Bose L1 Compact vs Fishman SA220

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by The Kid!

The SA220 is a killer little unit. The L2T is just better, the L3T even better still.

Agreed. If I ever needed more power I'd buy a L3t and use the L2t as a monitor.

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[The Kid!]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Agreed. If I ever needed more power I'd buy a L3t and use the L2t as a monitor.

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You would love it. That's my current setup with a sub and crossover added.

[FunkenBlues]

Originally Posted by The Kid!

For looping beats & basslines, even six SA220's wont cut it.
You'll also need a decent sub as well as a main that can move more air.

If I were starting out, I'd look into getting a Line 6 L2T and an EV ZXA1 Sub and add to that system over time as my needs expanded. I suspect that I would blow up an SA220 or Bose trying cover most of the places that I play.

They're both fine units for what they do, but aren't as flexible (as others have mentioned) or as powerful as some of the other PA options out there. You could put together a versatile an KILLER rig for what you'd pay for a Bose.

A line 6 L3T (or Line 6 L2T) alone would blow an SA220 away without even breaking a sweat at the same price point. I do like how the SA220 sounds for solo acoustic guitar finger picking and strumming as long as you're not looping beats or bass lines.


Here's a Brewing Company my duo played last week. I wouldn't want to play with less for a looping gig. I only needed the one Line 6 L3T to cover that room. I had more powered boxes in the car had I needed more coverage.






For most Solo/Duo/Trio gigs, my rig consists of:


Guitar:
Washburn Timber Ridge Custom Acoustic Guitar (main)

Pickups:
Fishman Prefix Premium Blend Pickup

Pedal Board:
TC Electronics Harmony Singer Pedal
Boss OC-3 Octave Pedal (basslines)
Boomerang III Digital Looper
Aphex Acoustic Xciter Direct Box
Fire-Eye Red-Eye Preamp

Beats:
Akai XR20

Mixer:
Allen & Heath Zed10FX or Zed60 14FX Mixer

Speakers:
One Line 6 L3T Powered Speaker (FOH)
One Line 6 L2T Powered Speaker (Personal Monitor)
The feedback suppression on the L2T & L3T are awesome!

Crossover:
DBX 223 XS Active Crossover

Sub:
Yorkville NX720s Powered Subwoofer
EV ZXA1 12" Powered Subwoofer

Mic:
Heil PR35

Cart:
Rock N Roller RT12 (Much needed!)



Is it overkill?
Maybe to most, but it sounds INCREDIBLE at any volume.



I gigged with one QSC K10 and no sub for a few years, and adding the sub and crossover was a game changer for looping. It's not about volume per se', it's more about "feel."

The Line 6 L3T has a two channel mixer built in, and I use that one speaker by itself for some smaller gigs. It actually has a lot of low end extension, but I'd still rather set up a sub and crossover if I have the time.



Here's a no subwoofer setup for a center hub chandelier lounge center hub at a really big hotel restaurant. I like having my mixer on my left-hand side, although I could have mixed on the Line 6 L3T and just plugged the Akai XR20 into the back of the L3T.










My weekly Wednesday night duo gig. Decent size room. 2 FOH speakers and we share a K10 as a monitor.




Private event:








A different brewery gig:






Here's what I have to choose from for solo/duo/trio acoustic looping gigs as well as PA for full band electric gigs.

Guitars:
Washburn Timber Ridge Custom Acoustic Guitar (main)
Eastman E10SS (backup)

Pickups:
Fishman Prefix Premium Blend Pickup

Pedal Board:
TC Electronics Harmony Singer Pedal
Boss OC-3 Octave Pedal (basslines)
Boomerang III Digital Looper
Aphex Acoustic Xciter Direct Box
Fire-Eye Red-Eye Preamp

Beats:
Akai XR20 Drum Machine (I play the pads live into the looper)

Mixers:
Allen & Heath Zed10FX Mixer (solo)
Allen & Heath Zed60 14FX Mixer (duo/trio)
QSC Touchmix 16 (for band stuff and for running my open mic so that I can mix from my ipad)

Speakers:
Three QSC K10 Powered Speakers
One Line 6 L3T Powered Speaker
One Line 6 L2T Powered Speaker

Crossover:
DBX Active Crossover.
(Even with high pass filters on my tops and a high frequency rolloff setting on my sub, the crossover makes a noticable improvement. You can really tune the system to the room by adjusting the crossover point.)

Sub:
Yorkville NX720s Powered Subwoofer
EV ZXA1 12" Powered Subwoofer.
(Depends on the size of the room)


It might not be the most compact option, but it all fits on my rock n roller cart and I can get in and out in one trip. Setup time is under 30 minutes.

First off, I want to thank you so much for taking the time to put together such a detailed response and the photos just made it a bonus. Greatly appreciated.

My main concern was moving gear around because I am an old fart (54 next month) and not a big dude like you. Are you telling me that all I would need is a rock n roller cart and I can make one trip from apt to car to bar? If that's the case, I am going to take a serious look at the line 6 gear. Especially because I will be at Sweetwater's GearFest in Fort Wayne IN next week and will be able to test drive every piece of gear I have been thinking of buying.

Anyone reading this post should try their best to get to this free event which is billed as largest music convention in country. Bigger then Namn.

http://http://www.sweetwater.com/gearfest/

Anyone reading this post, please PM me if you are going to be there so we can meetup for a drink. I am flying in from NY for this event so if you are close by and can drive there, you would be nuts to miss this event. Check out all the free breakout sessions and what they have planned. Love to meet a few friends from this forum in person.

[The Kid!]

Originally Posted by FunkenBlues

First off, I want to thank you so much for taking the time to put together such a detailed response and the photos just made it a bonus. Greatly appreciated.

My main concern was moving gear around because I am an old fart (54 next month) and not a big dude like you. Are you telling me that all I would need is a rock n roller cart and I can make one trip from apt to car to bar? If that's the case, I am going to take a serious look at the line 6 gear. Especially because I will be at Sweetwater's GearFest in Fort Wayne IN next week and will be able to test drive every piece of gear I have been thinking of buying.

Anyone reading this post should try their best to get to this free event which is billed as largest music convention in country. Bigger then Namn.

http://http://www.sweetwater.com/gearfest/

Anyone reading this post, please PM me if you are going to be there so we can meetup for a drink. I am flying in from NY for this event so if you are close by and can drive there, you would be nuts to miss this event. Check out all the free breakout sessions and what they have planned. Love to meet a few friends from this forum in person.

I would say so. With that cart, all I have to do is load the cart, roll it to work I'm playing, and unload it. If I need help lifting anything like my sub, I ask somebody nearby for a hand.

If you're worried about weight, get the L2 instead of the L3. The L2 is about 40 pounds, and the L3 is 57 pounds. However, it's a very manageable 57 pounds because the handle is really good on it and it is very well-balanced.

The optional bag that you can get with the L3 has wheels on it which is extremely helpful as well. I bring a lot more sound reinforcement to my gigs that most people do, but using the drum machine, and octave pedal for baselines makes it almost a necessity for me to bring a sub.

The cart is one of the best purchases I've ever made. I wish I bought one 10 years ago. I have the RT 12 model. Look on Amazon to find the best price. I picked up mine for $199.21 from an online store and use the 15% off coupon they had going on at the time. I think I got mine for $170 shipped

[BoB/335]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

I'm a fan of my new L2t, and think it sounds better than the SA220, which says a lot. I liked the SA220.

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Been reading through most of this thread from the beginning and seemed to have missed when you switched to a powered speaker. Could you either direct me to that post or explain some details of what happened?

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by BoB/335

Been reading through most of this thread from the beginning and seemed to have missed when you switched to a powered speaker. Could you either direct me to that post or explain some details of what happened?

Long story short, the venue I was asked to play at went out of business before I even did my first show. (Luckily it didn't go out of business BECAUSE of my show.) I was excited about the opportunity and got a little carried away and purchased more system than I needed. And, when they went out of business, reality set in that I didn't have the time for a weekly 3 hour gig.

Otherwise, I don't do much gigging, with my full time job, and other responsibilities. I only play gigs for fun, share the stage with other performers, or charity benefits, and they always have sound.

So, feeling a little foolish and sheepish for buying a PA with no gigs, I decided to sell it, to get my money back, and purchase a small practice system.

I went in to buy a Fishman mini, but got a great deal on an open box L2t for close to the same price.

If I had it to do all over, I would have just kept the SA220 for practice. Why? Because, when I play out, I do play with a full PA, so it's good to practice with a similar system. And, secondly, I've been asked to play in a few situations where it would have come in handy. Given the number of small PA options available today it's a difficult decision.

Since I am using the TC Helicon Play Acoustic for mic and guitar processing, as a solo player, I can probably use any PA or powered speaker and get the sound I want. I like the effects of the pedal better than what's available in any of the new PAs. It's just less convenient.

Some systems have more features for other players to play along with you, more bass, more projection, better coverage, etc. If you are relying on the built in mixer options of your small PA, then the new SA330x with expandability is a great choice. The $2,000 Bose systems, JBL, TurboSound (with external mixer), etc. can all be effective.

As far as powered speakers, they work great. Line arrays work better for getting sound to the back of the room without blasting in the front. While a lot of people only focus on the features a PA provides for the player, the reality is that they player should be equally concerned with the features that benefit the audience (i.e. Projection in the room without the ear bleeding volume in front.) Therefore, given a $1,000 to $2,000 investment, I would still go with the line array design for a personal PA.

[BoB/335]

Thanks for getting back.

Some years ago I bought a pair of EV sXa360's 12" and horn speakers and an A&H Zed 12FX. The 10 FX was on the verge of coming out at that time but there was discussion on no mute and no sliders which I liked both. These speakers are fairly light (32lbs I think) but sound really great amnd etter than the QSC that I did side by side with (and lighter)

This horn I believe is 50x50 so I have never tried playing with just one speaker. I was thinking of checking out the Bose or Fishman but I don't think either will have the sound quality that I have now.

That speaker you have seems interesting with 100 degree wid dispersion.

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by BoB/335

Thanks for getting back.



Some years ago I bought a pair of EV sXa360's 12" and horn speakers and an A&H Zed 12FX. The 10 FX was on the verge of coming out at that time but there was discussion on no mute and no sliders which I liked both. These speakers are fairly light (32lbs I think) but sound really great amnd etter than the QSC that I did side by side with (and lighter)



This horn I believe is 50x50 so I have never tried playing with just one speaker. I was thinking of checking out the Bose or Fishman but I don't think either will have the sound quality that I have now.



That speaker you have seems interesting with 100 degree wid dispersion.

If you're committed to powered speakers, then give the Line 6 products a look. They sound excellent, and are incredibly versatile.


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