Trance Amulet: Finally installing!

[martingitdave]

You should let each clamp cure for 12 hours. I short cut the time with one installation and it did not go so well. I really like this pickup system, but I maintain that it can be fussy to install, even with the jig. Incidentally, I used foam core board for my jig and it works well.

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

You should let each clamp cure for 12 hours. I short cut the time with one installation and it did not go so well. I really like this pickup system, but I maintain that it can be fussy to install, even with the jig. Incidentally, I used foam core board for my jig and it works well.

I don't know, I just made sure both clamps were snug to the point where I needed to put force into moving them. Considering that both transducers had this same pressure, I am confident it's okay. I guess if I was really anal I could go back and clamp each individually but my tone is fine. I have read where some installers simply pop the pickups in place and call it a day. I figure what I did is probably fine haha

[Vancebo]

Good for you. I had been waiting for your review but I ended up installing one on a GS mini before you got around to installing yours. I am not surprised that you like it.

[Petty1818]

Just an update.. I finally got back home from vacation and I put the endpin jack and battery into the guitar. I just tested it through my QSC K10 and to be honest, I wasn't happy with the sound. It did not sound as good as when I was testing it. The guitar sounded a bit thin but what really was apparent was how much high end was in my signal. It's not a fun thing to do but I might have to pop off the transducer and move them a touch closer to the sound hole.

[Groberts]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

Just an update.. I finally got back home from vacation and I put the endpin jack and battery into the guitar. I just tested it through my QSC K10 and to be honest, I wasn't happy with the sound. It did not sound as good as when I was testing it. The guitar sounded a bit thin but what really was apparent was how much high end was in my signal. It's not a fun thing to do but I might have to pop off the transducer and move them a touch closer to the sound hole.

Scott, I submit the notion that moving the transducer toward the soundhole is not going to change the sound that much. But you will never know unless you try.

I stil think the lean, bright sound you are hearing is as much a combination of being a Koa guitar and a Taylor, more than transducer placement. You also tried a Baggs Anthem SL which many others love. How different was the amplified sound then? If it was thin or too much high end, I am again believing that is what your guitar sounds like acoustically.

You may be chasing an amplified acoustic sound that your guitar may never give you.

Comments are based on our 1-on-1 chats ...and my personal experience with Taylors and with Koa guitars. Just a guess. Not saying I'm right. Certainly food for thought.

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by Groberts

Scott, I submit the notion that moving the transducer toward the soundhole is not going to change the sound that much. But you will never know unless you try.

I stil think the lean, bright sound you are hearing is as much a combination of being a Koa guitar and a Taylor, more than transducer placement. You also tried a Baggs Anthem SL which many others love. How different was the amplified sound then? If it was thin or too much high end, I am again believing that is what your guitar sounds like acoustically.

You may be chasing an amplified acoustic sound that your guitar may never give you.

Comments are based on our 1-on-1 chats ...and my personal experience with Taylors and with Koa guitars. Just a guess. Not saying I'm right. Certainly food for thought.

I absolutely agree with you that my guitar is often contributing to that bright tone but in this case, I think playing with the placement might be beneficial. I was just reading through an old thread where Doug Young played around with the placement of the Amulet M and found drastically different tones. It was everything from thin and bright to dark and warm. Despite the fact that a jig can be made, the Amulet still has a reputation of being a bit difficult to install so not ready to write it off yet.

I should say that acoustically, my Taylor is quite warm and doesn't have a brittle top end. The strings are actually fairly dead right now as well. What I am hearing amplified is not all that close to my actual acoustic tone.

[Bluesdale]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

Just an update.. I finally got back home from vacation and I put the endpin jack and battery into the guitar. I just tested it through my QSC K10 and to be honest, I wasn't happy with the sound. It did not sound as good as when I was testing it. The guitar sounded a bit thin but what really was apparent was how much high end was in my signal. It's not a fun thing to do but I might have to pop off the transducer and move them a touch closer to the sound hole.

Before you go to all that trouble try going through a mixer and/or preamp. Although the TA has a small preamp, it will sound much fuller going through another one. Most mixers run the signal though a mic preamp and it will fatten up your sound a lot.

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by Bluesdale

Before you go to all that trouble try going through a mixer and/or preamp. Although the TA has a small preamp, it will sound much fuller going through another one. Most mixers run the signal though a mic preamp and it will fatten up your sound a lot.

Oh absolutely. I need to put in a new saddle to match my old height (just put a shim under my current one for now), and then run it through my grace design Felix and into my full pa. If that still sounds off, I will slightly move the transducers towards the sound hole.

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

Oh absolutely. I need to put in a new saddle to match my old height (just put a shim under my current one for now), and then run it through my grace design Felix and into my full pa. If that still sounds off, I will slightly move the transducers towards the sound hole.

Did you get the Trance M-VT option? That's what I have and have recommended to anyone thinking about a Trance M system. Getting a warm tone with the M-VT option is as easy as turning the Tonewheel until you hear the tonal balance you want, which is usually just a small arc of wheel turn away from the Bass end of the Tonewheel's travel. From the extreme treble end of its travel, the Tonewheel has a gradually decreasing treble tonal curve that becomes a quickly decreasing treble-curve toward the Bass end of travel.

[Andy Howell]

Sounds like a preamp with decent eq is needed!

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by Andy Howell

Sounds like a preamp with decent eq is needed!

More experimentation is definitely required before I move the transducers. I am not sure if a preamp would make that much of a difference but you never know.

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

More experimentation is definitely required before I move the transducers. I am not sure if a preamp would make that much of a difference but you never know.

Scott, is the Element UST from your Anthem SL system still installed in your Taylor so as to maintain your saddle height? CORRECTION: Afer rerading an earlier comment, I see you've installed a temporary shim after removing the Element UST. At any rate, I just remembered that Gary Hull recommends not having a UST in the vibrational path between the strings and bridge and top, and that's why he's never marketed a Amulet/UST combo system.

You should not need any other preamp in your signal chain to try to make your Trance system sound good and any additional slight tonal coloration can likely be done with your mixer or amp's EQ controls. As with any pickup system, if you're playing in a "problem" room, then a parametric EQ device may be necessary to remove problem frequencies.

[MaurysMusic]

If you're certain you allowed each lens to bond to the bridgeplate - one at a time for 12 hours under clamp pressure - then yes the next step for warmth is to move them closer to the soundhole. Ideally some of the lens should still be under the saddle line. Most of the time, a bright sound lacking bass is due to insufficient clamp time. The times I've done re-installs for customers, my efforts in clamping for 12 hrs were the solution. As mentioned above, the VT control will need to be dialed backwards a bit for warmth. Having the VT wide open adds some treble (in my professional experience).

[Charmed Life Picks]

Originally Posted by MaurysMusic

If you're certain you allowed each lens to bond to the bridgeplate - one at a time for 12 hours under clamp pressure - then yes the next step for warmth is to move them closer to the soundhole. Ideally some of the lens should still be under the saddle line. Most of the time, a bright sound lacking bass is due to insufficient clamp time. The times I've done re-installs for customers, my efforts in clamping for 12 hrs were the solution. As mentioned above, the VT control will need to be dialed backwards a bit for warmth. Having the VT wide open adds some treble (in my professional experience).

Great stuff, Maury, thanks, as always.

scott

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

Did you get the Trance M-VT option? That's what I have and have recommended to anyone thinking about a Trance M system. Getting a warm tone with the M-VT option is as easy as turning the Tonewheel until you hear the tonal balance you want, which is usually just a small arc of wheel turn away from the Bass end of the Tonewheel's travel. From the extreme treble end of its travel, the Tonewheel has a gradually decreasing treble tonal curve that becomes a quickly decreasing treble-curve toward the Bass end of travel.

I just got the standard version without the volume and tone control. I remember reading online where some people found that the tone and volume controls impacted the tone a bit. I didn't read too much into that, I just wanted a simplified version. However, I do kind of miss a volume control.