wrist and fingers hurt like never before. She needs to be looked at but I just can't commit any time or money to that instrument right now.

[earthbender]

Originally Posted by redir

I've had customers complain that their guitar sounds dead and when I ask them when was the last time you changed the strings? I get either, umm I don't know, or, oh probably a year ago

Dead is a relative term. Strings sound dead to me after about two - three weeks of playing regularly.


So it begs the question, when was the last time you changed the strings?

My hands sweat like a hooker in church. I usually change the strings every other friday night. I may go back to the lite gauge elixirs.

[redir]

Originally Posted by earthbender

My hands sweat like a hooker in church. I usually change the strings every other friday night. I may go back to the lite gauge elixirs.

HAhaha, well that should be often enough anyway. I really like the D'Addario EXP coated strings.