Would any of you be interested Inandolins produced by Taylor

[pickinguy]

I'd love to see what they could do with mandolins as they seem, at least in my opinion, to produce some of the most consistently easy playing and well made guitars on the market.

Thoughts?

[HHP]

Different skill set required. Probably not enough market available to make it worthwhile.

[blue]

Originally Posted by HHP

Different skill set required. Probably not enough market available to make it worthwhile.

Yeah. Ukes are easy for a guitar builder. And they only dipped their toe into that pool. Mandolins? It would be just like the amp business. Starting over from the ground up.

[Teleman52]

Originally Posted by HHP

Different skill set required. Probably not enough market available to make it worthwhile.

Very correct. It takes ALOT longer to build a mandolin than a guitar and a lot more skill.

Bill Collings was able to get into it because he happened to share a workshop. He learned alot from him and also has MUCH more skilled craftsman than taylor has.

You can't really build a mandolin with an assembly line like you can with guitars. It takes a lot more handwork than guitars do. I mean, yeah you CAN build them like that, but it will be very obvious. Even the pac rim builders build their mandolins have a lot of handwork go into them.

I'm not saying taylor couldn't do it, but I think it would be a lot of work and money to spend for a small reward. I don't think it would be worth it for Taylor. It would require all new tooling and new employees. And i don't think there would be that much demand

[Wade Hampton]

Well, enough cold water has been thrown on the idea on this thread already, but I have to ask: what prompted this discussion, pickinguy? Has Taylor publicly announced they'll be marketing mandolins, or is this simply a blue sky "gee, wouldn't it be great if..." kind of thread?

Not that I have any objections to that, mind you. I'm just curious.

As others who've posted in this thread have pointed out already, when it comes to construction expertise, mandolins and guitars aren't as closely related as they might appear to the casual observer. The Tacoma Guitar Company attempted to market flattop mandolins as part of their product line, and they were okay, for what they were.

But for longtime mandolinists like me, (I started playing mandolin a few years before taking up guitar,) the Tacoma mandolins were basically mandolins aimed at guitarplayers looking for a guitar-like second instrument to have around the music room, not serious instruments for serious mandolinplayers. The Tacoma mandolins sound fine for what they are, but they don't have the projection to cut through in a noisy and boisterous acoustic ensemble like the typical bluegrass band.

Ovation came out with mandolins in the early 1990's, and back then I was eager to get my hands on one to try out, thinking that maybe they'd be a great stage-ready acoustic-electric instrument. But when I finally did get a chance to play a couple of them, they were disappointing, both acoustically and plugged-in.

The long and the short of it is that mandolins play a considerably different musical role than guitars do, and making good ones is not simply a matter of making scaled-down eight string guitars.....

As for playability, getting a decent setup right at the start is essential. With mandolin it's even more crucial than with guitar, simply because the mandolin is smaller and everything is so much closer together. So a gap or a slightly misplaced bridge position that wouldn't make an audible difference on a guitar will make a huge, HOWLING difference on a mandolin. They're considerably less forgiving in that regard than acoustic guitars are.

But presuming that the neckset geometry is correct and the bridge is placed correctly, any mechanically sound mandolin can be made to play properly.

Short version: I'd be interested to play any Taylor mandolins that happened to cross my path, but I don't see where their skill set at making fine mass-produced flattop acoustic guitars would necessarily translate to the same level of success making fine archtop mandolins.

But I'd love to be proven wrong on that....

Hope that makes sense.


Wade Hampton Miller

[pickinguy]

First, I am ashamed of the spelling in the title of the thread I started here, a thank you goes out to those who were kind enough not to bring it up.

To the issue:
I was considering expanding my own business to offer different services, within the same industry but different enough from what I already do that I was thinking of all that would be involved. As guitars/mandolins music are always somewhere in the back of my mind I started thinking about Collings instruments and the workings of that company, how they grew and the direction they are going. Then I started thinking about Andy Powers at Taylor and the experience he has building mandolins and archtop guitars. I thought about the fact that every Taylor I have has been consistent in quality and how they are changing as a company right now and I wondered if the issue has been discussed within the company somewhere given the influence Andy now seems to wield.

Basically a "blue sky" thread....

[HHP]

Originally Posted by pickinguy

First, I am ashamed of the spelling in the title of the thread I started here, a thank you goes out to those who were kind enough not to bring it up.

To the issue:
I was considering expanding my own business to offer different services, within the same industry but different enough from what I already do that I was thinking of all that would be involved. As guitars/mandolins music are always somewhere in the back of my mind I started thinking about Collings instruments and the workings of that company, how they grew and the direction they are going. Then I started thinking about Andy Powers at Taylor and the experience he has building mandolins and archtop guitars. I thought about the fact that every Taylor I have has been consistent in quality and how they are changing as a company right now and I wondered if the issue has been discussed within the company somewhere given the influence Andy now seems to wield.

Basically a "blue sky" thread....

I play with a mandolin player. His most extravagant purchase was a Gibson F model mandolin. Couple of people asked him why he didn't buy a custom given the cost of the Gibson. He always replied that if he had a custom, and people asked what he paid for it, he would spend the rest of his life hearing "Geez, you could have gotten a Gibson for that money"

Tough market to crack.

[Wade Hampton]

Yeah, it's a tough market to crack, and the market for professional quality mandolins is quite a bit smaller than for professional quality guitars. What's more, Collings had a couple of serious advantages when they decided to start making mandolins, the first being that - as a company - they have a well-deserved reputation for producing superb instruments.

The second advantage is that Collings was already deeply wired in to the bluegrass music scene, which Taylor is not and likely never will be, at least not at the almost revered level that Collings enjoys.

I got my start playing mountain music and bluegrass in my native state of Missouri, and it was exposure to that scene and those musicians that encouraged my inclinations towards being a multi-instrumentalist. Bluegrass music is one style where it's surprisingly common for the people who play it to play remarkably well on more than one instrument. It was watching bluegrass guitarists switch off to mandolin and sometimes to fiddle and five string banjo that made me think:

"Heck, I could do THAT!!"

So I did. It was no big deal.

So there were plenty of bluegrassers who already owned Collings guitars who were very receptive to the idea of Collings making mandolins, and were ready and willing to pay for them.

I don't see the same sort of crossover potential among guitarists who own Taylor guitars and who might be enticed to buy high dollar Taylor mandolins. From what I've observed, it's really a very different crowd.

There are undoubtedly bluegrass guitarists who play Taylor guitars, but it's not nearly as common a guitar choice for that style of music as Martin or Collings. And sadly, at least from the standpoint of Taylor, the main market for mandolins (at least in North America) remains bluegrass music.

Maybe I'm wrong about this, and maybe Taylor is tooling up to produce mandolins as we discuss this. But I don't think they will, frankly.


Wade Hampton Miller

[posternutbag]

I play mandolin, and I agree; there is a world of difference between building guitars and building mandolins. Building archtop mandolins has more in common with building violins than it does with building guitars.

That being said, I wounder if a company like Taylor could build nice flat top mandolins, something like Mid Mo/Big Muddy. I know that this is what Tacoma tried, and they weren't really successful, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible.

If you have priced Big Muddy mandolins recently, it may have come to your attention that they are not the value they once were. A new Big Muddy runs between $700 and $1200. I wonder if Taylor or someone else could produce a nice American-made flat top mandolin in the $500-$700 range. It would be the mandolin world equivalent of the GS Mini.

[Earl49]

I suspect that Taylor is far more likely to produce a ukulele before they would ever tackle mandolins. Uke and guitar are much more similar than guitar and mandolin. I believe that Bob Taylor has said as much in their house magazine Wood & Steel in past "Ask Bob' columns. But who knows? Andy Powers, the heir apparent at Taylor, has hand-built ukes for the Builder's Reserve series, pairing a guitar and a matching high end uke. So far they have not tooled up for production of ukulele models....

Rumor is that the original Baby Taylor was initially intended to be a baritone ukulele, but morphed into a small travel guitar instead.

[dgaemc2]

There is no doubt in my mind that Andy Powers could design and have Taylor build an good sounding and playing mandolin for a "modest" price.
That said, why would he? The number of "new people" that really have a desire to play a mandolin are miniscule compared to those that want to learn to play the guitar.

In fact, my interest in trying the mandolin was only after I had several years under my belt playing guitar. I ended up purchasing an Epiphone mandolin during the 90s which sounded decent and played fairly well. I enjoyed playing it using simple 2 finger chords, etc... but didn't pursue the mandolin further.

The very talented and devoted mandolin players will hold true with their vintage mandolins.....so these people wouldn't likely in buying a mandolin offering from Taylor either.

I really like what Andy Powers is doing regarding his new offerings and the redesigning / revoicing of Taylor guitars. I believe that his focus in the foreseeable future will be to continue to "redesign" other series of Taylor guitars far before entering the "mandolin manufacturing world".

I would love to see a mandolin offering from Taylor....just don't think it likely.

[Wade Hampton]

Originally Posted by dgaemc2

The very talented and devoted mandolin players will hold true with their vintage mandolins.....so these people wouldn't likely in buying a mandolin offering from Taylor either.

Not all of us play F-5's - here are some images of the National Reso-Phonic RM-1 model mandolin I helped design, and which I currently use as my main performance mandolin:

These are incredible instruments, and have a wonderful voice made all the better by the sustain that the resonator cone provides. These don't sound the least bit harsh or metallic, but, rather, sound like a really nice A model oval hole mandolin played through a good PA with just a touch of reverb.

One of the main reasons I like them so much is that their sustain characteristics allow me to play vocal-like phrases: I can hit a note and just hold it, unlike traditional archtop mandolins, where you have to play tremolo to approximate that sound. I can still use tremolo technique, but have more choice when it comes to my phrasing.


whm

[K-vegas]

Originally Posted by Wade Hampton

here are some images of the National Reso-Phonic RM-1 model mandolin I helped design, and which I currently use as my main performance mandolin:

There you did it! Less than a minute ago I didn't even know how much I wanted one of these.

Seriously - I would love to play one.

I would love to see Taylor build niche instruments. Tenor Guitar, Mandolin, Guitar body Octave Mandolin
But in reading Bob Taylors comments on tenor guitars it seems he has no interest in small market adventures.

[dgaemc2]

Thanks for the pics WHM. Those look awesome. I had no idea that type of mandolin existed!

[jaybones]

Originally Posted by dgaemc2

Thanks for the pics WHM. Those look awesome. I had no idea that type of mandolin existed!

Neither did I until tonight when I saw The Band Perry playing one on Stevie Wonder's Songs in the Key of Life tribute. Started another thread wondering what such an instrument is called, and came here second.